RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Monaghan => Topic started by: Daltonator86 on Monday 12 June 23 01:20 BST (UK)
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Hello! This concerns the details of my great-grandfather, Patrick McCabe, who was born in 1832-33 in Carricmacross. No doubt, as a result of the famine, by the 1851 he was in Liverpool, albeit he was in the army. Taking into account his military leanings, I wouldn't mind knowing whether he was a Catholic or Protestant. If he was Presbyterian, then surely that would mean the McCabe family (in my case) originates in Scotland....
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I apologize for any confusion. However, without specific details about Patrick McCabe, such as his wife's name, the names of his children, his death date, or immigration status, it becomes challenging to provide his Parents. If you could provide more specific information I’d be happy to research for his parents.
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Looking at the 1901 census of Co Monaghan, there were 1119 people named McCabe. 10 were Presbyterian, the remainder nearly all Roman Catholic. So statistically the family seem likely to have been Catholic.
MacLysaght’s “The Surnames of Ireland” says of McCabe: “A galloglass family with the O’Reillys and the O’Rourkes which became a recognised sept. Woulfe suggests caba – “cape”, a surname of the nickname type as the derivation. Having regard to their origin it is more likely to be from a non-Gaelic personal name.”
Galloglass were mercenaries brought from the Scottish Western Isles and elsewhere in the 13th to 16th centuries to fight on behalf of various Irish tribes (who were in regular dispute with each other). In return for their fighting skills they were given some land. At the time they arrived in Ireland, Presbyterianism hadn’t been invented (c 1550) and so they’d have been Catholic. The 10 Presbyterian McCabes in the 1901 census are either Scots who arrived in the later migrations of the 1600s or Catholic families who switched denomination, possible as a result of mixed denomination marriages.
Tens of thousands of Irish Catholics joined the British army over the years. I wouldn’t leap to any conclusions about the family being Presbyterian just because Patrick was in the army.
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My maiden name is McCabe and we were all Church of Scotland .Our McCabe line originates from Dunnottar Stonehaven and Aberdeen .
Rosie
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Don't assume that Patrick McCabe left Ireland because of the Famine. Some areas were affected more than others and there are many reasons he could have left Ireland not the least being joining the Army.
Did Patrick McCabe marry? if so, does marriage record list his father's name and occupation (as in Irish, English & Welsh certificates)?
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Are there any relevant details in his military record?
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Here’s the 1851 England & Wales Census:
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01sdh/
Here’s a possibility for him in the 1841 England and Wales Census:
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01sdg/
If that is him in the 1841 Census, his parents are Laurence & Ann McCabe. I am not sure because you did not provide enough information.
…without specific details about Patrick McCabe, such as his wife's name, the names of his children, his death date, or immigration status, it becomes challenging to provide his Parents...
As I mentioned earlier, could you please provide us some information such as his wife's name, the names of his children, his death date, and other information which could help us determine if this is him or not.
*edit 1
Also, if you try looking for his Birth Record in Carricmacross (County Monaghan), you will not be able to find it as records did not exist or were destroyed.
*Edit 2
There’s a duplicate post from last year:
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=841654
And another…
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=841653
You know his father, John. Why didn’t you tell us??? You also got replies that answer everything basically!
*Edit 3
You found Patrick’s Grandmother Relative, Ann Brawl. Because of that, you made another post?!
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=842716
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Here’s the 1851 England & Wales Census:
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01sdh/
Here’s a possibility for him in the 1841 England and Wales Census:
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01sdg/
If that is him in the 1841 Census, his parents are Laurence & Ann McCabe. I am not sure because you did not provide enough information.
…without specific details about Patrick McCabe, such as his wife's name, the names of his children, his death date, or immigration status, it becomes challenging to provide his Parents...
As I mentioned earlier, could you please provide us some information such as his wife's name, the names of his children, his death date, and other information which could help us determine if this is him or not.
*edit 1
Also, if you try looking for his Birth Record in Carricmacross (County Monaghan), you will not be able to find it as records did not exist or were destroyed.
*Edit 2
There’s a duplicate post from last year:
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=841654
And another…
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=841653
You know his father, John. Why didn’t you tell us??? You also got replies that answer everything basically!
*Edit 3
You found Patrick’s Grandmother Relative, Ann Brawl. Because of that, you made another post?!
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=842716
Hello, I am sorry... I actually forgot I had even made that post. I am an idiot. I appreciate your perspective 100%.
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Are there any relevant details in his military record?
For the record, is it possible to delete threads once one has concluded a mystery?
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You can't delete threads but you can add completed to your post
Rosie
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I apologize for any confusion. However, without specific details about Patrick McCabe, such as his wife's name, the names of his children, his death date, or immigration status, it becomes challenging to provide his Parents. If you could provide more specific information I’d be happy to research for his parents.
His wife's name was Sarah Hannah Tucker. One of their sons was Stephen McCabe, my great-grandfather.
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I see that Carrickmacross is shown as his birthplace on a military record.
If he was Catholic, the records begin in 1838, so you will not find him there.
https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0292
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I see that Carrickmacross is shown as his birthplace on a military record.
If he was Catholic, the records begin in 1838, so you will not find him there.
https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0292
Strangely enough Magheracloone lists Carrickmacross as an alternative name and says marriages start 1826 and baptisms start 1836-
https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0293
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I see that Carrickmacross is shown as his birthplace on a military record.
If he was Catholic, the records begin in 1838, so you will not find him there.
https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0292
Strangely enough Magheracloone lists Carrickmacross as an alternative name and says marriages start 1826 and baptisms start 1836-
https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0293
What am I to do to find any further details?
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Have you checked the records I provided a link for? If so and you found nothing have you checked for possible siblings (in both sets of registers)?
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I see that Carrickmacross is shown as his birthplace on a military record.
If he was Catholic, the records begin in 1838, so you will not find him there.
https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0292
Having written the above, I can’t see a military record for Patrick with a birthplace. There is one for an older man so I wonder if I made a mistake.
Lots of trees show Carrickmacross but again, I don’t see any evidence. Similarly, they show him in Manchester in 1851.
There are 3 Patrick McCabes in Liverpool in 1851 where he enlisted in 1852.
What evidence do you have for his birthplace?
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I don't have any evidence actually as of right now. I was mistaken!