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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Dave_ on Wednesday 16 November 22 19:19 GMT (UK)
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Looking for info on Hugh Orr poss born 1799 in Aghadowey, he was father of James Orr who married Jane Shirley at Aghadowey in 1845.
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James Orr a weaver, Batchelor father Hugh Orr a Miller,
on his marriage
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Welcome to RootsChat :)
On the 1845 marriage record, James Orr aged 22 living in the townland of Scaltie [sic].
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1845/09289/5363187.pdf
https://www.townlands.ie/londonderry/coleraine/aghadowey/agivey/scalty/
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Jane Shirley was the daughter of Alexander & Elizabeth Shirley. The witness, Robert Shirley, was likely her brother known as "Roadman" Shirley. Jane (Shirley) Orr died in Scotland in 1918- does her death certificate list her mother's maiden name? James Orr also died in Scotland (1917)- does his death certificate list both parents? In both cases the informants, even if one of their many children, may not have known much about the families in Ireland since they grew up in Scotland.
James & Jane named their 4th son Hugh, presumably after James' father. The eldest three sons were Alexander (after Jane's father), Charles (not a name found in Shirley family) and John. The first daughter was Catherine (again not a Shirley name) and the second Elizabeth Jane.
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Hi all thanks for the replies to date.
James and Jane Shirley are my great great great grandparents.
I have lots of links including copy of their marriage cert.
It is the father of James Im looking for.
I know his name was Hugh and I have a death notice for a Hugh Orr from 1869 who was born in 1799.
Any info on this would be appreciated
Thanks
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There is this family tree here which includes some original certificates https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/185405302/person/142432202059/facts
From James Orr's death reg in 1917, it looks like son Samuel did not remember the name of James's mother. Father given as Alexander, which is wrong from what has been mentioned here.
Monica
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There is no mother's maiden surname indexed for Jane Shirlaw Orr in 1918 which makes me think that her mother's details might also be missing on her death registration.
Monica
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The first daughter was Catherine (again not a Shirley name) and the second Elizabeth Jane.
Not seeing a Catherine, but there does look to have been a Margaret https://gw.geneanet.org/bighaich47?lang=en&pz=henry+devlin&nz=machon&p=margaret&n=orr&oc=3
In 1871, Margaret, daughter, is showing as born in Ireland c. 1852 (Dirraw?). Could this be the name of James's mother?
Monica
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Sorry, eldest daughter was Margaret (Catherine was her great-great-granddaughter). The first 12 children were born in Ireland and the youngest in Carluke, Lanrkshire.
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... It is the father of James Im looking for.
I know his name was Hugh and I have a death notice for a Hugh Orr from 1869 who was born in 1799.
Death notice or death registration? Exactly what details are there?
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You have so much research in this area ;) Have you come across a Hugh Orr, miller?
Monica
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Everyone knows everyone else here in Aghadowey ;)
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Helps with research ;D
Some family researchers have James's birth c. 1823 in Scalti, Aghadowey www.graham-clan.co.uk/thefamilytree/getperson.php?personID=I13797&tree=tree1
Monica
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Helps with research ;D
Some family researchers have James's birth c. 1823 in Scalti, Aghadowey www.graham-clan.co.uk/thefamilytree/getperson.php?personID=I13797&tree=tree1
Monica
Too bad they've moved Scalty to the centre of Aghadowey Parish instead of where it belongs but then Google Maps has also moved Glenullin from Errigal Parish (the far side of Garvagh) into Aghadowey Parish ::) I was actually in the centre of Aghadowey this evening giving a talk and Scalty certainly wasn't there!
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The Hugh Orr who died 1869 at age 70 in Ballymoney, born 1799.
Irish geneolgy
This is a possible timeframe for being the father of James Orr born 1823 who married Jane Shirley in 1845?
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The Hugh Orr who died 1869 at age 70 in Ballymoney, born 1799.
Irish geneolgy
This is a possible timeframe for being the father of James Orr born 1823 who married Jane Shirley in 1845?
Exactly what details are on the death registration? (you said death notice but seems to be death registration you mean)
James & Jane's last two children born in Ireland were born at Killymaddy (all others born pre-registration) with their father's occupation listed as weaver which would fit with Ballymoney registration district.
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The Orr family is a puzzle right enough.
I think Im best starting with sons and daughters of James Orr/ Jane Shirley.
I would welcome any input.
Im grandson of David Johnson Orr (1905-1989)
Thanks again for assistance
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I want to explore a few documents before posting too much but think I may have some new leads on Hugh Orr. One thing I think that is mis-leading you is James Orr marriage certificate but more in a bit.
Added- you still haven't given details of the death registration for that Hugh Orr- exact place of death (and usual residence if different), occupation and details of informant are crutial.
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Re the death notice for Hugh Orr it is in the civil records list.
Year of death 1869
Age at death 70
Ballymoney.
I tried to send you copy to no avail
Re James Orr/Jane Shirley I have a copy of their marriage cert.
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I have a copy of the marriage certificate from Aghadowey Presbyterian Church.
You seem to think the extract from the civil registrations is a death notice but a death notice is what appears in the newspaper to announce a death.
Unfortunately, Hugh Orr's death certificate in not yet viewable on the Irish Genealogy site so you can either wait for it to be added (it will be eventually) or go to GRONI site, register then pay for a few credits and then view the registration which will show exact place of death, occupation & details of informant.
I can tell you that the Hugh Orr in question died 21 July 1869 in Ballymoney registration district and Ballymoney sub-district (not Dirraw sub-district as I'd hoped).
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Did a bit more digging which is confirming my suspicions. Firstly, I got Hugh Orr's 1869 detail registration (PM me with an email address if you'd like a copy).
Hugh Orr died in Ballymoney Workhouse (unfortunately usual or former address not listed), married, labourer, cancer of kidney (1 yr.), informant is not a relative as I'd hoped.
Now, starting with the 1845 marriage certificate -
1) James' residence is Scalty which isn't far from Rhee. This is where he was living at the time of the marriage but it's unlikely he was born there. It's more likely that he came into the area to work and met Jane Shirley. I think he was from Co. Antrim or more exactly probably from Finvoy or vicinity. More on this in a moment.
2) James' father is listed as Hugh Orr, a miller. There is no indication of any such miller in the Aghadowey area with this name (and there was no mill in Scalty). I think he was a labourer, perhaps a weaver, but not a miller.
I should note that Jane Shirley's uncle, Valentine Shirley, married Ann Orr (daughter of Paul Orr & Isabelle Boyd) but I can find no connection between James Orr and Paul Orr. I have, however, found quite a few possible connections to James Orr in the Ballymoney area (remember this is where James & Jane Orr lived before moving to Scotland). It's unfortunate that most of their children were born before birth registration started in Ireland so we can't yet be sure where they lived before 1864. The baptismal register for Aghadowey Presbyterian Church (the Shirley's church) starts 1855 and doesn't record any of the children (another reason I think they were in County Antrim pre-1864).
I'm still trying to find Hugh Orr's wife (death registration says married) and a few other bits before posting everything.
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You are making progress... ;)
Monica
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I only started this journey on 18th Oct 22....I am amazed and thankul for all the feedback.
I could not send PM but a big thank you for your help.
I will now follow leads in Ballymoney
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You'll need to remove your email address (or else a moderator might do it) but will send the certificate and Orr details when I finish typing. I need to refresh my memory of the latest edition of the Orr/Shirley family history in case I've missed something.
If you've just started on the Orr family just wait until you start researching the Shirleys. They were French Huguenots who settled in Ireland and have been in the Rhee for many generations now. They helped develop the hand-loom weaving industry in Aghadowey (once known worldwide for the quality of its linen) and Valentine Shirley was said to have made linen for undergarments of Queen Victoria.
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Thank you.
Orrs are my late mums side.
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Thank you.
Orrs are my late mums side.
Hi I believe that we are related via Hugh Orr an James Orr and Jane Shirlaw/Shirley
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Hi I believe that we are related via Hugh Orr an James Orr and Jane Shirlaw/Shirley
The Shirleys name is also Shirlow or Shirly in this area but haven't come across Shirlaw before (perhaps more common in Scotland).
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One possible marriage
Hugh Orr and Margaret Brown on 09 Dec 1819, Ballymoney Parish, Antrim, Ireland.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/2:1:MCKT-YC4?lang=en
I have attached this source to Hugh's tree on FamilySearch and Margaret's death record has come up
Name Margaret Orr
Sex Female
Age 79
Birth Year (Estimated) 1791
Marital Status Widowed
Occupation Widow Of A Millar
Event Type Death
Event Date 10 Oct 1870
Event Place Ireland
Event Place (Original) Ballymoney, Antrim, Ireland
Event Place Note Workhouse
https://www.familysearch.org/en/tree/person/sources/MCKT-YCB
Maybe he worked at the Balnamore Mill or the Ballymoney 'Old Mill'?
https://www.explorecausewaycoastandglens.com/blog/from-store-to-still-gin-distillery-planned-at-old-ballymoney-mill
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Thank you, that slots in well with what I have so far.
Margaret & Hugh (Alexander) Orr as the parents