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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: neelawson on Saturday 02 September 23 21:02 BST (UK)

Title: What surname is this?
Post by: neelawson on Saturday 02 September 23 21:02 BST (UK)
The top line and repeated for son lower down

Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: oldfashionedgirl on Saturday 02 September 23 21:11 BST (UK)
Looks like Turley to me
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: SapereAude on Saturday 02 September 23 21:31 BST (UK)
Looks like Tinley to me as the N looks the same as in Ann, but could be Turley...
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Gadget on Saturday 02 September 23 22:20 BST (UK)
On balance, I think it's Turley. The family are possibly in Staffordshire in the 1881. Different wife but a marriage to an Ann in Middlesbrough in 1890.
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Treetotal on Saturday 02 September 23 22:51 BST (UK)
I see Tinley.
Carol
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Gadget on Saturday 02 September 23 23:22 BST (UK)
Both Roger and Sarah, the children on the census, are *registered as Turley.

*add - birth registrations from GRO.

** A little more info:

MMN on both Roger and Sarah's Birth Registrations was Clansey.

Roger Turley m Ellen Clansey Q1 1870 West Bromwich

Ellen Turley died Q1 1888, Middlesbrough

Roger Turley m Ann Brown Q2 1890, Middlesbrough
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: dobfarm on Sunday 03 September 23 14:01 BST (UK)
Both Roger and Sarah, the children on the census, are *registered as Turley.

*add - birth registrations from GRO.

** A little more info:

MMN on both Roger and Sarah's Birth Registrations was Clansey.

Roger Turley m Ellen Clansey Q1 1870 West Bromwich

Ellen Turley died Q1 1888, Middlesbrough

Roger Turley m Ann Brown Q2 1890, Middlesbrough

With Gadget independent  sources & wife Ann  surname Brown and stepson - Frank Brown on the 1891 census to me  wraps up the surname was transcribed correct as Turley



Census 1891
Ormesby, North Yorkshire, England, United Kingdom

Rodger Turley
Birth 1850 Tube Maker
 
Ann Turley Wife

Tom Hauxwell Step-son

Samuel Hauxwell Step-son

Roger Turley Son

Sarah A Turley Daughter

Matilda Turley Daughter

Mary Ann Brown
Step-daughter

Frank Brown Step-son

Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: softly softly on Sunday 03 September 23 17:12 BST (UK)
Info only from 1891 census

Ann Turley Wife

WATERS, ANN       mmn SKELTON 
GRO Reference: 1839  S Quarter in SCARBOROUGH  Volume 24  Page 429

Tom Hauxwell Step-son

HAWXWELL, TOM       WARTERS 
GRO Reference: 1868  M Quarter in SCARBRO  Volume 09D  Page 340

Samuel Hauxwell Step-son

HAWXWELL, SAMUEL       WATERS 
GRO Reference: 1870  D Quarter in SCARBOROUGH  Volume 09D  Page 327
 

Mary Ann Brown Step-daughter

BROWN, MARY  ANNIE     WATERS 
GRO Reference: 1880  S Quarter in SCARBOROUGH  Volume 09D  Page 385

Possibly named after Ann's 1st daughter Mary Ann Hawkswell born 14.2.1864, buried 16.2.1864, parents Thomas & Ann

Frank Brown Step-son

BROWN, FRANK       ANN WATER 
GRO Reference: 1882  S Quarter in SCARBOROUGH  Volume 09D  Page 381

SS
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: softly softly on Sunday 03 September 23 17:49 BST (UK)
Time on my hands,

Marriages Mar 1864 

Hawxwell    Thomas       
Warters    Ann        Scarbro    9d   455    Image of marriage on FindMyPast


1851 census ref for Ann Warter

Piece   2368
Folio   107
Page number   5

Tom HAUXSWELL baptised 29.3.1868

Samuel HAWXWELL born 8.9.1870, baptised 27.8.1871

Parents Thomas, farm lab & Ann

Ann appears in 1871 census with Tom & Samuel in the household of Dixon Prince & wife Sarah nee' Hawkwell

SS

Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Gadget on Sunday 03 September 23 17:56 BST (UK)
Some of my notes so far.

I have viewed the marriage certs, etc.

Ann b. !840
 Sarah Richardson Hawxwell,  1837 m Dixon Prince 

1864 -Ann Warters m Thomas Hawxwell,  Feb 1 1864 at Cayton. Fatehr was a Samuel Warters, a shoemaker

Marriage 10 March 1877 - Ann Hawxwell wid  and John Brown.  Father was Samuel Waters  John's was Francis Brown a sexton

1881 - John Brown (b. 1838  Allerston) & Ann Brown  with s/s Samuel Hawxwell
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Gadget on Sunday 03 September 23 18:03 BST (UK)
I think this is what you needed to confirm

Ann Turley died  Q2 1898 ,Middlesbrough, aged 58.


Gadget

Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: softly softly on Sunday 03 September 23 18:20 BST (UK)
Confirmation of Ann's parentage,

Samuel Warters married Mary Anne Skelton 18.4.1833 parish of Cayton

WATERS, ANN       mmn SKELTON
GRO Reference: 1839  S Quarter in SCARBOROUGH  Volume 24  Page 429

SS

added, 1841 census ref

Piece   1260
Folio   6
Page number   6
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Gadget on Sunday 03 September 23 18:31 BST (UK)
And the Browns

John Brown  in 1841

Allerston

Francis Brown, 45, Ag Lab
Elizabeth,45
Charles, 10
Sarah, 9
Ann, 7
mary, 6
John 4
Hannah, 2
Ruth, 1 mth

All b. Yorkshire



Gadget
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Gadget on Sunday 03 September 23 18:35 BST (UK)
Ruth bpt 25 April 1841,  Allerston

Reg Pickering Q2, 1841

Mother's maiden name - Nellis.


Add - George Nellis, 65 and George Nellis, 25 were with the Browns in 1841.

Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: dobfarm on Sunday 03 September 23 21:37 BST (UK)
Either sign in or register and then sign inn  to familysearch LDS website

https://www.familysearch.org/en/

then

click this link or copy in a browser address bar


https://www.familysearch.org/search/linker?ark=/ark:/61903/1:1:66BG-ZQR3&id=GNZ8-FFH&hinting=/tree/person/details/

in the link click detail right hand side

 
and siblings of Thomas Hauxwell b 1868 at the bottom of page
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: neelawson on Monday 04 September 23 10:31 BST (UK)
Many thanks to everyone who's replied to this thread, I didn't realise there's been ongoing posts as i don't seem to get notified and they've widened the discussion way beyond merely deciphering a name to a bigger part of my family tree and been very informative.

I am the grandson of the Frank Brown mentioned in posts and it now seems my paternal great grandmother was the Ann Turley/Brown/Hauxwell nee Warters who's mentioned in posts. Much to my surprise she can't be the 'Mrs Brown' who I'd thought was my paternal great grandmother as Ann died in 1898 and I have 2 press cuttings of 'Mrs Brown' from the Middlesbrough-based North Eastern Daily Gazette, one from 28 July 1932 and one probably from 1934. In both she is named on a pensioners' outing from Newport area of Middlesbrough and attributed the ages of 87 and 89 respectively so born about 1845. These cuttings were with other family photos hence my assumption that the lady in question was my great grandmother, now she's a mystery.
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: dobfarm on Monday 04 September 23 11:19 BST (UK)
Little tip for other readers of this thread - with census surname spellings issues

Just check out a few of the inhabitants birth years on the census address list on FindMyPast, Ancestry, Freebmd, GRO or Familysearch LDS (IGI) under the different thought spellings of a surname for
 matches of the inhabitants
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Gadget on Monday 04 September 23 13:41 BST (UK)
I am the grandson of the Frank Brown mentioned in posts and it now seems my paternal great grandmother was the Ann Turley/Brown/Hauxwell nee Warters who's mentioned in posts. Much to my surprise she can't be the 'Mrs Brown' who I'd thought was my paternal great grandmother as Ann died in 1898 and I have 2 press cuttings of 'Mrs Brown' from the Middlesbrough-based North Eastern Daily Gazette, one from 28 July 1932 and one probably from 1934. In both she is named on a pensioners' outing from Newport area of Middlesbrough and attributed the ages of 87 and 89 respectively so born about 1845. These cuttings were with other family photos hence my assumption that the lady in question was my great grandmother, now she's a mystery.

I did find a lady who could match this (name and d of b) description in the later censues . However, she was b. Co Durham and later lived in Brompton.
It might be that a search for her death could be the only way to find this lady and her possible link to Frank.

Gadget
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: softly softly on Monday 04 September 23 19:19 BST (UK)
neelawson, looks as though when your grandfather married in 1905 it was a double wedding. His sister Mary Ann Brown(1880)married John Hasson, same day and place. Mary Ann Hasson died 1963. Did Frank die 23rd October 1952?

SS
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: neelawson on Monday 04 September 23 19:25 BST (UK)
Well I never, probably to save money I'd have thought. Thanks for that!
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: softly softly on Monday 04 September 23 19:30 BST (UK)
I amended my post after your reply, see my question re Frank

SS
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: neelawson on Monday 04 September 23 19:38 BST (UK)
I amended my post after your reply, see my question re Frank

SS

Yes that's correct info re Frank's death
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: neelawson on Monday 04 September 23 23:25 BST (UK)
I am the grandson of the Frank Brown mentioned in posts and it now seems my paternal great grandmother was the Ann Turley/Brown/Hauxwell nee Warters who's mentioned in posts. Much to my surprise she can't be the 'Mrs Brown' who I'd thought was my paternal great grandmother as Ann died in 1898 and I have 2 press cuttings of 'Mrs Brown' from the Middlesbrough-based North Eastern Daily Gazette, one from 28 July 1932 and one probably from 1934. In both she is named on a pensioners' outing from Newport area of Middlesbrough and attributed the ages of 87 and 89 respectively so born about 1845. These cuttings were with other family photos hence my assumption that the lady in question was my great grandmother, now she's a mystery.

I did find a lady who could match this (name and d of b) description in the later censues . However, she was b. Co Durham and later lived in Brompton.
It might be that a search for her death could be the only way to find this lady and her possible link to Frank.

Gadget


I found 2 x Mrs Brown who died in Middlesbrough and fit the age profile in the press cuttings. Lydia died age 89 (vol 9d page 676  in Q2 1935)  born 1846 Teresa age 91 (vol 9d p 884 in Q1 1936) born 1844. They're both in Middlesbrough 1921 census too but I haven't had time to check further back as i'm just about to go on holiday!
Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: dobfarm on Tuesday 05 September 23 02:22 BST (UK)
And the Browns

John Brown  in 1841

Allerston

Francis Brown, 45, Ag Lab
Elizabeth,45
Charles, 10
Sarah, 9
Ann, 7
mary, 6
John 4
Hannah, 2
Ruth, 1 mth

All b. Yorkshire



Gadget

The death could be right but the marriage (iffy) seems the only one that fits them names

A very long shot of Mrs Brown age 89 1934 Middlesbrough newspaper clipping

Charles Edgar Brown
x x x marriage Sunderland qtr Sept 1907 10a - 1296
Teresa Graldie                        (Other woman in list Alice Josephine Renwick)

-------------------------------------

Its possible Mrs Brown was Miss Teresa Brown (death below 1936 age 91) born 1845 Cheltenham, -a school teacher Kinder garden Middesbrough status single in censuses years
~~~~~~~~-------------------------


Teresa Brown death age 91 March qtr 1936 Middlesbrough  9d - 884

Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: Gadget on Tuesday 05 September 23 09:34 BST (UK)
Dobfam ~

That's a big jump - the Charles that you highlighted on the 1841 was aged 10. He would have been over 70 in 1907 !!







Title: Re: What surname is this?
Post by: dobfarm on Tuesday 05 September 23 11:55 BST (UK)
Dobfam ~

That's a big jump - the Charles that you highlighted on the 1841 was aged 10. He would have been over 70 in 1907 !!

You are most likely right.

It did pass my mind Charles age being 76 in 1907 and Mrs Brown being 89 in 1935 - age 61 in 1907 but I'm 73 still think young,  ;D  :D and talk to many couples on the bus with an age difference 10 to 15 years of age - remarried of similar age differences after losing their married partners to death - more for company. My granddad died age 90 an ex ag lab was an out and about  lively chap right up weeks before he died after a sudden  heart attack.

Therefore its possible but very unlikely as I think the school teacher was the single lady in the newspaper cuttings wrongly quoted taken for granted as a Mrs not Miss Brown at her age.

---------------------

There was another boy of Francis Brown called  Nellis Brown (Could have been a girl ? as an after thought & needs checking) by later census years but nothing info wise fitted with him to Mrs Brown 89 years old in 1935. Middlesbrough but another search by another fresh pair of eyes looking may find something.  ???

 :)