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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: Katsy8 on Sunday 22 October 23 23:27 BST (UK)

Title: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: Katsy8 on Sunday 22 October 23 23:27 BST (UK)
Looking for any birth or marriage records for Florence Mary Robertson Williams .
Death records show she was born in Napier NZ 1882 to Alfred Willoughby Williams, Mother:Attrill
Death Parkville Melbourne 2nd Dec 1955
Unfortunately ive been unable to find any records of birth or travel to Aus.
She married a Bertie Cecil Marsh only record is a newspaper clipping stating they married at St Andrew’s Cathedral 27th March 1905 in Singapore but once again I haven’t been able to find proof of this or any record of travel.
She bore a son Robert 1908 with Bertie named as the father. His Canadian Military records all state his marriage to her but it seems he never returned .
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: maddys52 on Monday 23 October 23 00:00 BST (UK)
The marriage notice says she was the daughter of "the late A. Willoughby WILLIAMS Esq. of Wales"
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/198587420

and another with "niece of Colonel Robertson, Melbourne"
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/9894582

Also this item about their intended marriage:
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/175408802
"Florrie" seems to be travelling with an aunt. Shame the page is not scanned properly so that you can't quite read next to the binding.


Modified to add:
Birth notice for son in 1908:
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/10165300
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: cupoflife on Monday 23 October 23 00:05 BST (UK)
NZ birth: 1882/10986 WILLIAMS Mary Florence; Fanny; Alfred Edward
NZ Marriage: 1874/11890 Fanny ATTRILL and Alfred Edward WILLIAMS

Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: crisane on Monday 23 October 23 00:14 BST (UK)
The only marriage of an Alfred Williams to an Attrill 1870-1890 in NZ is a Fanny Atrill to an Alfred Edward Williams 1874/11890.
There is a tree on ancestry with these records
daughter
Mary Florence Williams
Birth Date   1882
Birth Place   New Zealand
Father - Alfred Edward Williams
Mother- Fanny Williams
Birth Registration Number   1882/10986

A brother of Mary Florence
Walter Hesketh Williams 1876  NZ
Died 1937 Victoria, Australia






Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: maddys52 on Monday 23 October 23 00:17 BST (UK)
Just a note that the item about the intended marriage in 1905 was amended to show the correct date of leaving Melbourne:
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/175408983 (2nd column under the photo)
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: crisane on Monday 23 October 23 00:21 BST (UK)
Snap cupoflife  :D

The tree also says that Fanny Attrill was born  5 September 1848, Cook's River, Petersham, NSW so Mary Florence had connections to Oz.
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: cupoflife on Monday 23 October 23 00:31 BST (UK)
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18598062/bertie-cecil-marsh
Possible death?: Captain Bertie Cecil Marsh
BIRTH unknown
DEATH 15 Dec 1919
MONUMENT India Gate
New Delhi, Delhi Capital Territory, India
PLOT Face 26.
MEMORIAL ID 18598062

Inscription
69th Punjabis

EDIT: possibly a different MARSH family line
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: cupoflife on Monday 23 October 23 00:34 BST (UK)
https://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Upholland/stthomas/baptisms_1876-1882.html
Possible Baptism? 11 Aug 1878 St Thomas the Martyr, Upholland, Lancs.
Bertie Cecil Marsh - [Child] of Robert Thomas Marsh & Annie Elizabeth
Born: 23 Jun 1878
Abode: UpHolland
Occupation: Lawyer's clerk
Register: Baptisms 1862 - 1894

EDIT: may not be the right family as newspaper re: Bertie Cecil MARSH marriage stated son of W. MARSH
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: cupoflife on Monday 23 October 23 00:59 BST (UK)
https://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Upholland/stthomas/marriages_1863-1882.html
Possible marriage? 9 May 1877 St Thomas the Martyr, Upholland, Lancs.
Robert Thomas Marsh - 24, Clerk in Solicitor's office, Bachelor, Up Holland
Annie Elizabeth Peet - 19, Spinster, Pemberton
Groom's Father: John Marsh, Deceased
Bride's Father: Joseph Peet, Foreman in Norley Colliery
Witness: D. B. Marsh; Joseph Peet
Married by banns by: Charles Bisset, Vicar
Register: Marriages 1863 - 1882, Page 191, Entry 382
Source: LDS Film 1657546

EDIT: prob not the right family as newspaper re: Bertie Cecil MARSH marriage stated son of W. MARSH
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: cupoflife on Monday 23 October 23 01:45 BST (UK)
The tree also says that Fanny Attrill was born  5 September 1848, Cook's River, Petersham, NSW so Mary Florence had connections to Oz.

NSW birth: 816/1848 V1848816 33A  Fanny ATTRILL; John; Catherine; MN
MN: Church of England, Cook's River; Petersham https://www.nsw.gov.au/family-and-relationships/family-history-search/early-church-and-district-codes
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: cupoflife on Monday 23 October 23 02:08 BST (UK)
PROV Wills and Probates: http://www.rootschat.com/links/01sqp/
495/859 Florence M Marsh; Residence:Elwood; Occupation:Widow; Date of death: 2 Dec 1955
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: Katsy8 on Monday 23 October 23 02:22 BST (UK)
Thankyou all so much .I missed the second Trove article which names an aunt which explains the Robertson included in her name. Her NOK in Berties Canada Military files kept repeating her at the home of BGD General Robertson Royal Parade Parkville.
The family were always told Bertie went off to Canada & I found a death for him 1950 Vict British Columbia but it appears he never returned to her or her child.
Thankyou also with the help of locating Fanny Attrill and Alfred Monaghan Williams who clearly was
Going by Alfred Edward Williams which had me somewhat confused.
Greatly appreciated
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: cupoflife on Monday 23 October 23 02:23 BST (UK)
Death notice The Age page 21 (11 of 33 in this link)
https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=MDQ-9Oe3GGUC&dat=19551203&printsec=frontpage&hl=en
MARSH - On December 2, at Royal Melbourne Hospital, Florence Mary, of Flat 6, 16A? Dickens Street, Elwood, loved wife of the late Bertie Cecil, and loved mother of Robert.
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: cupoflife on Monday 23 October 23 03:11 BST (UK)
The family were always told Bertie went off to Canada & I found a death for him 1950 Vict British Columbia but it appears he never returned to her or her child.

Is this his death notice?
https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/506775990/
Times Colonist from Victoria, British Columbia, Canada Times Mon 6 Nov. 1950 pg 22
BERTIE CECIL MARSH Passed away on Tuesday, October 31, 1950, In Victoria. Bertie Cecil Marsh, of Lillooet, B.C., In his 72nd year. The late Mr. Marsh served with the Royal Engineers and the 31st B.C. Horse during the First World War. Funeral services will be held in the Thomson Funeral Home on Tuesday, November 7, 1950, at 10.30 a.m. Interment at the Colwood Cemetery.

Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: maddys52 on Monday 23 October 23 04:08 BST (UK)
Trying to find out a bit more about Mrs Robert ROBERTSON and her connection to "niece" Florence WILLIAMS, also when she arrived in Australia. Still working on it, however there is this item in 1902 (also mentions John ATTRILL):
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/145707849 (1st column, bottom half)
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: maddys52 on Monday 23 October 23 04:20 BST (UK)
Most likely - Robert ROBERTSON married Rose ATTRILL in 1872 in Victoria, Aust  (1325 / 1872).

Rose is the sister of Fanny ATTRILL, daughters of John and Catherine.

Marriage notice:
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/5861434

but still looking for when Florence WILLIAMS arrived Australia.
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: maddys52 on Monday 23 October 23 05:23 BST (UK)
I'm confused. There is this death for Fanny WILLIAMS, aged 73, wife of Alfred Edward WILLIAMS of New Zealand, daughter of John and Catherine, in Wagga in 1923 (6823/1923 ).

Obituary:
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/143201255
Only mentions daughters Mrs O'DONNELL and Mrs KENNEDY.  :-\
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: maddys52 on Monday 23 October 23 05:49 BST (UK)
An Alfred Edward WILLIAMS died in NZ in 1882 aged 32.

There is also a death of 10 year old Alfred Willoughby WILLIAMS, son of the late Alfred Edward WILLIAMS and Fanny at Gosford, NSW in 1885.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/13575155

The coroner's report says 10 year old Alfred was born in New Zealand, though I can't see his birth registration, unless it's this one (1875/11237) which has parents Alfred and Jessie.

The only births in NZ to Alfred Edward WILLIAMS and Fanny are:
1876  Walter Hesketh
1880  Isabel Margaret
1882  Mary Florence



Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: maddys52 on Monday 23 October 23 06:06 BST (UK)
Mrs P O'DONNELL mentioned in the above obit for Fanny WILLIAMS is Catherine Margaret I (possibly Isabel?) WILLIAMS who married Patrick O'DONNELL in 1898 at Wagga (4292/1898 ).    She died in 1960 at Wagga, parents Fanny and Alfred Edward. (33708/1960)
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: maddys52 on Monday 23 October 23 06:38 BST (UK)
I think the other daughter mentioned may be Fanny WILLIAMS who married Charles A KENNEDY in Victoria in 1905 (6741 / 1905). Fanny KENNEDY's sad death, aged 43 in 1928 reported widely (including Wagga) eg:
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/219693996
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/143927287
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/222174757

Her death registration: Fanny KENNEDY (10578/1928 ) parents: Fanny and "Williams".

Charles Arthur KENNEDY and Fanny (nee WILLIAMS) divorced in 1927
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/16365699
Title: Re: Florence Mary Robertson-Williams
Post by: Katsy8 on Monday 23 October 23 09:31 BST (UK)
In a reformatory school record for son Walter in 1887 nsw it mentions Fanny is widowed & has 6 other children so thankyou soo much  Maddy you’ve found 2 more