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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: hunkyhywel on Friday 07 July 23 19:32 BST (UK)
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Hi!
I'm using ancestry so can't search censuses by address.
I have found 174 Bute St, Cardiff, in 1871 and 1891 but can't in 1881.
Strangely, I have found 175 Bute St (RG 11/5280, p90) but the page before is a different street.
Can anyone help me?
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FindMyPast address search doesn't list No. 174. No missing pages reported.
www.findmypast.co.uk/articles/census-for-england-wales-and-scotland-missing-pieces
You can search by street name on Ancestry by using the Card Catalogue, choose 1881 Wales census and put street name in keyword box.
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Different sides of the street may well be on different census pieces. Search for the 1871 and 1891 neighbours ( by name) in the 1881
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Very helpful indeed, thank you both!
Unfortunately I have turned up nothing again. It seems most of the folk in these streets are highly mobile mariner types.
The fella I'm looking for is Antionio De Torres and his family, sometimes Anthony Tory. Wife Harriet. Easily enough found in 1871 and 1891 but nothing in 1881. I was looking up his usual haunts like Bute St.
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Checking Bute Street on the 1881 Census it lists 194 households - Nos. Nos 1-154 and 175- 298.
Butcher's Cardiff Directory 1880-81
Cardiff Street Directory
Bute Street
174 Torres A, Grocer
here is South Loudon Place
Here's an item about the occupier
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/4404567/4404570/32/%22174%20bute%20street%22
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I have just checked all 1,142 residents of Bute Street, Cardiff in the 1881 census and there's no entry for 174. As the OP said, the nearest abode is 175 which is the first entry at the top of page 90 of RG11/5280/144 with the schedule number 462. The last entry on the previous page is schedule number 461 and is 26 Francis Street. Francis Street does not appear to exist today so it's hard to work out what route the enumerator might have followed. I also didn't find any houses in the low 160s or 170s Bute Street, suggesting that either they didn't exist in 1881 or that indeed a few pages are missing.
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South Louden Place still exist today so it's possible to pinpoint the approximate place where 174 once stood. There's an old wall with a railway (built in 1840) on the other side to the east of Bute Street, so I think that even in 1881, the houses/tenements were only on one side of the road.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bute+St,+Cardiff/@51.4698727,-3.16881,102m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m6!3m5!1s0x486e034ae9ed98f7:0xd0fbde611ce5ae7a!8m2!3d51.4708678!4d-3.1695538!16s%2Fm%2F026x59_?hl=en&entry=ttu
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Thank you all, very helpful! Especially the newspapers.
See this one, which refers to what seems like the sale of property which may have included 174 in 1876. Perhaps that property was changed or removed before 1881?
But 174 appears on 1891 :-\
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3076617/3076618/1/%22Mr%20Torres%22
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Butcher's Directory 1880/81 has Nos 169-174 between Loudon Terrace and South Loudon Place.
You can see Loudon Terrace on this map
https://maps.nls.uk/view/229407465
South Loudon Place is south of Loudon terrace
https://maps.nls.uk/view/229407516
No 174 was on the corner of Bute St and South Loudon Terrace
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Have a look at 1881 Census reference RG11 piece 5280 folio 129 page 62 sch 1207
The address column is headed Loudon Lane and the first dwelling is No 174. FindMyPast have not attempted to transcribe an address - just a "?".
It looks odd.
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www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2W9-S1N2
www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/5401321:8059?_phsrc=pot38495&_phstart=successSource&ml_rpos=1&queryId=bb4174aa2eedbd479bb098df3dea524b
Ancestry has it as 174 Louden Lane
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Thank you all, very helpful! Especially the newspapers.
See this one, which refers to what seems like the sale of property which may have included 174 in 1876. Perhaps that property was changed or removed before 1881?
But 174 appears on 1891 :-\
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3076617/3076618/1/%22Mr%20Torres%22
The newspaper item reads " ... Loudon Hotel, and Six Houses adjoining numbered 170, 171, 172, 173, 174 and 175 ... and situate in Bute Road. There is no Bute Road in Butcher's 1880-81 Directory.
One of the maps I posted shows the Loudon Hotel and, going north, No174 would be on the south side corner of Bute Street and South Loudon Place.
Butcher's Directory https://specialcollections.le.ac.uk/digital/collection/p16445coll4/id/91673/rec/1
The "Loudon Tav" is at No 169 and moving north from Loudon Terrace (not marked on map) No 174 would be on the south side corner of Bute Street and South Loudon Place.
Myself, the dwellings numbered 174-176 Loudon Lane don't make sense. They are the only entries But none of the names "fit" Butcher's.
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I have found 4 of those listed in Butcher's Directory 170-173 Bute Street at Bute Road on the 1881 Census - with the same house numbers as the Directory.
Unfortunately, it does not go above 173!
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The 1881 Census reference is Piece 5281 Folio 1 Page 1 Sch 2
You will see that No. 173, the 1st entry, shows Sch No 26 in column 1. Unfortunately there is no provision (< button) to view previous page.
Certainly looks as if sheets showing Sch. Nos 1-26 (col 1) are missing - this would explain absence of Antonio Torres in '81 at No 174?
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Alas, this is my suspicion also.
Explains why I can't find my fella or any of his resident family. Presumably they are all together on a piece of paper somewhere!
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If it's Antonio/Tony Torres you are chasing have you checked Welshnewspapers - apart from the edition I posted previously?
https://newspapers.library.wales/
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London Gazette -
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/all-notices/notice?text=%22torres+brothers%22&categorycode-all=all¬icetypes=&location-postcode-1=&location-distance-1=1&location-local-authority-1=&numberOfLocationSearches=1&start-publish-date=01%2F01%2F1875&end-publish-date=01%2F01%2F1919&edition=&london-issue=&edinburgh-issue=&belfast-issue=&sort-by=&results-page-size=10
Click on title "The London Gazette ...." to view item
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The information from familydar on this thread may be of use
www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=864395.msg7343239#msg7343239
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London Gazette - col 2
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/24532/page/7325