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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Sandiehawk on Friday 11 August 23 04:44 BST (UK)
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I'm researching Alfred James William Pocock. b abt Oct 1899 and baptized on 13 Jan 1901 at Long Ditton, surrey U.K.
I have him on a passenger list for SS Paparoa departing England on 15 Oct 1912 and arriving in Melbourne 2 Dec 1912.
With him is his mother Ada.
He is listed as being 12 years of age.
I can't find an entry for his father Alfred Pocock 1864-1924.
I am only presuming this is the correct information for him as I haven't found him on any other passenger lists.
I know he also came to Australia.
They lived in Melbourne until the son Alfred joined the Australian Army in Feb 1917.
I would like to find out how and when the father arrived in Australia and any other information about Alfred J W Pocock.
Thankyou for any information.
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Alfred James William POCOCK (of Ferny Creek, retired) probate granted 20 Mar 1978.
https://prov.vic.gov.au/archive/8901F873-F294-11E9-AE98-B32CEC9738CF
Died 8 Jan 1978
Modified to add:
Death registration at Heidelberg (2452 / 1978) aged 78.
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There is a marriage for Alfred James POCOCK and Agnes Mary ANDERSON in 1925. :-\
Also a marriage for Alfred James William POCOCK and Margaret Edna Davis FOLLETT in 1947.
https://www.bdm.vic.gov.au/research-and-family-history/search-your-family-history
Modified to add:
Margaret Edna Doris POCOCK died 1975 aged 58, registered at Ferny Creek. Parents Horace Henry and Ida FOLLETT.
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Ada Sophia POCOCK died 29 Sept 1941
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/8207613
Her death registration says father William Barton SALTER, aged 70, born Surrey.
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Thankyou maddys52.
I already have the information you have kindly found except for a possible marriage to Margaret Edna Davis Follet.
His first wife died in 1977
Probate states Ferny Creek for Alfred so it's reasonable to think that Margaret could be his second if he had been divorced.
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Alfred POCOCK (snr) married Ada SALTER. They are in Surrey in the 1911 census with son Alfred (2 other children died earlier - haven't checked, but one must be Arthur born c1890 who is with them in the 1901 census).
The son Alfred James William POCOCK marries Margaret FOLLETT. :)
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There is a family arrive on the Mamari in Sydney 15 June 1911. "Mr A, Mrs and Master C". I'm not sure about this as a possible alternative arrival for your family - apart from the child's initial not being correct, I'm not sure that it works time-wise, with the 1911 census. :-\
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maddys52. Yes I have seen the entry for the Mamari.
I don't know when the 1911 England census would have been filled out.
I have been trying to find a full passenger list for the SS Paparoa to see if the father is also there but no luck so far.
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maddys52. The Arthur in the 1901 Census is most likely Arthur Charles (1890-1965).
Born to Alfred and first wife Alice Everett ( 1861-1897).
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Have checked now - the 1911 census was 2 April, and a sea voyage from London to Sydney at this time was in the order of 40-45 days, so it is possible that a family could have been included in the 1911 census and still arrive 15 June in Sydney.
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Thankyou maddy52.
I know the family lived in Melbourne and Alfred J W enlisted in the Army in Melbourne.
I presume they made their way south from Sydney at some stage.
Can you suggest where I could find Alfred senior on a passenger list for the ship Paparoa?
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Children of Alfred POCOCK:
1886 Florence (mmn EVERETT)
1890 Arthur Charles (mmn EVERETT)
1888 Emma Lucy Pugh (mmn EVERETT) - died 1891
1899 Alfred James William (mmn SALTER)
1902 Albert John (mmn SALTER) - died 1905
1905 Eva Alice Mary (mmn SALTER) - died 1905
So Florence and Arthur Charles did not go to Australia with their father.
Can you suggest where I could find Alfred senior on a passenger list for the ship Paparoa?
I had a quick look on Ancestry earlier, but couldn't see it. There is also PROV
https://prov.vic.gov.au/
and familysearch has some passenger lists. :)
Modified to add:
I don't have a subscription to findmypast, but I know in the past I have found more passenger lists on that site. Doing a search there comes up with A POCOCK b1872 and A POCOCK b 1900 arriving Melbourne 1912 - so I assume this is the record you have? The image should be available on findmypast.
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There is this item about the Paparoa in 1912:
" ... There are 500 nominated passengers, of whom the majority are wives, with children, coming to join their husbands already in Victoria ... "
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/222478828
This article suggests many of the wives who arrived on the Paparoa were following their husbands who arrived on the Kaikoura. Something to follow up maybe?
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/203312553
There are a few possibilities on findmypast for other A POCOCKs on passenger lists between April 1911 and Dec 1912. None of the ages are quite right, but possibly he fibbed, or it has been recorded incorrectly.
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Should have taken my own advice - here is the passenger list for the Paparoa, with Mrs A and Master A POCOCK on the bottom line- on familysearch (courtesy of PROV):
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSK4-8D56?cc=2778600
No Mr POCOCK as far as I can see.
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Alfred James William Pocock. b abt Oct 1899
Date of birth on school record is 23 October 1899.
Richmond Road Council Boys School, attended 1 May 1908 to 5 June 1908
Last school attended St Luke's Infants
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maddys52. Thankyou again. I would love to now where you find the information.
I have Emma Lucy married on 12 Nov 1912 to Arthur G Langley Knight.
They has two children, Royston 1915-2009 and Stella 1916-1985.
She died in 1960.
I did not know about the two younger ( Salter) children.
I wondered about Albert coming to Australia some time before his wife and son.
jonw65. Thankyou also for the information about school records.
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You are right about Emma Lucy Pugh POCOCK, my mistake. She is is the 1911 census with her mother's family (Charles William EVERETT and family) in Tottenham, and marries Arthur George Langley KNIGHT in Walthamstow 6 Nov 1912.
I would love to now where you find the information.
I used the GRO search for births (which shows mother's maiden name) to find the children of Alfred POCOCK. Free to search, but you need to register.
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/login.asp
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Thankyou so much maddys52. I will join up and see what else I can find.
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Presuming that Alfred Pocock married twice.
I have him on the Electoral Roll in Melbourne with his wife Agnes until 1937.
In 1942 there is an Alfred James Pocock at an address in Glenferrie Rd, Melbourne.
On a different Electoral Roll for 1942 there is a Margaret Edna Davis Follet at the same address.
From then until 1975 Alfred and Margaret (who is now Pocock) are on the same electoral Roll entries.
There is a marriage for them in 1947.
In 1977 Alfred is at the same address but on his own.
Margaret Pocock died in 1975.
I presume Albert and his first wife Agnes divorced as she died in 1977.
Where could I find out about a divorce?
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I'm assuming the death you mean is Agnes Mary ANDERSON in 1977, aged 72, parents Archibald and Janet. And her birth 1904 at Rushworth.
Do you have the marriage certicate of Alfred POCOCK and Agnes ANDERSON - is the above the correct Agnes?
Victorian divorce records (up to 1946) are on PROV
https://prov.vic.gov.au/explore-collection/explore-topic/divorce-files-and-cause-books
I had a very quick look, but couldn't see a divorce for POCOCK, probably good to double check.
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I don't want to purchase any certificates. Just hoping to get as much information as I can without the expense.
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I know it can be very expensive.
Some thoughts:
Alfred James William POCOCKs army file is available to view:
https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/ViewImage.aspx?B=8018169
In 1951 (or is it 1941, a bit hard to tell) his address is 29 Shepherd St, Surrey Hills (the same as the 1937 electoral roll with Agnes Mary), and in 1963 it is 749 Glenferrie Rd, Hawthorn (the same as the 1963 electoral roll, with Margaret Edna).
The 1954 electoral roll has his address 104 Glenferrie Rd (with Margaret Edna). His mother's death notice has her address in 1941 as 104 Glenferrie Rd.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/8207613
So it's definitely the same chap, just can't find a divorce between c1937 and 1947.
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I have searched for marriages for both Agnes Mary Anderson and Margaret Follet and a divorce from Agnes Anderson and cannot find any records apart from the entries I have read on Ancestry.
I wondered if Agnes and Alfred didn't marry but she took his surname.
I don't know where else to search.
Any suggestions will be very helpful.
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The marriages are both on the Victorian BDM (free to search):
https://www.bdm.vic.gov.au/research-and-family-history/search-your-family-history
Alfred James POCOCK and Agnes Mary ANDERSON (5337 / 1925)
Alfred James William POCOCK and Margaret Edna Doris FOLLETT (4420 / 1947)
You can order both certificates $22 each.
Modified to add: it would be interesting to see if his marital status is "divorced" on the 1947 marriage.