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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: Eilleen on Wednesday 16 August 23 08:50 BST (UK)
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Hello,
I have tried to find births for 9 people in a family, parents and their children,
none seemed to be registered , dates range from 1823 to 1868,
does this mean they did not have to register because of some religious belief ?
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Civil Registration, in England and Wales, started on 1st July 1837.
Or did you mean baptisms?
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As KG said, birth registration in England and Wales began in 1837, but it was not compulsory until 1874.
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Of course there would be no registration before 1837; registration only became compulsory for parents of a child in 1875.
So many of the records you seek would be baptisms, if the child were indeed baptised. Nonconformists believing in adult baptism might mean that you would have to look for baptisms 20+ years after the birth and possibly in a different place or even country. It's worth also considering that church or chapel registers could have been lost, or that they have yet to be digitised: some clergy have been doctrinally opposed.
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Yes , thought you had to register births.
thank you BumbleB, That might explain it , they did live in a very rural area.
but these people seem not to have ?
just one more of My many mysteries x
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Registration of births was nothing to do with the Church of England.
You may be thing of baptisms/christenings - which were never compulsory.
Also not all baptisms show a date of birth?
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They were supposed to have been registered from the 1st July 1837, but the onus was on the Registrars to locate new births., so some got missed.
From 1875 it changed to being the responsibility of the parent to go and register them, there was a fine if they failed do so.
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As KG said, birth registration in England and Wales began in 1837, but it was not compulsory until 1874.
Really ? That must have come as a shock to those prosecuted for failing or refusing to register in the early days then ( I use an example from 1839 when I give talks on the subject).
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Oops - we all learn something new every day, don't we? Thank you.
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It’s well worth watching the video which Antony referenced here
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=871437.msg7426627
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It is the most often (mis)quoted myth in genealogy ....the truth is it was far more complex than a simple "it wasn't compulsory until 1874"
I recommend listening to Dave Annal talk about the subject:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usNj-4eY2d8
...not to say there weren't many births that went unregistered though !
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As KG said, birth registration in England and Wales began in 1837, but it was not compulsory until 1874.
Really ? That must have come as a shock to those prosecuted for failing or refusing to register in the early days then ( I use an example from 1839 when I give talks on the subject).
As I understand the progress of the legislation, from 1837 it was the registrar's duty to do the registration, and registrars varied in their diligence and their success; the legislation changed in 1874 to put the compulsion on parents, in order to improve the success rate.
The first Act required registrars to "inform himself carefully of every birth and every death which shall happen within his district;" once the registrar had found out about a birth, the parents were required to provide information about a birth – but only “upon being requested so to do.” So the onus until 1875 (the 1874 Act) was on registrars, rather than on parents. The first Registrar General, in his first report, lamented the lack of compulsion, and therefore omissions in the register, while saying that in contrast he believed that there was near-perfect registration of marriages and deaths.
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Dave Annal's videos are good. I follow him on YT.
But he did not say that all births before 1875 would have been registered, he did agree that some slipped the net. But maybe 2 to 3%. I think the parents were taken to task if they refused to give the details but before 1875 it was the registrar and his/her deputies jobs really to go round getting info on new births, so some were missed. They were only human and it was impossible to record every birth until the onus was on the parents. I have an ancestor born in rural Essex in 1851 or 1852 whose birth seems not to have been registered. I have tried all variants under the sun. Mark Herber's book did say Essex was a county where there was a problem with births being registered in the first few decades of civil registration.
If Eileen is willing to give some names and a birth location then we can help.
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Just to add from my own experience - I find the vast majority of my relatives did register their children in those early years, whether they lived in the big cities or remote rural areas. I've only had a few which seemed to avoid it for whatever reason - and am missing a few from later dates but there may be other reasons for that (not born in England/Wales or name entirely different from what I was expecting).
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Also you have to take into account how many registrar copies did not make it to the GRO, of they missed any when copying the registers into the GRO copy book. Most of my 1837-1874 ancestors were registered but 2 direct ones were not apparently, and a few siblings here and there.
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As Graham pointed out the original Act seemed to place the responsibility on registrars, but Registrar General correspondence of the time makes it clear they weren't expected to go around the district knocking on doors seeking out births/deaths. The only requirement was that they reside in the district, have a nameplate outside their premises, and make that known (you sometimes see ads in newspapers of the time giving the registrar's address and opening times).
A complicated picture....
The key fact is that the 1874 Act had no effect whatsoever on the rate of birth registrations ( in fact they fell slightly afterwards I believe).
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coombs
Thank you for the offer of trying to find My Great Grandma Annie Moore,
many times on here , people have tried, the only route I see now is through DNA links,
but building tree.s of people with the surname MOORE, as you can imagine is taking up many years :)
and I am finding many that have not got birth registers ,also in some case's cannot find baptism,s ,
but I supose at the end , I will have a vast ammount of MOORE tree's not , not related to Me .
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Hello Eilleen
I presume from your old posts this is your infamous :) Annie Moore?
1891 St Mary, Nottingham, Mun. Ward Sherwood, Eccl All Saints.
89 Forest Road, West (In c Ivor Terrace)
Annie Moore, Serv, S, 24, General Servant (Domestic), born Gosberton, Lincs.
I think from your thread title, you'll already have discovered that Gosberton seemed partly Non-conformist and had:-
Baptist;
Independent / Congregational
Wesleyan Methodist;
Gosberton Clough Primitive Methodist;
Gosberton Risegate United Methodist.
The Registrar General made collections of NC Registers approaching 1837 to 1840s in RG 4 TNA (found an RG 4 Baptist Bapt / Burials Register number we were seeking on Anc yesterday), but only up to 1835.
Those surrendered under the 1857 Commision are in TNA, RG 8 Series
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C13333
Those surrendered and retained are claimed to be here
https://www.thegenealogist.co.uk/non-conformist-records/
But found none we searched for.
Some NC chapels closed, before County Archives really got going, but some CROs have handlists of NC Register holdings.
I did hear the United Reformed Church had an Archive for records which they acquired.
Also Dr Williams Library, Euston, London and John Rylands collected some NC paperwork and Registers (John Rylands University Library Special Collections).
Mark
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coombs
Thank you for the offer of trying to find My Great Grandma Annie Moore,
many times on here , people have tried, the only route I see now is through DNA links,
but building tree.s of people with the surname MOORE, as you can imagine is taking up many years :)
and I am finding many that have not got birth registers ,also in some case's cannot find baptism,s ,
but I supose at the end , I will have a vast ammount of MOORE tree's not , not related to Me .
So your Annie Moore born in Gosberton, Lincs, circa 1867/1868?
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...not to say there weren't many births that went unregistered though !
... And a small proportion which were registered have been mistranscribed or mis-indexed, so cannot easily be found ....
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Hello Eilleen
I presume from your old posts this is your infamous :) Annie Moore?
1891 St Mary, Nottingham, Mun. Ward Sherwood, Eccl All Saints.
89 Forest Road, West (In c Ivor Terrace)
Annie Moore, Serv, S, 24, General Servant (Domestic), born Gosberton, Lincs.
In 1881 Ann Moore 14 yrs, born Gosberton, Lincs., is living with her Grandfather Govine Sparrow 61 and Charlotte Sparrow 61, who also lists Joseph Sparrow, Son, 35, born Laughton, Lincs., at Hatton, Wragby.
"Hatton is a small village in Lindsey, the northern part of Lincolnshire. It is found three miles east of the town of Wragby," ...
Gosberton Sub-District is in Spalding Reg District.
1866 D Quarter, Spalding District
Ann Moore, Mother Maiden Surname: Sparrow. At GRO gov.uk
Mark
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Found another post of Eilleen's and this makes my suggestions above doubtful.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=860415.msg7294233#msg7294233
Many Many years ago I had so much help on here to find information on My Great Grandma Annie Exton ( nee Moore )
I have lots and lots from Her Marriage cert, to census from 1881 to 1911, and Her death cert in Lincoln in 1927.
every piece off paper she states , born in Gosberton, Lincolnshire, ::)
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You are all so kind ,
I have traced so many MOORE tree's over the years , plus individual ANNIE x
as BushInn1746 said, He had found one of My many links on here,
in fact I have just been concocting another tree, that I thought might lead to Her early years ,
( before My Ancestry subscription runs out in a couple of days ) ;D
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Many Many years ago I had so much help on here to find information on My Great Grandma Annie Exton ( nee Moore )
I have lots and lots from Her Marriage cert, to census from 1881 to 1911, and Her death cert in Lincoln in 1927.
every piece off paper she states , born in Gosberton, Lincolnshire, ::)
Hello Eilleen
For Annie Exton dying 71 yrs at Lincoln District 1927 (GRO Index) and claiming to be born Gosberton, the Thomas Chambers Exton 1875 Marriage here:-
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=860415.msg7294287#msg7294287
looks to be ok, looking at the 1921 Census, giving her age as 66 years.
However, the 1911 Census same address 10 St Michaels Terrace, Lincoln says:-
Tom Exton Tailor, Head, 62, Married 36 yrs, Tailor, Stamford.
Annie Exton, Wife, 52, Married 36 yrs, born Gosberton, Lincs.
Edward Exton, 29, General Labourer, Lincoln.
Arthur Exton, 17, Foundry Worker, Lincoln.
Bartie Exton, 15, App Boiler Maker, Lincoln.
The 1911 Census gives her Birth year circa 1859?
Her age claimed at Marriage gives a Birth of circa 1855.
Mark
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I know, all good fun is it not :)
I did some maths ;D by using the dates that the census were taken ,
and especially the 1921, that says She is 66 years and 10 months old,
it was taken on 19th June 1921,
so going back and doing the dates with all the census and the marriage cert ,
I am nailing Her down to Aug 1855 birth ::) ::)
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Birth year is 1859 per 1911 Census.
Perhaps the 1875 marriage age of 20 was overstated?
In 1881 Tom Exton is with his parents.
1. Which puts the duty on Annie Exton to fill out the Census Householder Form declaration in 1881.
1881 Boston, 1 Corpus Christie Lane.
Annie Exton, Wife, 23, Tailor's Wife, Gosberton Lincoln.
Annie Exton, Daur, 5, Scholar, Boston.
William R. Exton, Son, 4, born Boston.
Tom Exton, Son, 3, born Boston.
Rose Exton, Son, 1, born Boston.
Rose Exton still at home in 1901 aged 21.
1891 St Martins Hill, Lincoln
Tom Exton, 41, Tailor, born Stamford
Annie Exton, Wife, Marr, 32, Nottinghamshire, Gosberton.
Annie has at least 3 Census declarations of Birth 1858-1859.
2. 1891 Born Nottinghamshire, Gosberton?
I wonder if the Exton's did write that on their Householder declaration that Annie Exton was born Nottinghamshire Gosberton?
A geographical check of Nottinghamshire indicates a place called Osberton Hall on the Osberton Estate.
Any Estate Worker, or Gentry mentioned in family folklore or notes?
3. Have you found Annie in the Census image as Annie Moore, a Single woman, yet?
Mark
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Mark,
I have not found Her as a single Woman in any census , some looked possible,
but when I traced the Females forward, none were Her,
any lead is worth looking at,
will now study Osberton Hall on the Osberton Estate. and surrounding area,s :) :)
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Eilleen, have you seen:-
1871 Parish of Fosdyke
Wm Belt, Head, Mar, 47, born Sutterten Fen
over the page
Ann Moore, Serv., Un, 15, Cook, Lincs, Donnington
[Searched anc under Donington, Lincs]
Mark
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Voters / Electoral Register but only 1870 to 1872 returned for a William Moore search.
No. 2, Donington Polling District. Parish of Gosberton (Continued).
Lists of Voters Occupiers of Lands or Tenements of £12 or Upwards.
Moore, William.
Place of Abode Coningsby.
land as rated occupier
Street, Lane, or other like place in this Parish or Township, number of house - Cheal
Some Voters had houses, but the above Wm Moore only had Land, whether he sub-let to someone else, or lived in a building there 1870 to 1872 is not stated.
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Searching newspapers part of Gosberton also seems to be called Gosberton Cheal.
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Lincs Chronicle, 25 June 1875
Horncastle Petty Sessions
William Moore of Coningsby Fen, farmer, was charged with stocking the Fen roads on the 7th inst.
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Also noticed a Cheal Lane on a map and I think in the Census.
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Have you seen that part of the Gosberton Census is virtually unreadable 1871 or 1861?
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The only other William Moore was a Tailor, who lived there all his life at Donington.
Probably the one noted in The Boston Guardian 1st January 1927 in an Annual Report of the Medical Officers for the Boston District of People over 70
[Listed Month by Month, probably for 1926]
William Moore, Donington, 91 years.
He looks to be the Tailor in the Census?
Mark
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Mark,
THank you so much for taking time for Me,
I will study what you have found shortly,
just been through all of Osberton notts, census for 1851 and 1861, no Moore's at all .
also none in Worksop for 1861, just doing the 1851 Worksop,
then heading for local villages ;D ;D
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Spalding Reg District, Moore female Birth, No first name, no Mother Maiden surname, on GRO gov.uk [didn't note year]
Some Spalding Registration District, Moore surname Birth examples:
1853 Edith Annie Moore, Mother M.S. Moore.
1855 Wm Henry Johnson Moore, M.M.S. Moore.
1854 Thos Moore, M.M.S. Teat.
1856 Maria Moore, M.M.S. Singleton.
1857 Alfred Moore, M.M.S. Stanger.
Moore, M.M.S. Kent, under Spalding, seem to be Wm Moore, Tailor's children.
There were other Births with those surname combinations too.
Being indexed as Moor or More is a possibility, not checked.
Over to you :)
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A massive thank you,
That will keep Me going for a while,
I will let you know if/when I find My Great Grandma Annie :)
Eilleen.
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Found a William Moore occupying a property at Donington being sold in 1821, but two adult burials after 1821 and before your Annie was born.
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Been looking at Gosberton, Lincolnshire, Burials and this one stood out:-
1853 Gosberton, County of Lincoln Burials
Elizabeth Moore, Abode Peterboro', Nov'r 19th, Aged 35
Might be this one, although the ages are a bit out.
Lincs Chronicle, 18th November 1853
In Westwood-row, Peterborough, on the 16th inst., Elizabeth Moore, aged 37.
Not checked 1851 Peterborough Census yet, nor Spalding District deaths for any 35 yrs of age to see if Elizabeth might have died at Gosberton, or not.
Mark
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I am on to them , thank you , and good Morning from here .
Eilleen.
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Cannot get the 1821 part to attach, mentioning William Moore.
Donington
13 Freehold properties ... occupied by William Moore and others, in the Church Street and near to Market Place ...
Mr Smith, Solicitor, Offices at Horbling, near Falkingham and Donington.
Horbling, 24th January 1821.
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Lincolnshire Echo, Saturday 15th November 1924
EXTON.-On Nov 15th, 1924, at 10. St. Michael's-Terrace, Tom Chamber, the dearly loved husband of Annie Exton, aged 75 years.
The Marriage Notice was in The Boston Guardian 12 June 1875 (separate notice) and in a list of Marriages Stamford Mercury 11th June 1875.
No details of parentage and their addresses were those given on your Marriage Certificate.
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BushInn1746
Thank you for your detective work,
the last bit regarding newspapers, I do have,
I am still following the great bits you found about a William Moore ,
had not seen those in My studies over the years,
Eilleen.
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Eilleen, have you seen:-
1871 Parish of Fosdyke
Wm Belt, Head, Mar, 47, born Sutterten Fen
over the page
Ann Moore, Serv., Un, 15, Cook, Lincs, Donnington
[Searched anc under Donington, Lincs]
Mark
Surname Belt (quote) might be Bett?
Hello Eilleen
Looking at Maps and description information, it seems you have a place or village around a main street named Gosberton and a Parish of Gosberton area which included a few hamlets and named places.
A Vision of Britiain Through Time
https://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/
A search of Gosberton brings up a brief expandable description.
When the Map appears touch or click on the map and a list of map links will appear on the left.
The top link are the 1" First Edition OS (170 Sheets), useful older maps.
On the map (from the link with 114 sheets) an area called Gosberton Marsh (East of Gosberton and Hamlets) seems to go nearly to Fosdyke.
1861 Spalding Low Fields [Lowfields on recent maps]
William Moore, Lodger, Un, 32, Ag Labourer, Lincs, Fosdyke.
In the 1851 Census too (his Mother looks to have remarried), but I cannot find this William Moore after the 1861 Census to discover what happened to him, or if he married later in life?
The bapt transcription (f m p), interesting that the Mother of William Moor / Moore born Fosdyke was called Ann.
One Farmer in my family linked by marriages had 3 Farms with staff.
Agricultural Labourers often moved about a lot and relationships / children would have occurred.
A few Farm Labourers had their own small farm or smallholding.
Mark
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Mark.
Thank you for your dedication ,to My cause, The maps are so interesting,
like you say , they name other places that do not get a mention now a days .
Great Grandma Annie Moore , We will find your parents and origin of birth :) :)
I feel sure this is the area that She meant , when all ways referring to Her place of birth as Gosberton.
flipping heck , there are a lot of churches to cover ::)
Eilleen.
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Hello Eilleen
Unless Ann / Annie Moore is hiding and still to be found in the 1861 Census (with her Dad / Mother or with Relationship stated to the Head), or find her registered Birth or a Chapel Birth/Bapt record, I think you are going to struggle.
Ellen Jessop (Present / Witness) on the 1875 T. C. Exton = Annie Moore, Marriage. We have also presumed (presumptions always risky) from the 1875 Marriage Cert that her Father and Occupation at some point, was correct.
So I looked for Moore = Jessop marriages (before 1875), but came up with this 15 yrs later with a Gosberton link.
I'll post it, but this Wm Moore (below) is too young to be Annie Exton's Dad and I don't feel it helps ??? with Annie Moore's family of Moore:-
1900 Marriage, Pinchbeck, 4th July
Luke Jessop, 22, Labourer, Gosberton, Dan'l Jessop, Labourer.
Maria Moore, 18, Spinster, Pinchbeck, William Moore deceased, Labourer.
Present:- Edward Wilford ; Eliza Wilford.
1901 Pinchbeck
Edward Wilford, Head, M, 57, Road Labourer, Lincs., Wrangle.
Mary Ann Wilford, Wife, M, 44, born Wrangle.
Maria Jessop, Daur, 18, born Lincs., Fishtoft.
Luke Jessop, Son-in-Law, 23, born Gosberton.
David J E Jessop, G/son, 5 months, born Surfleet.
Plus 2 Visitors.
Not looked at G/son and couldn't find a first marriage to see if Mary Ann Wilford was married before / previously Moore.
1883 Maria Moore, Birth Index (f m p), Mother M. Surname: Evison, Reg. District Boston.
1882 Marriage, Fishtoft, May 17th
William Moore, 25, Bach, Labourer, Fishtoft, John More.
Mary Ann Evison, 24, Spins, Fishtoft, Rich'd Evison.
Present: David Moore ; Susanna Moore :)
Mark
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Mark,
Once again , very interesting find's, I had not been down those line's before.
At one time, after following the witness Ellen Jessop,
I did wonder if maybe She was a relation of Great Grandma Annie ,
and for some reason ? Annie Moore, was not really Annie Moore at all ,
and was using an alias ,
Me struggling :) will never give up , She is My Great Grandma Annie :) :)
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Hello Eilleen
Something also to consider.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=860415.msg7294287#msg7294287
Regarding the 1875 Marriage at Boston, both Tom Chambers Exton and his
Father Robert's occupation are "Tailor" ...
and for William Moore's occupation it just says "Labourer".
The type of Labourer is not specified, nor is the period in William Moore's life when he was a Labourer.
I have noticed some people marrying put down their Father's occupation when they were born, others have given their Father's occupation at the time of their Marriage.
There was a job known as a Tailor's Labourer and described as a Tailor's Assistant. However, many occupations had a Labourer, e.g. Brewers Labourer etc.
William Moore, the local Tailor at nearby Donington Lincs, could of had another child?
Mark
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Stamford Mercury, September 1863.
At Freiston, on the 22d inst., Mr. W. Moore, tailor, Donington, to Emma, fifth daughter of Mr. Thos Kent, of Thornton le Fen.
1863 William Moore married Emma Kent.
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Stamford Mercury, September 1863.
At Freiston, on the 22d inst., Mr. W. Moore, tailor, Donington, to Emma, fifth daughter of Mr. Thos Kent, of Thornton le Fen.
1863 William Moore married Emma Kent.
Eilleen
I have got a problem discounting this William Moore, Tailor at Donington, Lincs., as unrelated to Ann Moore, until his Wife's Kent family are researched.
In 1871 an Ann Moore appears in the household of William Bett (not Belt), in the Parish of Fosdyke. In 1881 William Bott is roughly written, but his Wife's surname is clearly written Bett.
1871 Parish of Fosdyke
William Bett, Head, Mar, 47, Farmer 1100 acres, born Sutterton Fen.
Mary Bett, Wife, Mar, 50, South Willingham, Lincs.
George Bett, Nephew, Un, 26, Farmer's Son (Apprentice), South Willingham.
Mary Ann Bett, Niece, Un, 14, Scholar, South Willingham.
Servants including:-
Ann Moore, Serv, Unm, 15, Cook, born Donnington, Lincs.
In 1851, George Bett is with his parents and 4 Brothers and the Son of a Farmer:-
1851 South Willingham
William Bett, Head, M, 47, Farmer 52acres, South Willingham.
Ann Bett, Wife, M, 42, Farmer's Wife, Donington on Bain.
John Bett, Son, U, 11, Scholar,
Thomas Bett, Son, U, 9, Scholar,
George Bett, Son, U, 6, Scholar, South Willingham.
Samuel Bett, Son, U, 4,
William Bett, Son, U, 2,
All Sons born South Willingham.
I don't know if this is a coincidence or not yet, but Ann Bett was nee Ann Kent.
1833, 23rd October, Donington on Bain Marriages
William Bett, Bachelor, of South Willingham and
Ann Kent Spinster of this Parish,
By Banns.
Present: John Timm ; Jonas Brattay or Briattay (Jonas signs all on page)
Mark
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Mark,
I am so grateful for your help, you are looking at things I have not ,
I have never disregarded Ann Moore, Servant, Unmarried, 15, Cook, born Donnington, Lincs. 1871 census.
It just never lead Me anywhere :)
but also having more surnames means I can see if any match with My DNA .
I am research what you have found for Me .
Eilleen.
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Stamford Mercury, September 1863.
At Freiston, on the 22d inst., Mr. W. Moore, tailor, Donington, to Emma, fifth daughter of Mr. Thos Kent, of Thornton le Fen.
1863 William Moore married Emma Kent.
Hello Eilleen
I cannot see any link from Emma Kent who married William Moore 1863, to the Ann Kent who married William Bett of South Willingham in 1833 at Donington on Bain.
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Emma Moore nee Kent (Wife of Wm Moore, Tailor, Donington, Lincs), in the England & Wales Census as follows:-
1881 47yrs, born Woodhall, Lincs.
1891 59yrs, born Thimbleby, Lincs.
1901 68yrs, born Hosington, Lincs [Horsington, Lincs].
All Birthplaces within a few miles of each other.
1833 24th March, Woodhall, Lincs
Emma Daughter of Thomas & Rebecca Kent, Abode Woodhall, Farmer.
1824 Roughton, Lincs, 10th August, by Banns
Thomas Kent of the Parish of Woodhall and
Rebecca Stones of this Parish
Present:- William Stones ; Elizabeth Wattom or Wattorn[?] signed
1851 West Ashby, Lincs.
Thomas Kent, Head, M, 52, Farmer, Stixwould, Lincs.
Rebecca Kent, Wife, M, 48, born Roughton, Lincs.
Thomas Kent, Son, Un, 22, born Thimbleby, Lincs.
Naomi Kent, Daugh, 15, born Thimbleby.
Abna Kent, Son, 13, born Thimbleby.
James Kent, Son, 11, born West Ashby.
Robert Kent, Son, 8, born West Ashby.
Jane Kent, Daugh, 5, born West Ashby.
In 1841 the family are also at West Ashby Fen.
Thomas Kent, 40, Farmer, Y.
Rebecka Kent, 35, Y.
Thomas Kent, 12, Y.
Ann Kent, 10, Y.
Mary Kent, 9, Y.
Emma Kent, 8, Y.
William Kent, 7, Y.
Naomi Kent, 6, Y.
David Kent, 4, Y.
Abner Kent, 3, Y.
James Kent, 1, Y.
1797 Stixwould
Thomas Son of Thom' Kent & Anne his Wife, Feb 26th.
Possible Marriage
1796 Stixwould, 12th May, by Banns
Thomas Kent, Bachelor & Anne Croft, Spinster.
Present:- William Croft ; William Rowett.
Didn't go any further, several Thomas Kent in Lincs and didn't look to see who Wattom or Rowett might be related too.
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oh My gosh,
I did not get very far , but I am thankful you did.
My head is thumping now, time to turn computer off.
Eilleen.
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Hello Eilleen
Looks like your Annie Exton gave evidence in Court.
"Mrs Exton" newspaper search ...
Lincolnshire Chronicle, 5th March 1897
LINCOLN CITY POLICE
Thursday. - Before the Mayor (T. Wallis, Esq.) and W. W. Richardson, Esq.
Fredk Busby, labourer, lodging at 2, Thorngate, was Summoned for using obscene language in St. Martins-street, on the 25th ult —P.c. Andrew and Mrs. Exton gave evidence proving the charge.—Defendant said someone threw a bucketful of water out of a window, and as it fell on him it made him swear. ...
It seems he was also in default of his 10 shilling fine and apparently sent to gaol for 7 days.
1901 Census, your Annie Exton lived at 29 St Martins Street, Lincoln.
I wonder if a Summons, Court record and a Police File survive somewhere, even a precise date of Birth or a snippet of info about Annie or her background, might be useful? :)
Mark
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Mark,
I have not seen that one ? will have to find it .
Her Daughter also called Annie Exton , eldest child, born 7th May 1876,
was constantly in trouble and having appearances in court ,
from the age of 12 years till well in to Her 60s.
Eilleen.
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Lincolnshire Archives
Lincolnshire Constabulary 1837 to 1994
An extensive list of the types of Police records under "CONSTAB" no dates.
I don't know what Police recorded about witnesses (newspaper says Mrs Exton), re Birth date and birth places and if that survives or not?
Archives might have some NC Chapel Registers of Birth covering 1850 to 1860 to look at?
Mark
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An interesting one for Moore born Donington, Lincolnshire.
1861
Michael Moore, Head, Wid'r, 58, Ag Lab, Donington.
Eliza Moore, Dau, Un, 27, Donington.
Mary L Moore, G/dau, 6, Scholar, Donington.
Jane E Moore, G/dau, 3, Donington.
Possible Birth Registration for Jane E Moore ...
1857 Jane Eliza Moore,
No Mother Maiden Surname in GRO online index.
Nearest Donington Baptism suggestion for Mary L Moore ... 1855 Mary Louisa Cooley dau of Eliza Moore, Donington, Single Woman.
[This Birth not listed Free BMD / Index?]
Transcription (not checked) Mary Louisa Coley Moore died 1928 Lincoln, Lincs.
Mark
Added:
Mary Louisa Coley Moore - buried Canwick Road Cemetery, Lincoln per NBI. Born abt 1855.
Mary Louisa Cooley Moore ...
Sister of Janie Eliza Ashton, Widow, born Donington.
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Mark,
Thank you again,
Great Grandma Annie Moore has cast Her spell over you :)
and I for one am grateful.
Eilleen.
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1879 Parish of Horncastle Marriage
George Ashton married Jane Eliza Moore (No Father for Jane Eliza Moore - dotted line through her Father column), she signed in own hand Janine Eliza Moore.
Jane Eliza Moore, in Reply #50
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If anyone wonders, Annie Exton repeatedly claimed to be born Gosberton.
Looking at Moore children in the Census in the Parish of Gosberton area (born around the time Annie Exton nee Moore was born) to see if there are other unregistered / not indexed Moore Births.
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Not looked at any more 1861 Census for Moore children born at places in the Gosberton, Donington, Quadring, toward Fosdyke locality 1850 to 1860, to see whether their Births were registered or missing on GRO Indexes in the Spalding Registration District.
https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/spalding.html
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The Parish of Gosberton administratively was larger than Gosberton Parish it seems.
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I had this with an ancestor of mine on his 1872 Marriage Certificate he stated he was a Widower and from the Parish of Bowdon and we discovered that Bowdon Parish (where Bowdon Church was) was in the Parish of Bowdon, but the Parish of Bowdon included other townships and 25 years ago searching the 1871 Census on rolls of microfilm was a nightmare.
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There seemed to be Moore family events at Northorpe in the Donington / Gosberton Registers.
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Noticed 3 William Moore burials at Donington Lincs:-
1823, Feb 4th, William Moore of Meeting House Lane, 74 years.
1830, Nov 3rd, William Moore, Northorpe Donington, 23.
1833, April 25th, William Moore, Northorpe Donington, Age Inf't.
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There was a Farm on the road out of Donington toward Gosberton (before Quadring) known as Workhouse Farm, alias The Limes.
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Kevin.
They are all really interesting fines.
thank you.
Eilleen.
have just been for a drive round the Gosberton area. :)
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Eilleen
If Annie's Father was William Moore, Labourer and if he was a Farm Labourer, Annie could of been born Gosberton and he or family moved on, end of the Season.
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Non-Conformists
I wonder if any Nonconformist (NC) records survive at Archives for Gosberton 1850 to 1860 to check for any Moore births?
Baptists had a Chapel at Gosberton from 1666. There were also two Anabaptist families who met twice a year at one point, probably in a house.
By the time of Annie Moore's Birth, Wesleyan Methodists and seen references to Primitive Methodists one book mentioned New Methodists. (Primitive Methodist in some places was usually after Wesleyan Methodists had a chapel).
I wonder if there were any Catholics living at Gosberton? In some places c.1850 Catholic Registers are still at the nearest Catholic Church, or their Area Office. But some Archives have filmed them.
Quakers seemed to be at Spalding.
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Some Lincolnshire Male & Female Moore Baptisms found, Father William Moore (limited by mileage radius):-
1859 Annie Florence D of Wm & Mary Moore, Burton Coggles, Farmer.
1857 Emily D of Wm & Mary Moore, as above.
1857 Marion D of Wm & Mary Moore, as above.
Burton Coggles was about 20 miles from Donington.
1858 Wm Christopher S of Wm & Ann Moore, Dunston, Cordwainer.
1860 Betsey D of Wm & Ann Moore, Dunston, Cordwainer.
1857 William S of William & Hannah Moore, Stamford.
1857 Sarah Ann D of Wm & Eleanor Moore, Castle Street, Labourer. Stamford Register.
1859 Frances D of Wm & Eleanor Moore, Brooker Court, Labourer. Stamford Register.
1860 Harriet D of Wm & Frances Moore, Bessingham, Labourer.
1855 William S of Wm & Hannah Moore, Syston, Lincs.
1860 Sarah Ann D of Wm & Hannah Moore, Syston, Lincs.
Other Brief / Summary Notes
1839 Wm Moore, Lab'r & Mary Ann Smith, Morton.
1855 Wm Francis Moore & Charlotte Walker, Labourer, Gedney.
1858 Wm Moore & Ann Curtis, Farmer, Coningsby.
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After your Annie Moore married T C Exton in 1875, it would be interesting if an Exton was present as a witness at any Moore, Lincolnshire Marriage?
Mark
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Mark,
Brilliant, that will keep Me very busy :)
for some reason I had never thought about Exton being a witness at Moore marriages ???
something worth looking for, thank you.
Eilleen.
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Hello Eilleen
Looks like your Annie Exton gave evidence in Court.
"Mrs Exton" newspaper search ...
Lincolnshire Chronicle, 5th March 1897
LINCOLN CITY POLICE
Thursday. - Before the Mayor (T. Wallis, Esq.) and W. W. Richardson, Esq.
Fredk Busby, labourer, lodging at 2, Thorngate, was Summoned for using obscene language in St. Martins-street, on the 25th ult —P.c. Andrew and Mrs. Exton gave evidence proving the charge.—Defendant said someone threw a bucketful of water out of a window, and as it fell on him it made him swear. ...
It seems he was also in default of his 10 shilling fine and apparently sent to gaol for 7 days.
1901 Census, your Annie Exton lived at 29 St Martins Street, Lincoln.
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Hello Eilleen
Did any Police records survive at Lincolnshire Archives for 1897 (and 1880 added below) about Mrs Exton who gave evidence 1897?
Mark
"CONSTAB - Lincolnshire Constabulary - 1837-1994"
CONSTAB/2 WORK OF THE FORCE
CONSTAB/2/1 POLICE ROUTINE
CONSTAB/2/1/1 Beat & duties books.
CONSTAB/2/1/2 Police officers' journals & pocket books.
CONSTAB/2/1/3 Occurrence books.
CONSTAB/2/1/5 Charge books.
CONSTAB/2/1/6 Summons books.
CONSTAB/2/1/7 Crime registers & notebooks.
CONSTAB/2/1/8 Counsel books.
CONSTAB/2/1/9 Warrants.
CONSTAB/2/1/10 Bail forms.
CONSTAB/ 2/1/11 Records relating to prisoners in police custody.
CONSTAB/2/1/17 Felony books.
CONSTAB/2/1/18 Registers of quasi-criminal proceedings.
CONSTAB/2/1/19 Miscellaneous.
CONSTAB/2/2 CRIME INFORMATION
CONSTAB/2/2/1 Crime periodicals.
CONSTAB/2/2/2 Registers of criminals.
CONSTAB/2/2/3 Handbooks of criminal suspects.
CONSTAB/2/2/4 Criminal record cards.
CONSTAB/2/2/5 Photographs of criminals.
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Added:
Lincoln ... Mercury, 24 December 1880
Lincoln City Police
17 December
"A girl named Lucy Mary Sharp, aged 9 years, was charged with stealing 2s. from Ada Exton, aged 6 years. It appeared that on the previous morning Mrs. Exton sent the child with the money wrapped in paper to a neighbour to be changed. On the way prisoner met the child and took the money from her and gave her the paper back ... dismissed Sharp with a caution" ...