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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: fossey on Tuesday 07 June 22 17:18 BST (UK)
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I am not sure I am on the right family. I have a Joseph Ditchfield, (i know he is right as my great grandfather) can not find his birth registered anywhere, but found a baptism in 1847 giving his mother and father as Thomas and Alice. I have his marriage cert stating father as shoemaker in 1867 at Edge Hill church West Darby Lancashire. I have Thomas and Alice Pye marriage cert giving Thomas as his father a labourer in 1844 at Warrington.
I have Josephs brother Henry and other family members on GRO with the mothers maiden name as Pye /Pie and have them in 51 and 61 living together, father had died by 61. Its him I am struggling with. I have him Thomas christened in 1824 giving Thomas and Elizabeth as parents. I thought I had his parents marriage Thomas Ditchfield and Elizabeth Gill, but now I am not sure it is right.
Thomas the shoemaker was living in 41 with another family at Dog House Lane West Derby and the Thomas and Elizabeth living at Much Woolton with their other kids (or at least I think it is). How do I know where to go from here please. As GRO gave the youngest child Roseanna as MMN as Brownbill and if that is right the son Henry Brownbill has her name. But I dont know if this Thomas and Elizabeth are the rights ones.
Any advice on where to go to find this out would be great, thanks Angela
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on the 1841 census for the Ditchfield family, there's also an Alice and Mary Brownbill
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQG4-D5Z
baptism
Childwall 3 May 1835 Mary daughter of Alice Brownbill, spinster
Alice's marriage 14 May 1843
James Watkinson full bach labourer Woolton father Thomas Aitbury gardener
Alice Brownbill full spinster Woolton father Henry Brownbill labourer
witnesses Thomas & Elizabeth Ditchfield, all marked.
Possible burial
13 May 1858 St Mary the Virgin, Prescot
Thomas Ditchfield age 32
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Basically - you are looking for the parents of Thomas Ditchfield b 1822 Warrington as per the 1851 census - is that correct?
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NF2G-FF7
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GRO online has a birth for a Thomas Ditchfield March qtr 1847 Warrington - mmn Pye. If all his siblings are mmn Pye perhaps they had a change of mind about his name when he was baptised hence Joseph.
1851 etc shows his birthplace as Warrington
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was just about to suggest that birth reg as well. The 1847 baptism for Joseph gives date of birth as 26 Dec 1846 so more than likely registered march qtr 1847.
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1841 census for the Ditchfields has Henry aged 14
Baptism Warrington 15 Jan 1826
Henry Browbill son of Thomas, labourer, & Elizabeth Ditchfield of Manchester Lane
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1841 census for the Ditchfields has Henry aged 14
Baptism Warrington 15 Jan 1826
Henry Browbill son of Thomas, labourer, & Elizabeth Ditchfield of Manchester Lane
Where would I find her maiden name, as I have an Elizabeth Gill, but if this is the right family her maiden name would be Brownbill.
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GRO online has a birth for a Thomas Ditchfield March qtr 1847 Warrington - mmn Pye. If all his siblings are mmn Pye perhaps they had a change of mind about his name when he was baptised.
1851 etc shows his birthplace as Warrington
All the census up to 21 states Warrington as his birth place. Is that a common thing to change a name after baptism, then he goes back to that name (Joseph) afterwards, as they had another child called Thomas who was born 1854.
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on the 1841 census for the Ditchfield family, there's also an Alice and Mary Brownbill
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQG4-D5Z
baptism
Childwall 3 May 1835 Mary daughter of Alice Brownbill, spinster
Alice's marriage 14 May 1843
James Watkinson full bach labourer Woolton father Thomas Aitbury gardener
Alice Brownbill full spinster Woolton father Henry Brownbill labourer
witnesses Thomas & Elizabeth Ditchfield, all marked.
Possible burial
13 May 1858 St Mary the Virgin, Prescot
Thomas Ditchfield age 32
Thanks yes I noticed that name too, just wish I knew if this was the right family, got to be a clue in there somewhere.
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It's not unknown to register a child with one name and then baptise them with another. Perhaps parents had a difference of opinion?
Maiden name is not shown as a matter of course on baptisms. There are some detailed registers that do show the maiden name but not this one.
Alice Brownbill's father is Henry. A common naming pattern is first son after father's father and second son after mother's father. Their second son seems to be Henry with a version of Brownbill as a middle name.
1841 census shows Thomas as not born in county.
Possible burial
Childwall 16 Nov 1848 Thomas Ditchfield 48 Woolton
so this death reg
Thomas Ditchfield 48 dec qtr 1848 Prescot vol 20 pg 671
also
Elizabeth Ditchfield 52 june qtr 1851 prescot vol 20 pg 633
burial Childwall 11 May 1851 of Much Woolton
There are Ditchfields across the county boundary in Lymm. Possible baptism?
19 Nov 1797 Thomas son of Thomas & Susannah Ditchfield, date of birth 14 Oct.
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There are Ditchfields across the county boundary in Lymm. Possible baptism?
19 Nov 1797 Thomas son of Thomas & Susannah Ditchfield, date of birth 14 Oct.
I have links to the Ditchfields in Lymm and think this Thomas was buried in Lymm in 1843 aged 46, but it's a distant branch so I haven't checked it out 100%.
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yes, just found that burial - Thomas noted as living in Runcorn. Oh well.
The 1851 census for the Ditchfields isn't very clear, transcribed on FamilySearch as Duchfield
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGYL-HKS
Alice Pinnington is a married daughter
marriage reg Robert Pennington sept qtr 1850 West Derby vol 20 pg 1015 with Alice Ditchfield on the same page - Lancashire bmd shows the marriage as taking place in Childwall All Saints.
Elizabeth is shown as Betty born Farnworth
Possible baptism
Farnworth 11 May 1800 Bettey daughter of Henry & Bettey Brownbill
Other baptisms in Farnworth to Henry & Betty/Elizabeth Brownbill
Henry 1802
John 1804
William 1806
Joseph 1809
Alice 1812
John 1815 - Henry noted as labourer of Widnes
Richard 1816 Henry noted as farmer of Widnes on this baptism. Richard buried in 1834 address Gatacre.
John 1819
Marriage in Warrington 26 Dec 1796 Henry Brownbill & Betty Lucas
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Brownbill was his middle name
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:J7KW-C2X
The marriage to Elizabeth Gill was in Wigan 1821
The fact you cannot find another marriage is down to the possibility they have not been transcribed
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all this is within 5 miles from where I live
Ditchfield
Brownbill
Pye - all these families still here
would you like me to contact a Ditchfield to read this thread ?...
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possibility for the marriage?
Daresbury Cheshire 19 Nov 1820 Thomas Ditchfield & Betty Brandwell both otp both marked, witnesses Thomas Hall & Stephen?
Wonder if Brandwell is a mishearing of Brownhill? Not finding a candidate for Betty Brandwell in the area.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N42X-G25
Register image shows Henry's middle name as Browbill, no n.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89GF-B1NJ?i=424
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possibility for the marriage?
Daresbury Cheshire 19 Nov 1820 Thomas Ditchfield & Betty Brandwell both otp both marked, witnesses Thomas Hall & Stephen?
Wonder if Brandwell is a mishearing of Brownhill? Not finding a candidate for Betty Brandwell in the area.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N42X-G25
Register image shows Henry's middle name as Browbill, no n.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89GF-B1NJ?i=424
Daresbury now adjoins Runcorn
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all this is within 5 miles from where I live
Ditchfield
Brownbill
Pye - all these families still here
would you like me to contact a Ditchfield to read this thread ?...
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Yes please, its all getting a bit confusing for me. Thanks
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i have sent messages out to them ... :)
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i have sent messages out to them ... :)
Many thanks you never know could be related
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pretty confident your are along the line ...we will see hopefully
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Yes be good to see
Thanks Angela