RootsChat.Com
Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: JCD123 on Saturday 09 September 23 18:13 BST (UK)
-
Hello
Normally I can read most things but this has beaten me! Please find attached the marriage cert of my ancestor Robert Scott and his wife Elizabeth Eardly 1903 Glasgow (entry no. 277). I know he worked in an 'aerated water' factory with his father Robert which I can just make out on the certificate . If anyone can transcribe it, I would really appreciate it, particularly where exactly they were married. Thank you in advance
-
The marriage place is possibly 87 Old Dalmarnock Road
-
In agreement with ShaunJ...possibly 87 Old Dalmarnock Road ???
-
Thank you both - I would never have transcribed that. I have just had a look at the churches on that road and there is a Catholic 'Sacred Heart church' in Bridgeton, which might be what is written on the certificate .
-
Publication (of Banns) according to the forms of the United Free Church
Elizabeth's address Baltic St (1901 cen has her family in Baltic St )
Her parents: Edward Adams Eardley & Jane Eardley ms Cookson
2nd witness: Bella Scott
-
Thank you so much
-
A lot of Scottish marriages took place in private residences back then.
-
Yes, I have come to realise that. Thank you. Also I think the 1903 marriage certificate does not say 'Sacred Heart' church but 'United Free church' as that is where her parents were wed. So that would make sense as they were not catholics either.
-
Hi, just something to be aware of, if you come across a really bad image on Scotland’s People. There is an option to report an issue with the image. They usually check the original and will rescan the original if required, or if it would not be much better, help with an interpretation.
-
Thank you - That is extremely useful to know.
-
A lot of Scottish marriages took place in private residences back then.
I agree with Shaun, often the home of the bride/relative/friend/employer or elsewhere...
It would be unusual to have the full address of a/the church written down, it would usually just have the name of the church.
The presence of an actual address suggests the marriage was not conducted in the UFC.
I looked up the VRs (Valuation Rolls) & prior to 1905, Adam Hamilton was the Tenant/Occupier of 87 Old Dalmarnock Road which is listed under the Parish of Barony (Glasgow Burgh) or Barony (Lanark County).
It would be an idea to check the 1901 census to find out more about him & maybe work out why they were married in his residence, whether he was related/employer or?...
HAMILTON ADAM
TENANT/OCCUPIER - 87 OLD DALMARNOCK ROAD - BARONY 1895 - VR010200467-
Annie
-
Elizabeth's address Baltic St (1901 cen has her family in Baltic St )
That's interesting as there's an Adam Hamilton, 32 yrs, Boiler Maker at 442 Baltic Street with a wife Eliza & 2 kids, Adam 4 & Alex 1.
They can be found here although I can't say it's the correct man without comparing with the VRs...http://www.rootschat.com/links/01sna/
This could be their marriage index which would tie in with the ages of Adam 4 & Alex 1 in 1901...
HAMILTON ADAM / BEVERIDGE ELIZABETH HELEN - 1897 - 644 / 2 / 170 CAMLACHIE (Lanark)
Annie
-
87 was a route point for cycling runs in 1909
-
In the 1860s and 1870s, 87 Old Dalmarnock Road was the address of the Bridgeton parish school, and of the minister and church officer of Bridgeton parish.
It doesn't seem to be listed in the 1891 or 1901 Scotland censuses.
In 1899 it was the registered address of the Union and Crown Lodge Independent Gardeners Friendly Society
https://www.google.co.uk/books/edition/Reports_of_the_Chief_Registrar_of_Friend/lG0RAQAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%2287+old+dalmarnock+road%22&dq=%2287+old+dalmarnock+road%22&printsec=frontcover
-
Can I say a huge 'thank you' to everyone. There is more than a rumour in our family history that Robert Scott (who lived sometime at 87 Dalmarnock Rd) and who worked as an Aerated Water worker in Glasgow was also a money-lender, and came across many enemies (I suppose it goes with the territory). But further, that he changed his name, (presumably to re-invent himself) which we have never been able to find out. I do believe the 'Adam Hamilton' mentioned previously, is indeed him, as he also had a wife Eliza, and children Alex and Adam.
-
There is more than a rumour that Robert Scott changed his name.
I do believe the 'Adam Hamilton' mentioned previously, is indeed him, as he also had a wife Eliza, and children Alex and Adam.
It would be interesting to know what info. is given on this marriage which was prior to your Robert &
Elizabeth's marriage in 1903, given Robert Scott was a bachelor when he married Elizabeth Eardly?
Knowing who they each gave as parents, fathers' occupations, their ages etc.
It's not impossible if you think Adam Hamilton & Robert Scott were the same person, the 2nd marriage with a different name may have been bigamy?
However, if that were the case I think he would still have given the main info. as it should be, his age, occ, parents' names & father's occ. albeit with himself using a different name on the 2nd marriage?
HAMILTON ADAM / BEVERIDGE ELIZABETH HELEN - 1897 - 644 / 2 / 170 CAMLACHIE (Lanark)
I don't think the 2 women were the same person.
More research needed & that would be my 1st step, the 1897 MC.
Annie
-
Thank you for the information. Yes, on reflection, I can see that more research is needed. But speaking to older family members recently, we know for certain that Robert Scott later went by another name. My family say it was due to nature of his money-lending enterprise which made him extremely unpopular .
-
In 1901 Robert, 18, Washer Bottle store, is at at 165, Bernard Street with his sister Bella who witnessed his marriage in 1903.
In the same census Adam Hamilton, 32, a boiler maker, is at 442 Baltic St with a wife and 2 sons.
Given the names of Adam's sons, there may well be a connection, but they are not the same person.
Have you found Robert in 1911 and 1921?
-
Thank you for the information. I haven't researched the 1911, 1921 census yet . That will be my next move.
-
Robert's early years seem straighforward I think. Parents Robert Scott and Margaret Campbell, from his marriage cert info.
I think this is the family in 1891:
Robert Scott 51 labourer b. Campsie, Stirlingshire
Margaret Scott 50 b. Campsie, Stirlingshire
Annie Scott 11 b. Glasgow
Robert Scott 8 b. Glasgow
Bella Scott 4 b. Glasgow
Address 263 Nuneaton St
Annie showing with siblings Robert and Bella in 1901, together with her husband John Nixon and young children.
Robert Snr. and Margaret Campbell may not have married. Margaret shows as Housekeeper to Robert Snr. on the 1881 census. Can't see a marriage for them so far.
Monica
-
Did Robert Jnr. and Elizabeth have at least ten children? All births registered in Bridgeton between 1904 and 1925. One early death in 1924 of baby Annie.
Should make it easier to find them on the later censuses.
Elizabeth remarried an Andrew McSkimming in 1948? All three surnames (Eardley, Scott and McSkimming) show on her death indexed entry in 1967 in Dalziel.
What happened with Robert Jnr? Do you have his death registration pre 1948?
Monica
-
In 1901 Robert, 18, Washer Bottle store, is at at 165, Bernard Street with his sister Bella who witnessed his marriage in 1903.
In the same census Adam Hamilton, 32, a boiler maker, is at 442 Baltic St with a wife and 2 sons.
Given the names of Adam's sons, there may well be a connection, but they are not the same person.
Have you found Robert in 1911 and 1921?
Well done Isabel...
Quite a few things there to confirm their identities differ, age difference being the most obvious as Robert is almost half the age of Adam ;)
I agree there's a good chance they're related & as I mentioned previously, more research is needed.
JCD...I realise going back isn't going to solve the problem/assumption of Robert changing his name.
Have you considered DNA to try & solve/resolve the rumours?
Annie
-
Elizabeth remarried an Andrew McSkimming in 1948? All three surnames (Eardley, Scott and McSkimming) show on her death indexed entry in 1967 in Dalziel.
What happened with Robert Jnr? Do you have his death registration pre 1948?
Monica
Monica, it's interesting to see there's no change of surname on Elizabeth's death indexes!
However, we don't know if there was a situation where Robert went AWOL & possibly did change his name & Elizabeth being able to claim Robert as deceased after 7 yrs if he had disappeared...?
Intriguing ???
It would be interesting to know whether Robert was alive on any of their children's BCs MCs to narrow down a possible time of his death or presumed death.
Edit...to my error above :-[
Annie
-
Once again everyone, I really do appreciate your input and can see a lot more research needs to be carried out to solve this properly.
-
JCD...
Would it not be an idea to try & locate the BC of your direct ancestor Robert to see what info. is recorded & at least 1 other BC of a sibling for comparison?
I could only find a likely entry for Bella based on mms...
SCOTT ISABELLA - CAMPBELL (mms) - 1896 - 644 / 4 / 900 - CALTON (GLASGOW)
The date/place of her parents' marriage will be recorded, whether or not it's the truth?
I can't find any positive entries for Annie or Robert, whether the mms hasn't been entered yet/missed or they were born illegitimately?
As Monica suggested, the latter seems likely.
Annie