RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Derry (Londonderry) => Topic started by: Kristen2344 on Thursday 09 June 22 15:54 BST (UK)
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Hello,
I am new to this, so I hope that I am following proper protocol.
I am attempting to do some geological research on my 3rd great-grandmother, Agnes (Ferguson) Sandersfield.
Agnes Ferguson: born 15 Nov 1828, Gortnessy Londonderry, died 5 Nov 1907 Flint, MI USA
married (date unknown, place unknown) to:
Johann "John" Berend Sandersfield who was born in 1823 in Germany. Johann's parents were:
-Carsten Sandersfield 1795-1835 (records say he died in the Baltic Sea, I'd love to learn more about that)
-Maria Blumenthal b. 1796
documents point to Agnes' parents being:
Daniel Ferguson b. 24 Aug 1789 Glasgow, Scotland
Hannah Hassen b. abt 1792 Scotland
disclaimer: I am not certain of the parents detail.
I do have DNA confirmation that Agnes had the following siblings:
Andrew Ferguson b 8 Dec 1822 Londonderry, d. 19 Jun 1894 Michigan, USA
Jane Ferguson b. 1829 Gortnessy, Londonderry, d. 1893 Ireland
based on documentation, it is likely Agnes had the following siblings as well:
-John Ferguson 1810-1905
-Hannah Ferguson 1816
-Robert Ferguson 1822-1867
Agnes and Johann Sandersfield were parents to the following children:
-Maria Sandersfield b. Jan 1859 Ireland
-Hannah Sandersfield b. 28 May 1860 New York, USA
-Agnes Sandersfield b. 2 Jul 1862 New York, USA
-John B. Sandersfield b. abt 1865 New York, USA
-Robert Sandersfield b. 9 Nov 1866 Michigan, USA
-Anna Sandersfield b. abt 1869 Michigan, USA
-Henry Sandersfield b. Oct 1869 Michigan, USA
What I am hoping to discover:
1. Confirmed parentage for Agnes as well as their parents
2. Marriage record for Agnes Ferguson/Johann Sandersfield
3. Emigration information (based on children's birth locations, they arrived in New York between 1859 and 1860)
4. Any additional historical information on the family, origins, culture, etc. I know very little of Irish history and would love to learn more!
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Just to avoid duplication of effort there are two long threads already on Ferguson families in Co Derry
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=811819.0
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=557435.0
In view of the precise queries from OP perhaps it would be best for her queries for Daniel Ferguson and Hannah Hassan to be dealt with on this thread.
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The link showing the death of Johann Sandersfield shows that his mother was Mina Bloomingdale.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&q.anyPlace=germany&q.givenName=johann&q.surname=sandersfield&q.surname.exact=on
Bloomingdale sounds a teensy bit not German unless it is a transliteration.
In the north of Germany near Denmark there were lots of fisherfolk who fished across the North Sea to the north-east of England around Grimsby/Hull. Also in the Baltic. I have relations by marriage who have Danish connections and whose names are Mina.....not short for anything, just Mina.
ETA from FS it may be that the name was formerly Bloomingthal or Bluminger. If she is also German then her first name may be Wilhemine
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Marriage record for Agnes Ferguson/Johann Sandersfield
As I already posted on earlier thread-
"No sign of a marriage in Ireland so more likely they married in U.S. or possibly Canada if Agnes arrived from Ireland to U.S. via Canada."
Confirmed parentage for Agnes as well as their parents
See these two topics-
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=498742.0
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=442233.0
The Fergusons seem to have been Presbyterian and were likely Ulster Scots background (lots online to read). You seem to think Agnes Ferguson's parents were both born in Scotland but the link to Scotland could equally be a generation or two back.
A Daniel Ferguson was listed in Tithe Applotment Books at Gortnessy in 1834.
Another Ferguson topic here-
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=463027.0
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The link showing the death of Johann Sandersfield shows that his mother was Mina Bloomingdale.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&q.anyPlace=germany&q.givenName=johann&q.surname=sandersfield&q.surname.exact=on
Bloomingdale sounds a teensy bit not German unless it is a transliteration.
In the north of Germany near Denmark there were lots of fisherfolk who fished across the North Sea to the north-east of England around Grimsby/Hull. Also in the Baltic. I have relations by marriage who have Danish connections and whose names are Mina.....not short for anything, just Mina.
ETA from FS it may be that the name was formerly Bloomingthal or Bluminger. If she is also German then her first name may be Wilhemine
VERY INTERESTING, thank you! Both my Aunt and I have unexplained Danish ethnicity on our DNA test (which I know isn't 100% reliable, but maybe it's not as far off as we had thought!)
Most records have her as Maria or Mariah., and her father's name as Carsten Blumenthal, born and died in Harmenhausen (Berne), Niedersachsen, Germany. She had a son named Carsten Sandersfield, so this would make sense. But now you have me thinking.... Here is a helpful website with Sandersfield lineage.
http://www.diers-friesen.de/dateienmhp/pafliste/pafg596.htm#12631
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In the 1880 US Census JB Sanderfield says both parents are from Germany.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&q.anyPlace=germany&q.givenName=johann&q.surname=sandersfield&q.surname.exact=ond
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Re 4. Thanks for the Sandersfeld Germany file.
Re
documents point to Agnes' parents being:
Daniel Ferguson b. 24 Aug 1789 Glasgow, Scotland
Hannah Hassen b. abt 1792 Scotland
Have you got documents to support these births please? The first one seems very precise as though from a birth certificate. If so what are the parents names for Daniel?
Here is a website to poke around in.
http://www.billmacafee.com/index.htm
There are some older files showing muster rolls etc from 17th century and details from the 18th century. I would think/feel that Agnes' parents may have been born in Ireland possibly to Irish parents.
There are Hassans on this roll and quite a few Fergusons. NB the idea that it may have been O'Hasson.
http://www.billmacafee.com/1740returns/1740religiousreturnsulstername.pdf
'2417 5 Hassan O'Hasson James Antrim Toome Manybrooks Not specified Not specified
5429 853 Hassan Hassan John L'Derry Loughinsholin Desertmartin Not specified Not specified
6095 1519 Hassan O Hassan Peter L'Derry Loughinsholin Kilcronaghan Not specified Not specified'
Re this birth
-Maria Sandersfield b. Jan 1859 Ireland
Where has this come from please?
The townland of Gortnessy is described here
https://www.townlands.ie/londonderry/tirkeeran/clondermot/lough-enagh/gortnessy/
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The townland of Gortnessy is described here
https://www.townlands.ie/londonderry/tirkeeran/clondermot/lough-enagh/gortnessy/
Here it is also on OpenStreetMap, indicating its location in relation to Derry/Londonderry city.
https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/5136691#map=13/54.9964/-7.2630
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On this record on FS there is an Agnes Ferguson emigrating to US (New York) on the ship Thetis from Belfast. She arrives on 22/10/1847.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:KDXX-N5F
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On this record on FS there is an Agnes Ferguson emigrating to US (New York) on the ship Thetis from Belfast. She arrives on 22/10/1847.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:KDXX-N5F
Certainly a possibility but probably no way to confirm. Since Agnes and other family members seem to have ended up in Michigan it equally possible they arrived first in Canada and then made their way to U.S. One branch of my family had several children that went first to Ontario before settling to Michigan around this same period.
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On this record on FS there is an Agnes Ferguson emigrating to US (New York) on the ship Thetis from Belfast. She arrives on 22/10/1847.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:KDXX-N5F
Certainly a possibility but probably no way to confirm. Since Agnes and other family members seem to have ended up in Michigan it equally possible they arrived first in Canada and then made their way to U.S. One branch of my family had several children that went first to Ontario before settling to Michigan around this same period.
Three of the children, after the one born in Ireland were born in New York according to the info from Kristen2344 but take your point as several of mine were part of a chain migration to Philadelphia in the period and one came through Canada finally to Kentucky.
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Maria Sandersfield b. Jan 1859 Ireland died on 19/7/1884 aged '25 years, 6 months and 13 days' - from the gravestone. So would it be 13/1/1859?
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/77249595/maria-sandersfield
She married 3/10/1884. Seems to have been known as Marie.
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Maria Sandersfield b. Jan 1859 Ireland died on 19/7/1884 aged '25 years, 6 months and 13 days' - from the gravestone. So would it be 13/1/1859?
Could be, but the gravestone does not say she was born in Ireland.
Does the OP have some other details?
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I wonder who this is?
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:FC4C-H5L
John B Sandersfield marries Nancy Ferguson in Detroit, Wayne Michigan on 3/9/1856.
Nancy/Agnes can be interchangeable
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I wonder who this is?
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:FC4C-H5L
John B Sandersfield marries Nancy Ferguson in Detroit, Wayne Michigan on 3/9/1856.
Nancy/Agnes can be interchangeable
Very good chance that's the 'missing' marriage. As I mentioned earlier (perhaps on other thread?) there was no marriage in civil registrations in Ireland. Bride Nancy Ferguson from Londonderry, witness an Andrew Ferguson (I think OP said there was a brother Andrew). Since marriage took place in Detroit it doesn't rule out her entry to US via Canada.
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Maria Sandersfield b. Jan 1859 Ireland died on 19/7/1884 aged '25 years, 6 months and 13 days' - from the gravestone. So would it be 13/1/1859?
Could be, but the gravestone does not say she was born in Ireland.
Does the OP have some other details?
I think she must as there is one child who was born in Ireland, some in New York and the rest in Michigan.
Her marriage registration does have that Ireland is her place of birth.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939J-4PBW-R?i=435&cc=1810350
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Unfortunately sometimes information given in official records isn't accurate so I'm still doubtful that they had a child born in Ireland in 1859. That Detroit marriage makes it even more unlikely that any children were born in Ireland.
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I wonder who this is?
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:FC4C-H5L
John B Sandersfield marries Nancy Ferguson in Detroit, Wayne Michigan on 3/9/1856.
Nancy/Agnes can be interchangeable
Very good chance that's the 'missing' marriage. As I mentioned earlier (perhaps on other thread?) there was no marriage in civil registrations in Ireland. Bride Nancy Ferguson from Londonderry, witness an Andrew Ferguson (I think OP said there was a brother Andrew). Since marriage took place in Detroit it doesn't rule out her entry to US via Canada.
Perhaps a muted (don't want to wake the cat or the neighbours) Irish/NZ 'yay' is in order!
Yes there was a brother Andrew.
and yes Canada looks more likely.
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Unfortunately sometimes information given in official records isn't accurate so I'm still doubtful that they had a child born in Ireland in 1859. That Detroit marriage makes it even more unlikely that any children were born in Ireland.
Tend to agree but could happen.
Marriage 3 October 1856
Marie born January 1859 (say conceived April 1858?)
(actually perhaps she lost a child between Oct 1856 and April 1858 and went home ......)
I'll keep looking.
1880 census says she was born in Ireland.
I will look at Andrew.....she may have followed him over to the US.
ETA From quick research it seems that there were other Ferguson families from Ireland residing in Michigan, some may be of the parents generation ie born late 1700s in Ireland.
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I wonder who this is?
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:FC4C-H5L
John B Sandersfield marries Nancy Ferguson in Detroit, Wayne Michigan on 3/9/1856.
Nancy/Agnes can be interchangeable
Very good chance that's the 'missing' marriage. As I mentioned earlier (perhaps on other thread?) there was no marriage in civil registrations in Ireland. Bride Nancy Ferguson from Londonderry, witness an Andrew Ferguson (I think OP said there was a brother Andrew). Since marriage took place in Detroit it doesn't rule out her entry to US via Canada.
Perhaps a muted (don't want to wake the cat or the neighbours) Irish/NZ 'yay' is in order!
Yes there was a brother Andrew.
and yes Canada looks more likely.
Great sleuthing, shanreagh :D :D
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Thank you!
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This entry for a John B Sandersfeld shows that this person was in New York, in business in the period 1861 to 1864 and this covers the time that the New York children were born. The entry says 'Milk 484 9th Avenue'
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:6ZMF-NFFD
The address is near the Garment district and Hudson yards.
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Re 4. Thanks for the Sandersfeld Germany file.
Re
documents point to Agnes' parents being:
Daniel Ferguson b. 24 Aug 1789 Glasgow, Scotland
Hannah Hassen b. abt 1792 Scotland
This is what I have as well, and I can prove this given that I DNA match to other descendendents of Agnes' siblings, but I cannot find any DNA proof of Daniel or Hannah's parentage.
Have you got documents to support these births please? The first one seems very precise as though from a birth certificate. If so what are the parents names for Daniel?
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:CM7D-PQ3Z Here is the baptism record for Daniel. I'm honestly not sure where the specific date come, other than a "hint" on ancestry. I'm still learning my way through all of this.
Here is a website to poke around in.
http://www.billmacafee.com/index.htm
There are some older files showing muster rolls etc from 17th century and details from the 18th century. I would think/feel that Agnes' parents may have been born in Ireland possibly to Irish parents.
There are Hassans on this roll and quite a few Fergusons. NB the idea that it may have been O'Hasson.
http://www.billmacafee.com/1740returns/1740religiousreturnsulstername.pdf
'2417 5 Hassan O'Hasson James Antrim Toome Manybrooks Not specified Not specified
5429 853 Hassan Hassan John L'Derry Loughinsholin Desertmartin Not specified Not specified
6095 1519 Hassan O Hassan Peter L'Derry Loughinsholin Kilcronaghan Not specified Not specified'
Re this birth
-Maria Sandersfield b. Jan 1859 Ireland
Where has this come from please?
All of Maria's US census records (1870, 1880), as well as her marriage and death records indicate she was born in Ireland. I'm not sure how to link documents from my ancestry account.
The townland of Gortnessy is described here
https://www.townlands.ie/londonderry/tirkeeran/clondermot/lough-enagh/gortnessy/
Thank you! I'll check this out! I really appreciate the help and insight.
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thank you so much!
This entry for a John B Sandersfeld shows that this person was in New York, in business in the period 1861 to 1864 and this covers the time that the New York children were born. The entry says 'Milk 484 9th Avenue'
https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:6ZMF-NFFD
The address is near the Garment district and Hudson yards.
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Unfortunately sometimes information given in official records isn't accurate so I'm still doubtful that they had a child born in Ireland in 1859. That Detroit marriage makes it even more unlikely that any children were born in Ireland.
Tend to agree but could happen.
Marriage 3 October 1856
Marie born January 1859 (say conceived April 1858?)
(actually perhaps she lost a child between Oct 1856 and April 1858 and went home ......)
I'll keep looking.
Interesting you should point this all out, because her brother Andrew first came to America in 1848, then returned to Ireland in 1859, married his wife in Ireland in May 1859, and returned to America shortly after. Perhaps Agnes was with him for these journeys?
https://archive.org/details/bad0921.0001.001.umich.edu/page/579/mode/2up?view=theater
1880 census says she was born in Ireland.
I will look at Andrew.....she may have followed him over to the US.
ETA From quick research it seems that there were other Ferguson families from Ireland residing in Michigan, some may be of the parents generation ie born late 1700s in Ireland.
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Here is a manifest showing and Agnes and Robert Ferguson arriving to USA in 1849.
Possibly the siblings?
https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=7488&h=1023478099&tid=180404173&pid=132352311402&queryId=6ca6e529200620b1b8d8dd1d74961bbe&usePUB=true&_phsrc=BCy17757&_phstart=successSource
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From 1900 Census record:
Name: Agnes Sandersfield
[Agnes Sandersfeld]
Age: 72
Birth Date: Nov 1827
Birthplace: Ireland
Home in 1900: Vienna, Genesee, Michigan
Sheet Number: 1
Number of Dwelling in Order of Visitation: 20
Family Number: 20
Race: White
Gender: Female
Immigration Year: 1860
[1865]
Relation to Head of House: Head
Marital Status: Widowed
Father's Birthplace: Ireland
Mother's Birthplace: Ireland
Mother: number of living children: 5
Mother: How many children: 7
Years in US: 40
Occupation: Farmer
Months Not Employed: 0
Can Read: Yes
Can Write: Yes
Can Speak English: Yes
House Owned or Rented: Own
Home Free or Mortgaged: F
Farm or House: F
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I am still having no luck whatsoever identifying the parents of Hannah Hassen, wife of Daniel Ferguson.
Daniel's stats:
Daniel Ferguson, b. 24 Aug Argyll, Strathclyde, Scotland
d. 17 Sep 1862 Gortnessy, Londonderry Ireland
Family trees indicate a marriage to a Hannah Hassen in 1810 in Ireland
biographical sketch of their son Andrew reads: "born in Londonderry in July 1822, son of Daniel Ferguson and Hannah (Hassin) Ferguson who were both natives of Ireland though of Scotch origin"
can anyone here help with birth or death records for Hannah, or confirmation of her parentage?
Thank you!