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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Chloebolton22 on Wednesday 16 November 22 22:06 GMT (UK)
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Moderator comment: January 2025 - Three topics have been merged to create this thread. There may be repeated information as a result. Hopefully there are not too many - nor too many loose ends!
I’m trying to find more information about Wilfred Mathews so far I’ve found that he died 30th September 1980. Pennington Lane, Ince and that he was born Wilfred Mathews born 3rd June 1907 Wigan and he was married to Ellen Matthew's. If anyone can help find more information that will be great
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Hi ChloeBolton22
Welcome to RootsChat :)
Would this happen to be your family tree on Ancestry? www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/184820724/person/322412992184/facts
If so, not sure about the parents you are showing for Wilfred. There is this birth which would fit for Wilfred from what you have mentioned:
MATTHEWS, WILFRED PLUMB (mother's maiden name)
GRO Reference: 1907 S Quarter in WIGAN Volume 08C Page 118
Have you checked for father's name on Wilfred's marriage registration to Ellen Ralph (1st Qrt 1932 8c/62)?
Failing to see Wilfred on the 1911 census so far. Have you searched for him on this and the 1921 census? Have you found his 1939 register entry with wife Ellen? Added: Just found them for 1939. He is consistent with a birth date of 3 June 1907.
Monica
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These are the details for that 1907 birth mentioned above with mother showing as Plumb:
Baptism: 13 Nov 1907 St Mark, Newtown, Pemberton, Lancashire, England
Wilfred Matthews - [Child] of James Henry Matthews & Rose Ann
Born: 3 Jun 1907
Abode: 58 Soho Street
Occupation: Collier
Baptised by: J. Hunt Newberry
Register: Baptisms 1901 - 1909, Page 100, Entry 800
Source: Original register at Wigan Archives
www.lan-opc.org.uk/Search/indexp.html
Monica
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And the marriage from the same site:
Marriage: 2 Jan 1932 Christ Church, Ince, Lancashire, England
Wilfred Matthews - 24, Collier, Bachelor, 212 Warrington Road Abram
Ellen Ralph - 22, Spinster, 13 Bird Street
Groom's Father: James Henry Matthews, Collier
Bride's Father: Charles Ralph, Deceased, Collier
Witness: George Allan; Mary Belshaw
Married by Banns by: A. Stout Curate
Register: Marriages 1927 - 1935, Page 140, Entry 280
Source: Original register at Wigan Archives
Monica
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And again from www.lan-opc.org.uk/Search/indexp.html you have parents' marriage:
Marriage: 2 Jun 1906 St Mark, Newtown, Pemberton, Lancashire, England
James Henry Matthews - 26, Collier, Bachelor, 20 Sarginson St.
Roseanna Plum - (X), 22, Spinner, Spinster, 7 Soho St.
Groom's Father: John Matthews, deceased, Collier
Bride's Father: Joseph Plum, deceased, Ship's Captain
Witness: James Orme; Margaret Orme
Married by Banns by: F. C. Shirtcliff Curate
Register: Marriages 1903 - 1914, Page 63, Entry 125
Source: Original register at Wigan Archives
Monica
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Can't easily see them in 1911 so far.
This looks a possible death for mother Rose Ann:
4th Qrt 1921
Rose A Matthews 38 Wigan 8c/ 29
With this likely date range for her death, you should hopefully be able to find her with family on the 1921 census.
Monica
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1921 census free index
Wilfred Mathews b1907 in Newtown, Lancashire, family living Wigan Lancashire
Wilfred, James and Rosaton are on this record.
Spellings as on census index, you would have to view record for full info.
Welcome to Rootschat :)
Cas
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Hello & welcome to Rootschat
Searching the address from the marriage details posted for James Henry Mathew there is this James Matthew on 1901 census
20, Sarginson Street, New Town, Pemberton, Wigan
John Williams Head Single Coal miner hewer Cornwall
Eliza Matthew Boarder Widow Cornwall
James Matthew Boarder Single Labourer in coal mine Pemberton, Lancashire
William Matthew Boarder Single Pemberton, Lancashire
found James & Rose with their child on 1911 census their surname Matthiews
3 children born 1 living 2 died
20 Sargison St Pemberton, Lancashire
Eliza Head Widow 1853 Treneleth Mabe
James Son Married 1880 Coal miner hewer Wigan Lancs
Rose Daughter Married 1884 Lamberhead Green Lancs
Winifred Daughter 1907 Lancs Pemberton
John Williams Boarder Single 1854 Colliery timberman underground Cornwall Madron
Added
link to 1911 census https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWYD-ZLM - has there been a mistake on the 1911 census naming Wilfred as Winifred - the schedule was signed by John WILLIAMS
another possible child
MATTHEWS, JAMES mmn PLUM
GRO Reference: 1911 J Quarter in WIGAN Volume 08C Page 131
edit death for a James Matthews age 0 in Wigan Jun 1911
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Family in 1881 - Pemberton, Lancs
Piece: 3779, Folio: 10, Page Number: 14
John Matthews 46 coal miner, Devon (states Taunton, which is Somerset?)
Eliza Matthews wife 34 Mabe, Cornwall
John Matthews son 16 Mountain Ash, Glamorgan, Wales
Pricilla M. Matthews dau 13 Cornwall
Louisa Matthews dau 11 Mountain Ash
Joseph Matthews son 9 "
Elizabeth E. Matthews dau 7 "
Harriet Matthews dau 5 "
James H. Matthews son 1 Pemberton, Lancs
John Williams lodger, 26 Madron, Cornwall
Mother's maiden name Opie (Added: not checked all children)
Marriages Mar Q 1864 same page
Harris Amelia Merthyr T. 11a 462
Hobbs Henry Merthyr T 11a 462
Matthews John Merthyr T 11a 462
Opey Eliza Merthyr T 11a 462
Cas
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Family in 1881 - Pemberton, Lancs
Piece: 3779, Folio: 10, Page Number: 14
John Matthews 46 coal miner, Devon (states Taunton, which is Somerset?)
Eliza Matthews wife 34 Mabe, Cornwall
John Matthews son 16 Mountain Ash, Glamorgan, Wales
Pricilla M. Matthews dau 13 Cornwall
Louisa Matthews dau 11 Mountain Ash
Joseph Matthews son 9 "
Elizabeth E. Matthews dau 7 "
Harriet Matthews dau 5 "
James H. Matthews son 1 Pemberton, Lancs
John Williams lodger, 26 Madron, Cornwall
Mother's maiden name Opie
Marriages Mar Q 1864 same page
Harris Amelia Merthyr T. 11a 462
Hobbs Henry Merthyr T 11a 462
Matthews John Merthyr T 11a 462
Opey Eliza Merthyr T 11a 462
Cas
For info... 1891 census
20 Sarginson Street, Pemberton, Wigan, Lancashire
John Williams Head Married 1854 Cornwall, coal miner
Eliza Williams dittoed Wife Married 1849 Cornwall
Lina F Mathews Stepdaughter 1870 Cotton spinner Wales
Betsy Mathews Stepdaughter 1874 Cotton spinner Wales
Harriet Mathews Stepdaughter 1876 Doffer in cotton mill Wales
James Mathews Stepson 1880 Pemberton, Lancashire
William Williams Son 1882 Pemberton
added is this James' birth entry?
MATTHEWS, JAMES HENRY mmn HOPEY
GRO Reference: 1879 D Quarter in WIGAN Volume 08C Page 124
and is this William William's birth entry
MATTHEWS, WILLIAM HENRY mmn OPIE
GRO Reference: 1878 M Quarter in WIGAN Volume 08C Page 139
edit 1871 census
Caradoc Street, Llanwonno, Pontypridd, Glamorganshire, Wales
John MATTHEWS Head 1836 Newton Devon, coal miner
Eliza Wife 1844 Mabe Cornwall
John Son 1865 Merthyr Glamorgan, Wales
Prudence Daughter 1868 St Athens Cornwall
Laura Jane Daughter 1870 Llanwono Glamorgan, Wales
James OPIE lodger single 1843 St Athens Cornwall, stone mason
George Miles lodger
1873 Bpt Laura Jane https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X1R1-2PX
1874 Bpt Elizabeth Ellen https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X1R1-G8G
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Chloebolton22 - hope the information already posted has been of some help to you.
If Rose Ann Plum(b) is the mother of the Wilfred Matthews you are looking for this might be her on the census.......
1891 24 Broom Street https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:7W6M-LMM
1901 24 Broom Street Wigan https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9GB-T75
29 Apr 1874 St Peter, Liverpool, Lancashire
Joseph Plumb born 8 Apr
parents Joseph Plumb occ waterman & Harriet
Abode: Scotland Road
18 Aug 1879 All Saints, Wigan, Lancashire
Sarah Ellen Plum born 27 Jul
parents Joseph Plum occ waterman & Harriet
Abode: Lamberhead Green
2 Dec 1883 St John the Divine, Pemberton, Lancashire
Roshannah Plumb born 19 Jun 1882
parents Joseph Plumb Occupation: Waterman & Harriet
Abode: Leader St. Pemberton
above details from Lancashire OPC
PLUMB, JOSEPH mmn PRESCOTT
GRO Reference: 1874 J Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 40
PLUM, SARAH ELLEN mmn PRESCOT
GRO Reference: 1879 S Quarter in WIGAN Volume 08C Page 122
PLUM, ROSANNA mmn PRESCOTT
GRO Reference: 1883 S Quarter in WIGAN Volume 08C Page 115
details from GRO indexes
1881 census https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q272-XRQV
1, Leader Street, Pemberton, Wigan, Lancashire
Joseph Plumb Head Married 1833 Boatman (barge) Northwich, Cheshire
Harriett Plumb Wife Married 1850 Boatman wife Widnes, Lancashire
Alice Ann Plumb Daughter Single 1868 Spinner in cotton mill Liverpool, Lancashire
Mary Elizabeth Plumb Daughter Single 1871 Liverpool, Lancashire
Sarah Ellen Plumb Daughter Single 1880 Pemberton, Lancashire
Burial: 9 Aug 1884 St John the Divine, Pemberton, Lancashire
Joseph Plumb age 51 Abode: Lamberhead Green Pemberton
details from Lancashire OPC
1891 24 Broom Street https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:7W6M-LMM
1901 24 Broom Street Wigan https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9GB-T75
When you are next back online please let us know what you think :)
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Thanks everyone
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So Eliza married the lodger !and had a child with him in 1882 william Williams
So first husband must have died ..or left between 1881 census and 1882
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Hi 👋 I’m tracing to find more on my relatives who are of my nans side of the family
James Henry Matthews
Born 12/08/1880 Pemberton, Lancashire Census 1911 Coal Miner Hewer
Census 1921 Miner (Getter)
Died 24/03/1960 Aged 80
Wigan, Lancashire
Roseanna Plum(b)
Born 19/06/1883 Wigan, Lancashire. Married 02/06/1906 St. Marks, Newtown, Wigan, Lancashire Census 1921 Home Duties
Death Registered Dec Qtr 1921 Aged 38 Wigan, Lancashire
Any information anyone can find of this post. Will be much appreciated and a great help
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Transcript of marriage at Lancashire OPC
Marriage: 2 Jun 1906 St Mark, Newtown, Pemberton, Lancashire
James Henry Matthews - 26, Collier, Bachelor, 20 Sarginson St.
Roseanna Plum - (X), 22, Spinner, Spinster, 7 Soho St.
Groom's Father: John Matthews, deceased, Collier
Bride's Father: Joseph Plum, deceased, Ship's Captain
Witnesses: James Orme; Margaret Orme
Married by Banns by F. C. Shirtcliff Curate
Register: Marriages 1903 - 1914, Page 63, Entry 125
All the advice on your other posts applicable here for getting further forward or back as you wish.
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Hi, thanks for this information so far.
On the last sense at the bottom what did you mean by going back or forward?
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Well, are you trying to find their parents and brothers & sisters.or their children?
So back for ancestors and forward for descendants.
I presume, since you have their exact births that you have their birth certificates.
(If not, where did the birth info come from?)
So you already know their mother’s names?
And can use the GROnsite to find siblings
And use the various name combinations to find them in the census
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Hi,
My Nan has the census of the name that’s how I know this
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Hi,
My Nan has the census of the name that’s how I know this
So indeed, you already know more information than you posted.
(A census doesn’t have birth dates on it. It just has believed ages.)
If there is a specific thing you wanted to find out that you have tried and failed to find yourself what is that? And what have you looked at and ruled out?
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I would like to try to find the family members of jhon matthews along with the plumb family. And their jobs, addresses, weddings or any other places they have lived at or war records
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James Henry Matthews registered Wigan December quarter 1879 vol. 08C page 124
mother's maiden name Hopey should be Opie/Opey
John Matthews married Eliza Opey 1864 Merthyr Tydfil
children with mothers maiden name OPIE
John reg. 1865 Merthyr T
Laura Jane reg Merthyr T 1866 -- died 1868 age 2 reg. Pontypridd
Prudence cannot find registration, bap. 18 June 1868 Penryn Cornwall (listed as Priscilla 1881)
Laura Jane reg. 1870 Pontypridd (Louisa 1881)
Joseph reg Pontypridd 1872
Elizabeth Ellen reg. Pontypridd 1874
Harriet reg. Pontypridd 1875
William Henry reg. Wigan 1878 - died 1879 reg. Wigan
James Henry reg. Wigan 1879 (mmn Hopey)
1871 census Merthyr Tydfil, 6 Carodoc Street.
John Matthews 35 born Newton Devon
Eliza 27 born Male? Cornwall
John 6 born Merthyr T
Prudence 3 born Cornwall
Laura Jane 1
James Opie 28 Stone mason - Lodger born Cornwall (he is possibly Eliza's brother)
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There is a Jn. Matthews with wife and children under workhouse records 1872-1876 Glamorgan
receiving money for food.
Ref: ancestry
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Much information previously found
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=867640.0
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Hey 👋 hope you are all well
I’m looking for help to find 2 relatives who are now dead. Just to know where they lived and their families or children if possible. Or anything that you may find
James Henry Matthews
Born 12/08/1880 Pemberton, Lancashire
Census 1911 Coal Miner Hewer
Census 1921 Miner (Getter)
Died 24/03/1960
Wigan, Lancashire
Roseanna Plum(b)
Born 19/06/1883 Wigan, Lancashire.
Married 02/06/1906 St. Marks,
Newtown, Wigan, Lancashire
Census 1921 Home Duties
Death Registered Dec Qtr 1921
Aged 38 Wigan, Lancashire
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There is a grave reference on find a grave but it is transcribed as ‘John Henry Matthews’ with the same death date.
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01tka/
Looking at the photograph though, it is James but born 1884.
His son, Wilfred is also mentioned.ldo you have this information in 1911?
Are you looking for his descendants as you have 1911 and 1921?
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You are showing census dates, you can get the info you need from the census.
LM
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In 1911, Wilfred, the son of James and Rosanna, is entered as ‘daughter’ and ‘Winifred’ on the census page. ‘Son’ has been crossed out and overwritten with ‘daughter’.
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I think you made a previous request in July unless I am wrong .
LM
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Yes I am looking for his descendants
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I think you made a previous request in July unless I am wrong .
LM
Here it is LM, with several replies :)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=884231.
Moderator comment: topics merged
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Yes I looking for his descendants
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People have found information for you on that other post but you have not commented on it to suggest that you need more information on parts of it. It is not a good idea to start another post on the same topic as it means we spend our time looking for information that you have already been given.
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None of us mind helping but it is double the work if it has already been done, part of the chase is the thrill of finding these things out yourself once you get a bit if information to go on.
Happy hunting
LM
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Yes I am looking for his descendants
Have you looked for children and marriages and so on?
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In 1911, Wilfred, the son of James and Rosanna, is entered as ‘daughter’ and ‘Winifred’ on the census page. ‘Son’ has been crossed out and overwritten with ‘daughter’.
I also thought the names were familiar - posted a snippet showing son crossed out
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=867640.0
Moderator comment: topics merged
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Apologies to researchers if this has been posted in the other threads.
As the headstone mentions ‘our’ parent, presumably Wilfred and Ellen had more than one child. I can see at least two in the indexes but we cannot post names as they may still be living.
Chloe, have you looked for them in the records and for any children?
I see you have left the forum now, i was hoping you would reply. It is best to post what you already know and acknowledge information provided. It saves unnecessary searching.
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I’m looking for help to find 2 relatives who are now dead. Just to know where they lived and their families or children if possible. Or anything that you may find
Information about this family was posted for you here
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=884231.msg7572020#msg7572020
and a lot more here
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=867640.0
Moderator comments: links no longer valid - topics merged
The information posted for you answers your questions. Census records show you where they lived, and their occupations, and the names of everyone in the family.