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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: Kinsy on Tuesday 01 August 23 13:59 BST (UK)
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Can anyone decipher the first name of the Doyle witness in baptism #133, please ?
I've searched some of the other pages in the records, but cannot find a similar outline for the first letter of the name. The father of the child was my Irish g/gf Joseph Bernard Doyle [a brickwall in my family tree] and I'm hoping the witness was a relative and therefore a clue for further Doyle research.
The bapt record is on FamilySearch at https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QSQ-G9Z5-KQPK?i=552&cc=2155416
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I think I can see 'imer' after the first letter. Having looked at the whole page from your link, I cannot see any other name that has the same first letter.
You either have to wade your way through other pages to find a letter that looks the same with a readable name or look into the Doyle family and see what could be possible.
I'm guessing that the three lines represent the name of the child, the parents and the Godparents. Your mysterious name seems to be in the Godparents section.
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Thanks.
Yes, I've already searched a number of other pages for a similar first letter.
The mystery person was a Witness/Godparent - the 3 lines in each record are for K=Kind [Child]; O=Ouers [Parents]; G=Getuie [Witnesses]
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I noticed that there are huge numbers of pages which would take forever to wade through. ::)
I guess that leaves the option of researching the Doyle family. When did they end up in South Africa?
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All we know about my g/gf is that he was from Dublin.
He may have arrived in S.Africa circa 1878, because he said he'd fought with the British in the Zulu War [1879] - but there's no record of that - and he definitely didn't win the VC in that war, as he claimed he did ;)
He married my g/grandmother in S.Africa in 1883
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Was that marriage on the 5th February 1883 to a Hester Elisabeth Grimbeek? The marriage cert says he was born in Dublin, Ireland.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C91V-93VN-Y?cc=2727134&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AQGYD-G8FD
No father's names given so no help there.
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This might be his death, noted as a widower.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:7HN5-JQMM
There is an original image to view for this. Have a look and see if you think this is him. You made no mention earlier of knowing when he died.
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Yes, I have all those, thanks, Girl Guide - it's info about his parents, date of birth etc that I'm trying to find.
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I think that may be difficult. Irish records are not something I know a great deal about. I don't really know what exists and what doesn't.
I'll see if I can find Aghadowey and ask her if she can help you with this.
Added: I've sent a message and hopefully you will get some assistance.
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Thanks, Girl Guide.
I've searched the baptism records on the Irish Genealogy website, which is very good - but cannot find a Joseph Bernard Doyle born in anything even close to the correct time frame, i.e. mid to late 1850s, according to his marriage & death records.
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Hi,
A bt of a shot in the dark, but what about a badly written Vince? My first idea was actually a badly written Oliver, but the "l" would be completely different to all the other examples.
And Vince starts with a relatively unusual letter, which might explain not being able to find a similar letter on the rest of the page.
Just an idea... :)
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Thanks, Karen - every shot in the dark is appreciated. I'll have a search for a Vince Doyle, and see if anything turns up.
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Another long shot, not for the name of the witness but is there by any chance a relative of the family called John Doyle also a policeman in Transvaal who married in Ireland in 1912, his father was Michael a grocer and farmer but don’t know where the father lived.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1912/09906/5600263.pdf
They had a son Patrick Joseph which has the correct spelling of Transvaal
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1913/01460/1596403.pdf
A newspaper says the child was born at the mother’s parents home.
Also there is a good chance the name Bernard won’t be on the baptism.
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Hmm, that's interesting, Sinann - thanks.
I don't know whether there was a John in the family, however - apart from my grandfather, that is, although he was actually baptised Johan. But he married in S.Africa, and never went to Ireland.
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Is it Denis Doyle?
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Thanks, shanreagh. I also though the first letter might be a D - but, after looking at the writing on a lot of the other pages, I think the last two letters are "er".
Anyway, I'll keep Denis in mind when searching for Doyles in SA.
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It certainly does look like "er" on the end. Too much of a tail to just be an "e".
I can't help but think that he was about to write a "D" (maybe for Doyle) at the beginning and had to correct it. But what could the letter be?
I noticed that lower down there is a Van Staden (at least I think that's what it says) and the "V" is very clear and very simple. Maybe that ruins my "Vince" theory. ;D
Start writing a "D", realise it's wrong, and change it to...??? Something that could be a "W"? But Wimer as a first name..?
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Yes, that is "Van Staden" - and at the bottom of the page (online) the surname "Visagie" is written twice - so the 1st letter can't be a V.
I think the dot above the word is actually the start of the downward stroke of the first letter, and not the dot for an "i" - am going to look at the pages online now to see if I can find a capital letter that starts with a similar downward stroke.
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Hello -
The only name I can think of ending in 'imer' is Eimer.
craggagh.
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I've not heard that name before, craggagh, but it certainly is a possibility. Thanks.
The problem with those middle letters is that they could be u, i, n, m, w, v or r.
It's frustrating that the only clue to another possible Doyle relative is illegible - sigh :-\
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Looking at names of Dutch origin, Wiemer could theoretically be a contender:
https://de.geneanet.org/vorname/Wiemer
I mentioned Wimer earlier; it looks as though that does indeed occasionally crop up as a first name, as does Wimar:
https://vornamen.blog/Wimar
I would love to know what it really says! :D
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Yes, it's driving me bonkers not knowing :P