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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Wexford => Topic started by: SOFEE on Thursday 03 August 23 12:20 BST (UK)
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can someone please help me find out who my real 2xgreat grandparents are?
My great Grandmother Margaret Dunn Born abt 1849 Ireland was marred twice.
1st marriage age 21yrs (11/02/1870) to Thomas Sergeant : parents were : Edward Dunn (land steward) & Mary Ann Dunn m.s Fay
2nd marriage age 24yrs (28/07/1876) to Robert Hood her parents were ; John Dunne (land steward) & Margaret Dunne .m.s Elliot
on her death certificate parents are John Dunne Land steward & Margaret Dunne m.s Elliot
I also have an extract from census return of 1851 (cen S/22/4) I dont know if this was needed for her pension or something ? its dated 8/10/1920 Parents are listed as Edward Dunn & Mary Ann Fay and the address of the "applicant" is my great grandmothers in Glasgow. theres lots of wee scribbled notes on it too
I also noticed although there was 6 years between those marriages my great grandmother only aged by 3yrs ;D ;D
I would be most grateful if someone could help solve this riddle please
sofee
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The wee scribbled notes maybe important.
http://censussearchforms.nationalarchives.ie/reels/c19/007246697/007246697_00153.pdf
Trying to make sense of it, I think
The address A. in Wexford was uninhabited in 1851, the second address B. is not found but they have found a family in County Meath as a possible but the father there was a gardener.
So it appears they can not find the information that Margaret is suppling to support her claim.
It appears she give Fay as her mother's maiden name, also the date of marriage for her parents as 1832.
How do you the second marriage to Robin Hood is the same Margaret? Silly question that's her name on the application.
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A good bit north, but the NLI RC parish records website shows an Edward Dunn - Maryanne Fay marriage on 26 November 1832, under Booterstown:
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633702#page/19/mode/1up (right page, near top, witnesses Thomas Kinsela and Anne Donohoe)
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Again Booterstown, a daughter Mary Ann baptised on 1st of Jan 1837:
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633704#page/86/mode/1up (left page, 2nd entry down)
Mary Ann of Edward Dunne and Mary Ann Fay Sps. Thomas Cullen & Jane Cullen
The names are hardly unique, so I suppose it could be a coincidence... so just to note for now.
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Trouble with land stewards is they often moved around.
Does either marriage say if the father was still alive?
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Hi Sinann & Gaffy
thanks for taking the time to try and help me.
re the marriage record the marriage of Edward Dunn and Mary Ann Fay ;D thanks for that
I thought the wee scribbles etc could be of use thats on the census extract but I've not been able to fathom what they mean...
I wasn't sure if I could post the record on here or not? i did notice on the census extract where it said relationship and occupation it said gardener/ ? winter
As for her second Marriage Yes I'm 99% sure its the same Margaret Dunn formally Sergeant, Widow
her death record says
Margaret Hood window of
1st Thomas Sergeant,
2nd Robert Hood
I'm just confused as to who her parents are???
thanks
sofee
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i did notice on the census extract where it said relationship and occupation it said gardener/ ? winter
Looks like it says 'gardener for Dr Winter'
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Sorry Sinann
you asked if parents deceased on
1st marriage its quite hard to read says Edward Dunn dec? & Mary Ann Fay (deceased)
2nd John Dunne & Margaret Dunne m.s Elliot (deceased)
im not sure exactly what is after Edwards name its a squiggle looks like dec for deceased but not to sure
Sofee
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With mention of Winter, Meath and gardening:
https://theirishaesthete.com/2016/02/
Agher house was probably a candidate to have had need of land stewards and gardeners. In an earlier timescale, it was associated with a Dr Winter and in early 1800s, others of the Winter name were still linked with it.
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Scotmum & Kiltaglassan
Thanks for that " in the midst of winters" it was very interesting and Yes you could be right that could definitely say dr Winter on the census extract I saw "Agher," was mentioned and i did see that scribbled on the census too...so you could have connected soe of the dots so to speak ;D
thanks again for taking the time to research and reply its appreciated
Sofee
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Here's Agher House (and church) on the OSi National Townland and Historical Map Viewer (MapGenie 25 Inch in Basemap Gallery).
https://arcg.is/1nvOre0
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If her parents were dead by the time of her first marriage images of their death certs (if they were registered) aren’t online yet.
I’m not having any luck with the newspapers or Will calendars,
It’s very odd that the names change in 1876 and then go back again in 1920, clearly she was using the second set of names enough that the informant of her death knew them.
People do change their names but it’s usually the surname what possibly reason could a married woman have for changing her maiden name.
I do have a family where the married daughters change their maiden name when they move away from the home area but they are changing it back to the family’s original surname.
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Some points
A great-grandfather of mine was described as both a gardener and steward, so I see no conflict between the two descriptions.
The 1920 document was indeed required for pension purposes. As your g-grandmother was seeking to obtain an old-age pension, and needed documentary evidence from the census to substantiate this, I would tend to think that the parental details given on this form are correct.
Which then brings up the following point. Why the very, very different details on the second marriage? Different for both parents. For one parent I can well believe in a simple mistake - I have seen mistakes on multiple marriage certs, But mistakes for both parents? The thought that leaps to my mind is bigamy. Do you know if the first husband was dead?
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Wexflyer
Yes Margaret's first husband was tragically killed in a shipbuilding accident at work in Glasgow 1875.
I was wondering if there was the possibility of Margarets parents on the census died when she was just a young child and taken in by family or whoever John Dunne and Margaret Elliot were...I haven't managed to find records on them to see if further census records etc mention Margaret staying with them. and perhaps she thought of them as her parents as they looked after her??? just a thought
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Both marriages note the mother as deceased, neither show the father as being deceased.
Debra :)