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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: Gibbs on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:06 BST (UK)

Title: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Gibbs on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:06 BST (UK)
Cyril Lewis possibly born 16/2/1905 according to Children's home in Watford 1915. This is the first definite record of him. Records say Orphan but where was he before that? No birth anywhere, DNA from son aged 93 with Ancestry points to Dorset names Vallens Cox Curtis Austin maybe but NO matches to Lewis or close matches to name Lewis. Possibly on 1911 in Abbotts Langley but no proof it's him or who his parents were. Closet DNA Matches appear to be half cousins removed! Been looking for 7 years paid out £300 for professional help if anyone can help me not only will you be a miracle worker you'll be very very good!
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: hepburn on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:12 BST (UK)
There's a Cyril Lewis born in Methyr T same year and in the Sept quarter...

I think he needs to be looked for in the 1911 though...
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: heywood on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:21 BST (UK)
Do you have him later? A silly question really but I mean in, e.g. 1921 and 1939. Or marriage records etc.
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Gibbs on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:27 BST (UK)
Yes Positive 'sightings' from 1915 in the Watford Children's home until 1919 then 1921 census and baptism in North Kilworth, these are 100% correct.
Baptism record says "From Children's homes in Watford parents Dead!" 1921 census says Born London which I can't verify and also both parents dead
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Gibbs on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:28 BST (UK)
Marriage certificate no fathers name down and 1939 register all correct as his son is still alive aged 93
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: heywood on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:33 BST (UK)
Thanks
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Gibbs on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:33 BST (UK)
For those who like DNA figures closest matches are 188Cms  (born 1951) and 130cms (born early 60s)   Cyrils son was born 1930
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: softly softly on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:38 BST (UK)
When did Cyril pass away.

John
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Gibbs on Tuesday 20 June 23 19:55 BST (UK)
Cyril Died  January 1990
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: softly softly on Tuesday 20 June 23 20:19 BST (UK)
I guessed it was him in 1990 as his wife W died same area in 1988. Did the informant on Cyrils death cert know him quiet well, as the date of birth is given as 17 Feb 1907.

John
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Gibbs on Tuesday 20 June 23 20:24 BST (UK)
That date is incorrect. In 1945 Cyril needed his birth certificate so his wife wrote to Somerset house for one. The obviously couldn't find one so sent him the nearest 'fit' which was Cyril Lewis born 17th Feb 1907 to John and Alice Lewis of Middlesbrough. Cyril knew this wasn't his but couldn't prove it so was left holding it for the rest of his life waiting an extra 2 years for his pension and the wrong details on his death certificate.

The Middlesbrough Cyril unfortunately died in 1914 aged 7 and I have both the birth and death certificates to rule it out. After 7 years I am at my wits end and poor Norman, Cyrils son, just wants to know the truth before ...well you know before!
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: hepburn on Tuesday 20 June 23 22:29 BST (UK)
Cyril Lewis estimated year of birth 1907 in Wandsworth 1911 census...This is on family Search.There's no parents on there..I don't know what that means.
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Alexander. on Wednesday 21 June 23 06:32 BST (UK)
I'm guessing you've already checked to see if there are any records of children admitted to the Watford Children's home. These records if they exist would probably be at the local archives. Not sure if it's the correct home, but looking at Hertfordshire Archives catalogue, they have some records for Ashby Road Children's Home, 1903-1955 (HSS8/16).

The birth date might have been 'invented' by the home, if nobody knew when he was born.

As Cyril Lewis might not even have been his birth name, I think DNA may be key here to narrow this down. Unfortunately it doesn't sound like any of the matches are that closely related.

You could look into Cyril's son doing a Y-DNA test. Y-DNA is passed only father-to-son, so this could help to narrow down whether he is related to other Lewises or should you be looking into other surnames. FamilyTreeDNA has the largest Y-DNA database, so testing with them is best. A 37 marker test is usually sufficient to screen for possible matches, you can always upgrade to higher level testing if needed. But it is very much luck of the draw whether there are any useful matches or not.

If there are any close male matches on Ancestry it might be worth trying to convince them to take a Y-DNA test as well, to work out if you are related on the paternal line.

Alexander
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Gibbs on Wednesday 21 June 23 08:48 BST (UK)
This was from the archives…….

In the volume reference HSS8/16/1 (an indexed admissions register to children cared for by the Watford Union Children’s Homes)
 
Admitted: 11 March 1915, Cyril Lewis (date of birth 16/2/1905)
Status: orphan
Left on 14 May 1919, “To Mr N Maddison, North Kilworth Mill near Rugby”
 
No other information about Cyril was seen in this register. As a child in the care of the Watford Union Board of Guardians, he could have been in any children’s home in the area which was administered by the Union. Remarks against other children show that they were sometimes sent to foster homes ( “boarded out”), to other charities (eg, Dr Barnado’s, from where they were often sent abroad as farm labourers),and girls were sent into domestic service as maids. Some children were sent far away, and there is no evidence surviving to show what governed the different destinations of these young people.
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Mvann on Wednesday 21 June 23 08:57 BST (UK)
There is a Cyril rowland Lewis born Lambeth march qtr 1905 on GRO index. Mothers maiden name white
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: heywood on Wednesday 21 June 23 09:12 BST (UK)
Yes Positive 'sightings' from 1915 in the Watford Children's home until 1919 then 1921 census and baptism in North Kilworth, these are 100% correct.
Baptism record says "From Children's homes in Watford parents Dead!" 1921 census says Born London which I can't verify and also both parents dead

When he was baptised in North Kilworth was there a reference to a parent/parents in the register or were the Maddisons his sponsors/carers?
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: fiddlerslass on Wednesday 21 June 23 09:29 BST (UK)
There's a Cyril Frederick Lewis age 6 boarding in Herts 1911 birth place unknown. If the elderly person he was boarding with died that may explain the Children's home admission. Abbots Langley is close to Watford.
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: Dundee on Wednesday 21 June 23 11:13 BST (UK)
Emma KIFF didn't die until 1924 but by 1915 she was getting on in years.  I was wondering if he had come to her from Watford originally and if she was unable to continue caring for him he was returned there.

Debra  :)
Title: Re: Looking for a birth possibly 1905
Post by: hepburn on Wednesday 21 June 23 12:49 BST (UK)
Could Emma Kiff have a connection to the Lewis family?