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Research in Other Countries => United States of America => Topic started by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 19:04 BST (UK)

Title: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 19:04 BST (UK)
Hope this is in the correct section...

Could anyone please advise how to research a murder (USA early-twentieth century), please? Is there a searchable, online database containing information of this kind?

Looking for info on Dennis Cummins, whom, it is believed, was murdered in the USA (state unknown) some time between 1909 and 1916.

Dennis was from Ireland, and married Kate Curtin, Cork City, in September 1909. It is believed he traveled to the US (reasons unknown) where he was murdered.

Widow Kate, remarried in Cork City, August 1916, to Jeremiah Long.

I appreciate info is scant, but any advice/assistance with this very much appreciated.

With thanks,

P.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: aghadowey on Tuesday 28 June 22 19:10 BST (UK)
Each state keeps it's own vital records and they started doing so at various dates which can make your search more difficult.
Start by finding when he left Ireland/arrived in U.S. For that period there are likely passenger manifests of U.S. arrivals giving a destination/person traveling to in U.S.
Newspapers liked to report murders and gruesome deaths so there might have been reports in local or national papers. Have you checked Irish or British papers in case the story was reported on that side of the Atlantic?

Added- how does wife Kate appear in 1911 census? married? widow?
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 19:58 BST (UK)
Thank you for this.

A quick search on the back of your kind advice is revealing the family were still at home in Ireland at the time of the 1911 census. Obviously this now narrows down Dennis' (recorded as Denis, on census form) possible date of death between 1911 and 1916.

In answer to your question, I have not as yet checked newspapers for reports of the death.

Are ships' passenger manifests searchable online (apologies if this is a daft question)?

Many thanks,

P
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: *Sandra* on Tuesday 28 June 22 20:12 BST (UK)

There are many records free on family search - register for free.

https://www.familysearch.org/en/

A list of the collections:-

https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/list?count=20

Sandra
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: shellyesq on Tuesday 28 June 22 20:56 BST (UK)
There is a Denis Cummins, born St. Ann's, Cork, who died in WWI in France on 8 May 1915.  He was killed in action.  His widow was Kate, and the pension ledger says she remarried to Jeremiah Long on 17 Aug. 1916. 
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 21:22 BST (UK)
There is a Denis Cummins, born St. Ann's, Cork, who died in WWI in France on 8 May 1915.  He was killed in action.  His widow was Kate, and the pension ledger says she remarried to Jeremiah Long on 17 Aug. 1916.

Oh my goodness! This must be him. That is quite a shock and a revelation as family legend had it that he had been murdered in the US. It makes you wonder how these 'stories' become so distorted and inaccurate.

Thank you so much. May I ask the source of the pension ledger you cite?

P.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: shellyesq on Tuesday 28 June 22 21:30 BST (UK)
It is on Fold 3.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 21:49 BST (UK)
It is on Fold 3.

Please excuse my ignorance, but I do not know what 'Fold 3' is/means.

With thanks,

P
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: shellyesq on Tuesday 28 June 22 21:52 BST (UK)
fold3.com is a subscription website with historical military records and other genealogical records.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 22:02 BST (UK)
fold3.com is a subscription website with historical military records and other genealogical records.

Thank you.

Thanks everyone. I really appreciate all your kind help.

Regards,

P.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: scotmum on Tuesday 28 June 22 22:23 BST (UK)
His entry on CWG:

https://www.rootschat.com/links/01rnq/


Looks like he was a Sergeant at time of death.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 22:24 BST (UK)
His entry on CWG:

https://www.rootschat.com/links/01rnq/


Looks like he was a Sergeant at time of death.

Excellent. Thank you.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: scotmum on Tuesday 28 June 22 22:35 BST (UK)
His entry on https://irelandsgreatwardead.ie/the-archive/ has him as Corporal.

His medal card https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D2041111

There were a few Den(n)is Cummins who served in WW1. Were the parents of your Denis called Edward and Mary? If yes, his 1907 attestation papers can be viewed on FindMyPast.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: RJ137 on Tuesday 28 June 22 22:52 BST (UK)
United Kingdom, British Armed Forces and Overseas Vital Records, 1761-2005

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:68FP-CM6L
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: scotmum on Tuesday 28 June 22 23:04 BST (UK)
I am now somewhat confused:

Marriage

Party 1 Name   JOSEPH CUMMINS
Party 2 Name   KATE CURTIN
Date of Event   25 September 1909
Group Registration ID   1923024
SR District/Reg Area   Cork


Sorted, Denis' Kate was a Catherine:

Party 1 Name   DENIS CUMMINS
Party 2 Name   CATHERINE CURTIN
Date of Event   20 September 1909
Group Registration ID   1919982
SR District/Reg Area   Cork


Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 23:07 BST (UK)
I am now somewhat confused:

Marriage

Party 1 Name   JOSEPH CUMMINS
Party 2 Name   KATE CURTIN
Date of Event   25 September 1909
Group Registration ID   1923024
SR District/Reg Area   Cork

Who was Joseph?

The marriage was 20th September 1909, between Denis Cummins, and Catherine (aka Kate) Curtin.

P.
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Tuesday 28 June 22 23:07 BST (UK)

I am now somewhat confused:

Marriage

Party 1 Name   JOSEPH CUMMINS
Party 2 Name   KATE CURTIN
Date of Event   25 September 1909
Group Registration ID   1923024
SR District/Reg Area   Cork


Sorted, Denis' Kate was a Catherine:

Party 1 Name   DENIS CUMMINS
Party 2 Name   CATHERINE CURTIN
Date of Event   20 September 1909
Group Registration ID   1919982
SR District/Reg Area   Cork


:) That's the one.  :)
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: aghadowey on Wednesday 29 June 22 10:27 BST (UK)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1909/10030/5648488.pdf

Listed as Catherine but signed as Katie  ;)
Title: Re: Help with Researching a Murder
Post by: Peter J on Wednesday 29 June 22 13:18 BST (UK)
I’d actually missed that. That’s a nice little observation. Thank you.