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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Aberdeenshire => Topic started by: Hollyhocker on Monday 07 March 22 22:05 GMT (UK)
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Needing help! And I really hope you lovely lot can share the benefit of your expertise!! 🙏
I’m trying to find my biological grandmother, Gertrude Ross (Nee Stephen). She was born 16 June 1907 in Aberdeen. Married John Fowler Ross on 25 November 1925 in Aberdeen. 6 months later he signs up with the Royal Scots and serves overseas. During this time Gertrude falls pregnant with my dad. As her husband was away serving with the army at this time I suspect my dad was illegitimate. She gave birth to my dad (Jeffrey Christie Inglis Stephen or Ross on 2nd March, 1930 at The New Hospice (also known as the Elsie Inglis Memorial Hospital) in Abbeyhill, Edinburgh when she was just 22. As far as I am aware the family had no connections to Edinburgh.
Her address on my dad’s birth certificate was 8, Jeffrey Street, Edinburgh. She gave him away to a mining family of Gorebridge some 10 miles outside Edinburgh when he was 6 weeks old. She would have been 22 years old at the time. She then seems to completely disappear from the records.
I have checked for death certificates in both her married and maiden name but am drawing a blank. Checked for remarriages between 1930 and 1945 in Scotland. Again drawing a blank. Checking passenger lists for possible emigration and can't find anything. Tried to check the English records for re-marriage but very difficult as you can't see marriage certificates online as you can with Scotland's People.
In 1928-29 (according to the electoral rolls) she is living with her Auntie Isabella at 126, Great Western Road. (This is the address she married from in 1925.) Then I have my dad's birth certificate in 1930 and that's the last record I have of her.
I have been researching this for 11 years and have done quite a bit of research already. I have various birth, marriage and death certificates of her family but I just can't find her! Two women who might help lead me to her (her mother Maggie Jane and her Auntie Isabella) are also missing! Can any of you lovely lot on here help me? I'm happy to post the records/info I have already found on here so you might be able to help if that is useful?
It is my suspicion that she may have emigrated as I have tried so hard to find her in Scotland but I thought I would start here as my first post and see what you lovely Scottish experts have to say!
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A Mrs Tulloch made a contribution on behalf of a Miss Isabella Stephen, 126 Great Western Road, (Ward 10), to Aberdeen Royal Infirmary in 1939.
And the 1940 Valuation Rolls:
STEPHEN
ISABELLA
MISS
Tenant
HOUSE 126 GREAT WESTERN ROAD
ABERDEEN
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What happened to John Fowler Ross? Did he remarry?
EDIT
He died 1989 in Manchester
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"Jeffrey Christie Inglis Stephen or Ross on 2nd March, 1930 at The New Hospice"
His birth was registered with both family names?.....ROSS and STEPHEN?.
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What was the maiden name of Gertrude's mother?
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A tree on Ancestry has a 1955 photo of John Fowler Ross described as “the only photo I have of my dad”
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Deaths 1989
ROSS JOHN FOWLER 11SE1905 MANCHESTER 38 710
No obvious death in Scotland, but birth year of above death in England might fit?
Grave on Billion Graves:. https://billiongraves.com/grave/John-Fowler-Ross/8670943
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His birth was registered with both family names?.....ROSS and STEPHEN?.
Gertrude must have been honest & admitted her husband wasn't the father, although because her surname (by marriage) was Ross, the chid would inherit that surname automatically too.
Annie
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I don’t know if this might relate a snippet from the newspaper
26 June 1946 - The Scotsman - Edinburgh
A notice in the paper to Sheriffs Court against Mrs Gertrude Ross last known address
19 M’Donald Road , Edinburgh, current address unknown to sell an Alvis Motor car to recoup the garage dues that are unpaid…………….
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I wonder if her aunt is the 1939 death aged 92. If she left a will it may mention Gertrude
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I wonder if her aunt is the 1939 death aged 92. If she left a will it may mention Gertrude
Carole,
I wondered the same, no will on SP though but it would be interesting to know who the informant of her death was?
Annie
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What was the maiden name of Gertrude's mother?
It's always helpful to know maiden names & wondered if this was the parents' marriage index...
STEPHEN JOHN JAMES / MCRITCHIE MAGGIE JANE
1905 - 137/ 4 Forres
Annie
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I don’t know if this might relate a snippet from the newspaper
26 June 1946 - The Scotsman - Edinburgh
A notice in the paper to Sheriffs Court against Mrs Gertrude Ross last known address
19 M’Donald Road , Edinburgh, current address unknown to sell an Alvis Motor car to recoup the garage dues that are unpaid…………….
Hmm, quite possibly, was this a relation of her husband?...
ROSS GORDON Tenant HOUSE 19 MCDONALD ROAD EDINBURGH 1940
VR010000857-
Annie
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Gertrude's parents were John STEPHEN an engineer/fitter and Margaret Jane BROWN. They were aged 24 and 20 when they married in 1904.
John's parents were William STEPHEN, a grocer, and Margaret FALCONER.
Margaret's parents were Charles BROWN, a gasworks foreman, and Mary PETRIE.
John STEPHEN's sister Isabella was born c1874.
Debra :)
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So if Isabella was only b 1874 she can’t be the 92yr old who died in 1939 - back to the drawing board
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Found another contribution to Aberdeen Royal Infirmary in 1940, this time by Isabella Stephen 331 Great Western Road.
Likely she was the same Isabella previoisly at 126 Great Western Road, as in 1942, an Eliza Ann Tulloch nee Stephen of number 331 died.
In my post earlier, I noted that in 1939, a Mrs Tulloch made a contribution to the Infirmary on behalf of a Miss Isabella Stephen at 126.
Eliza's late father was a William Stephen, Spirit Merchant, of Aberdeen. She was buried at Allenvale Cemetery https://billiongraves.com/grave/Eliza-Ann-Stephen-Tulloch/18660508 .
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Mmmm....if Hollyhocker is owner of holly_blackwell tree on Ancestry, then it seems a lot of this is already known and for my part anyhow, I have just been repeating their research.
Hollyhocker, your offer of posting relevant research already undertaken by you might be worthwhile to avoid duplication of effort.
Also, given Gertrude was young enough to have one or more children after 1930, have you considered DNA, which always has the potential to throw up matches that could lead you back to her as well as potentially help you discover who your grandfather actually was?
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I'm not sure whether you can see my responses as I think I first have to have my posts approved by the admin as I am new so I will wait to see if my long posts on BMDs of immediate relatives comes up before posting more info on census and other relatives etc. Thanks everyone and for your patience with me as I am learning the ropes 🙏
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Hi everyone,
Sorry not been able to reply until now. I've been at work all day. Yes as I mentioned in my original post I already know a lot about the family and have been researching the past 11 years. I didn't want to include too much in my original post. I read the guidelines on the forum and it said to try and keep posts brief and to the point and I was already rambling! 🙈 I'm new on here so please forgive me if I'm getting it wrong and not observing the right forum etiquette for posting etc. I'll try my best to get it right in future if you are able to guide me? Yes I have already posted my request to the Scottish Indexes FB page. I've updated my tree on Ancestry as much as I can. So here's what I know...
GERTRUDE STEPHEN
Born 16 June 1907
75, Spring Garden Aberdeen
Father: John Stephen (engine fitter, journeyman)
Mother: Margaret Jane Stephen (Nee Brown)
Married John Fowler Ross on 25 November, 1925 at 119, Hamilton Place, Aberdeen.
John Fowler Ross (commercial traveller) age 20 Address 16, Carmelite Street, Aberdeen. Mother: Catherine Emslie Ross (housekeeper)
Gertrude Stephen (Glove machinist) age 18. Address 126, Great Western Road, Aberdeen. Father: John Stephen (engine fitter). Mother: Margaret Jane Stephen Nee Brown
DEATH UNKNOWN
Her brother SYDNEY WILLIAM STEPHN:
Born June 12, 1904
54, Urquhart Road, Aberdeen
Father: John Stephen (engine fitter, journeyman)
Mother: Margaret Jane Stephen (Nee Brown)
Married July 9th, 1927 at St Peters in Wallsend in the County of Northumberland.
Sydney William Stephen (air gunner) Age 23 years. Address 11, Bombing Squadron, Fighter Dean Parish, Wiltshire m. Mary Swan (domestic servant) age 19. Address 22, Ford Terrace.
Sydney Died April 1979, Southampton
Her father JOHN STEPHEN:
Born 21st June 1880.
Address: 67, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen.
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer)
Father: William Stephen Grocer (master) married Dec 31st 1858 old Machar.
Her mother MAGGIE JANE BROWN:
Born 16th Nov 1883.
Address 23, King Street Road, Old Aberdeen.
Mother: Mary Brown (Nee Petrie)
Father: Charles Brown Brick Work Labourer married 1876 Dec 2nd Banchory Devenick
MARRIAGE OF JOHN STEPHEN AND MAGGIE JANE BROWN:
John Stephen and Maggie Jane married 20th April 1904 at the Cafe Royal, Broad Street, Aberdeen
John Stephen (engine fitter journeyman) age 24 at 95, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen, son of William Stephen (grocer) (deceased) and Margaret Stephen Nee Falconer
Margaret Jane Brown (paper mill worker) age 20 at 55 Urquhart Road, Aberdeen. Daughter of Charles Brown, gas works and Mary Brown Nee Petrie.
DIVORCED
DEC 8TH 1917
JOHN STEPHEN 2ND MARRIAGE
John Stephen (mechanical engineer journeyman) age 37. Address 16, North Silver Street, Aberdeen. m Jessie Duffer Birss (domestic servant, spinster) age 40. Address 134, Great Western Road, Aberdeen.
CHILD OF 2ND MARRIAGE
Born 1919, Aberdeen
Died 1st July 1926 at The Sick Children's Hospital Aberdeen.
DEATH JOHN STEPHEN
14th Nov 1953 Royal Infirmary Aberdeen
Address: 331, Great Western Road, Aberdeen
Widower of Jessie Duffer Birss and formerly married to Mary? Marg. Helen Brown
73 years
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer) (deceased)
Father: William Stephen (spirit merchant) (deceased)
Died of: Cholelithiasis acute purulent cholecystitis. Acute heart failure.
Witness: S W Stephen, son, 39, Vendon Avenue, Hamble, Southampton
Registered: Nov 16, Aberdeen
DEATH MAGGIE JANE STEPHEN
UNKNOWN
DEATH JESSIE DUFFER BIRSS
21st January 1937 at City Hospital Aberdeen
Age 59 years
Father John Birss (joiner, deceased) Mother Frances Jane Birss (Nee Aberdein, deceased)
Informant: John Stephen, Widower. 336, Holburn Street, Aberdeen
Will post census info next and Aunties and uncles...
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A newspaper report in Aberdeen Evening Express 08 Dec 1917 relates to the divorce of Gertrude's parents John & Margaret Jane...
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01rch/
They'd had 2 children who were in his care & they'd lived in Springburn, Glasgow but after a time she 'took to drink'.
Nothing was known of her to John after he heard M J had been in an inebriate home in Edinburgh in 1916.
The above would appear to be the connection with Gertrude to Edinburgh.
It would be worth seeking out the sibling of Gertrude although no sexes are stated of the children.
Annie
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Going by dates & areas known, this is a possible death for a sibling...
STEPHEN ELIZABETH BROWN 80 - BROWN (mms) - 1987 - 732/ 371 Leith (Edinburgh)
The above has same ref. no. for surname Whitelaw which leads to this marriage which can be downloaded to find out if this is the sibling mentioned?...
STEPHEN ELIZABETH BROWN / WHITELAW GEORGE JAMES 1936 - 685/1 230 Haymarket (Edinburgh)
Annie
Edit - Ignore above as I've just come across a tree which states Gertrude's sibling was Sydney William Stephen ::)
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Gertrude was young enough to have one or more children after 1930, have you considered DNA, which always has the potential to throw up matches that could lead you back to her as well as potentially help you discover who your grandfather actually was?
Scots women had a trait of leaving clues to the name of the father of illegitimate children by giving them names related & often surnames as middle names...
Jeffrey Christie Inglis Stephen or Ross
3 of the forenames of Jeffrey could be surnames, have you found any connection with those names?
It's always an idea to expand on family info. to establish name connections.
DNA flags up surnames which may help your quest.
Annie
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In case you haven't located this, Margaret Stephen died 30 May 1926 at 126 Gt Western Road, Aberdeen.
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GERTRUDE'S AUNTIES AND UNCLES...
DAD (JOHN STEPHEN'S SIDE)...
Jane Stephen 11th January, 1860
Address: 84, Skene Street, Aberdeen
Mother: Margaret Stephen maiden name Falconer
Father: William Stephen Cabinet Maker (journeyman) married Dec 31st Aberdeen 1858
Informant: William Stephen, father. Not present.
Registered: Jan 28
Margaret Stephen 4th April, 1862
Address: 67, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen.
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer)
Father: William Stephen Cabinet Maker (journeyman) married Dec 31st 1858 Aberdeen
Informant: William Stephen, father (Present)
Registered: April 22
Eliza Ann Stephen 28th November, 1863
Address: 65, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen.
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer)
Father: William Stephen Cabinet Maker (journeyman) married Dec 31st Aberdeen 1858
Informant: William Stephen, father (Present)
Registered: Dec 16
William Stephen 13th Nov 1865
Address: 65, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen.
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer)
Father: William Stephen Cabinet Maker married Dec 31st 1858 Aberdeen
Informant: William Stephen (Present)
Registered: Nov 30
Charlotte Stephen b 1872 Died 1873 1 years 8 months and 9 days
Isabella Stephen 21st March, 1874
Address: 67, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen.
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer)
Father: William Stephen Cabinet Maker (journeyman) married Dec 31st Old Machar, Aberdeen 1858
Informant: William Stephen, father (Present)
Registered: April 10
MARRIAGES ON GERTRUDE'S FATHER'S SIDE...
14th June 1887
Jane Stephen, aged 27, housekeeper (spinster) m James Davidson, aged 29, (cloth finisher). 14th June 1887.
Jane Stephen address: 95, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen. Father: William Stephen, grocer (master), Margaret Stephen, nee Falconer.
James Davidson: 97 Upper Denburn, Aberdeen. Father: Robert Davidson (domestic Gardener) (deceased). Mother: Georgina Davidson Nee Russel.
Witnesses: Alfred Russell, Duncan Gordon
15th June 1909
At 76, Polmuir Road Aberdeen
Eliza Ann Stephen (spinster) age 44. Address 36, Union Terrace, Aberdeen m. James Tulloch (spirit dealer, bachelor) age 44. Address 80, Salisbury Place, Aberdeen.
Parents James Tulloch: Roderick Tulloch (prison warden, deceased) Eliza Tulloch Nee ??
Parents Eliza Stephen: William Stephen (grocer and spirit merchant, deceased) and Margaret Stephen Nee Falconer (deceased)
Witnesses: Margaret Tulloch and John Stephen
I believe MARGARET STEPHEN and ISABELLA STEPHEN died spinsters. John's other brother William and sister Charlotte died in childhood
DEATHS ON GERTRUDE'S FATHER'S SIDE...
William Stephen 26th October 1870
Address: 67, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen
Age: 5 years, 4 months, 9 days
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer)
Father: William Stephen Cabinet Maker (journeyman)
Died of: Scarlatina. 4 days as certified by Mrs Fraser, surgeon
Witness: William Stephen, Father
Registered: October 28
Charlotte Stephen 24th October 1873
Address: 67, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen
Age: 1 years 8 months and 9 days
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer)
Father: William Stephen (cabinet maker)
Died of: Cnaugh (cough??) 3 dats
Witness: William Stephen, father present
Margaret Stephen 30th May, 1926
Papermill worker, single
Address: 126, Great Western Road, Aberdeen
Age: 64 years
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer) (deceased)
Father: William Stephen grocer (master) (deceased)
Died of: Pernicious anaemia as certified by John Stephen
Witness: John Stephen brother (present) 93, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen
Registered: May 31
Jane Davidson 22nd May, 1928
Widow of James Davidson (insurance agent)
Address: 95, Upper Denburn, Aberdeen
Age: 68 years
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer) (deceased)
Father: William Stephen grocer (master) (deceased)
Died of: Myxoedema chronic myocarditis as certified by John H Stephen
Witness: James D Davidson, son
Registered: May 23
Eliza Ann Tulloch Jan 1st, 1942
Widow of James Tulloch (spirit merchant)
Address: 126, Great Western Road, Aberdeen
Age: 78 years
Mother: Margaret Stephen (Nee Falconer) (deceased)
Father: William Stephen( spirit merchant) (deceased)
Died of: Splenic Anaemia, cirrhosis of liver, chronic myocarditis as certified by John Stephen
Witness: John Stephen brother and inmate (present)
Registered: Jan 2
I CAN NOT FIND A DEATH CERTIFICATE FOR ISABELLA STEPHEN. HOWEVER, SHE IS ON THE FAMILY GRAVESTONE IN ALLENVALE CEMETERY, ABERDEEN WITH A DEATH DATE OF 10 FEB 1947.
I have contacted Aberdeen City Council to try and find out if she is interred there. If not, perhaps she died abroad which might give us a clue as to where Gertrude might be hiding. This is the auntie seemed closest to. She was living with her age 3 in the 1911 census and married from her address in 1925.
EDIT: Just heard back from Aberdeen City Council and Isabella is not interred in the grave at Aberdeen. UPDATE! Just heard back from Aberdeen Council about the Stephen Family grave and Isabella is NOT interred there!...
" Allenvale Cemetery – Section: A Lair no: 441
I can confirm Isabella is not in this grave. I can only think that she had died outside Scotland therefor you can not find a death certificate for her. The family has simply added her name to the stone which is quite a common thing to do."
Census info coming next and I need to try and learn how to post photos! Have been trying and failing miserably so far! 😂😂 ::) Thank you all for your time and patience with me!
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CENSUS INFO...
MARGARET J BROWN (GERTRUDE’S MUM) CENSUS SEARCH
1881
Address: 23, King Street Road, Old Machar, Aberdeen
Charles Brown (head) (28) General Labourer
Mary Brown (wife) (30) General Labourer’s wife
John Brown (son) (3) did he die?? Check out John Webster Brown 168/2 186
Charles Brown (son) (1)
1891
Address: King Street Road, Old Machar, Aberdeen
Charles Brown (head) (40) Head Gas Stoker
Mary Brown (wife) (40)
Charles Brown (son) (11) scholar
Maggie J Brown (daughter) (7) scholar
Elizabeth G Brown daughter) (3) scholar
1901
Address: 5, Urqhuart Road, St Nicholas, Aberdeen [misprint??? Should be 55??]
Charles Brown (head) (50) Head Gas Stoker b 1851
Mary Brown (wife) (51) b 1850
Charles Brown (son) (21) Monumental Stone Cutter b 1880
Maggie J Brown (daughter) (17) Clerkess b 1884
Elizabeth G Brown daughter) (13) scholar b 1888
Mary H Brown (daughter) (8) scholar b 1893
I CAN'T FIND MAGGIE IN A CENSUS AFTER 1901
JOHN STEPHEN (GERTRUDE’S DAD) CENSUS SEARCH
1881
Address 95, Upper Denburn, Old Machar, Aberdeen
William Stephen (head) (49) Shopman grocer. Birthplace Glasgow.
Margaret Stephen (wife) (45)
Jane Stephen (daughter) (21) Domestic Serv Genl
Margaret Stephen (daughter) (19) Paper millworker
Eliza Ann Stephen (daughter) (17) Milliner
William Stephen (son) (10) scholar
Isabella Stephen (daughter) (7) scholar
John Stephen (son) (0)
1891
Address: Osborne Place, St Machar, Aberdeen NEW ADDRESS
William Stephen (head) (59) grocer. Birthplace Glasgow.
Margaret Stephen (wife) (55)
Margaret Stephen (daughter) (29) Housekeeper
Eliza Ann Stephen (daughter) (37) Milliners showman
Isabella Stephen (daughter) (17) Dressmaker
John Stephen (son) (10) Scholar
Ann J Dey (servant) (29) servant
1901
Address 3, Osborne Place, St Machar, Aberdeen
John Stephen (son) (20) Mechanical engine (appec) [SIC] John now head of the house. Parents must have died??
Margaret Stephen (daughter) (38) Housekeeper
Eliza Ann Stephen (daughter) (37) Grocer
Isabella Stephen (daughter) (27) Assistant Housekeeper
Jessie Birse (Visitor) (20)
1911
Address: 15, Baker Street
John Stephen (Boarder) (30) Licensed grocer. John now seems to be living on his own
1921
Address:
John Stephen (head) 41 years. Married Birth place Aberdeen. Occupation: Engine fitter. S Craig (out of work). Curlew works, Jarrow.
Jessie Stephen (wife) 43 years 5 months. Married. Birth place Northumberland, Walker on Tyne. Occupation: Home duties.
Sydney W Stephen (son) 17 years Single. Birth place Aberdeen. Occupation: Apprentice riveter. Joseph Eltringham and co Ltd ship builders. Willington Quay on Tyne.
Gertrude Stephen (daughter) 14 years. Single. Birth place Aberdeen. At home.
Jessie Stephen (daughter) 1 year, 1 and a half months. Single. Birth place Northumberland, Newcastle
Margaret Stephen (sister) 59 years 2 months. Single Birth place Aberdeen
CHARLES AND MARY BROWN (GERTRUDE’S GRANDPARENTS) CENSUS SEARCH
1911
Address: 56, Urquhart Road
Room with one or more windows: 3
Charles Brown (head) (59)
Mary Brown (wife) (59)
Mary Brown (daughter) (17)
Elizabeth Roberson (daughter) (23)
Adrian Roberston (grandson) (1)
GERTRUDE STEPHEN CENSUS SEARCH
1911
Address: 36, Union Terrace, Aberdeen
Isabella Stephen (head) age 37
Gertrude Stephen (niece) age 3
1921
Address:
John Stephen (head) 41 years. Married Birth place Aberdeen. Occupation: Engine fitter. S Craig (out of work). Curlew works, Jarrow.
Jessie Stephen (wife) 43 years 5 months. Married. Birth place Northumberland, Walker on Tyne. Occupation: Home duties.
Sydney W Stephen (son) 17 years Single. Birth place Aberdeen. Occupation: Apprentice riveter. Joseph Eltringham and co Ltd ship builders. Willington Quay on Tyne.
Gertrude Stephen (daughter) 14 years. Single. Birth place Aberdeen. At home.
Jessie Stephen (daughter) 1 year, 1 and a half months. Single. Birth place Northumberland, Newcastle
Margaret Stephen (sister) 59 years 2 months. Single Birth place Aberdeen
SYDNEY STEPHEN (GERTRUDE’S BROTHER) CENSUS SEARCH
1911
Address: 91, Upper Denburn, St Nicholas, Aberdeen
Jane Davidson (head) (widow) (51)
William S Davidson (son) (20)
James D Davidson (son) (16)
Harold Davidson (son) (14)
John S Davidson (son) (11)
Sydney W Davidson (nephew) (6)
1921
Address:
John Stephen (head) 41 years. Married Birth place Aberdeen. Occupation: Engine fitter. S Craig (out of work). Curlew works, Jarrow.
Jessie Stephen (wife) 43 years 5 months. Married. Birth place Northumberland, Walker on Tyne. Occupation: Home duties.
Sydney W Stephen (son) 17 years Single. Birth place Aberdeen. Occupation: Apprentice riveter. Joseph Eltringham and co Ltd ship builders. Willington Quay on Tyne.
Gertrude Stephen (daughter) 14 years. Single. Birth place Aberdeen. At home.
Jessie Stephen (daughter) 1 year, 1 and a half months. Single. Birth place Northumberland, Newcastle
Margaret Stephen (sister) 59 years 2 months. Single Birth place Aberdeen
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Hello Hollyhocker
Have been looking but not found a death for your Gertrude Ross nee Stephen
Can I ask do you know if Gertrude’s husband John Fowler Ross remarried? If so, when and where did he marry maybe obtaining this marriage certificate might be of help if it states he’s widowed :-\
brought forward (reply 8 ) - is this the same Gertrude?
I don’t know if this might relate a snippet from the newspaper
26 June 1946 - The Scotsman - Edinburgh
A notice in the paper to Sheriffs Court against Mrs Gertrude Ross last known address
19 M’Donald Road , Edinburgh, current address unknown to sell an Alvis Motor car to recoup the garage dues that are unpaid…………….
Hmm, quite possibly, was this a relation of her husband?...
ROSS GORDON Tenant HOUSE 19 MCDONALD ROAD EDINBURGH 1940
Do you know if he is related to John?
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ELECTORAL ROLLS FOR ABERDEEN...
John Stephen (dad)
1925-1935: 93, Upper Denburn
1936-1938: 336, Holburn Street
1946: 331 Great Western Road
1950-1953: 331 Great Western Road
Maggie Jane Stephen Nee Brown (mum)
Can't be found!!
Jessie Stephen (step mum)
1925-1935: 93, Upper Denburn
1936-1938: 336, Holburn Street
Margaret Stephen (Auntie)
1906: 134 Great Western Road
1907: 134 Great Western Road
1909-1914: 134 Great Western Road
Isabella Stephen (Auntie)
1920-37: 126 Great Western Road
1946: 331 Great Western Road
Jane Davidson (Auntie)
1926-27: 95, Upper Denburn
(Jane dies in 1928 and her son James D Davidson goes next door to 93, Upper Denburn to live with his Uncle John)
Eliza Tulloch (Auntie)
1923-1936: 93, Upper Denburn
1923-1926: 331, Great Western Road
1928-39: 331, Great Western Road
NOTE SHE SEEMS TO BE REGISTERED AT TWO DIFFERENT ADDRESSES AT SAME TIME.
Sydney Stephen (brother)
1927-29: 93, Upper Denburn
Gertrude Ross appears in the electoral rolls once in 1929! Address: 126, Great Western Road. So she is living with her Auntie Isabella again.
This would be the year she conceived my dad! I can't find her before this. Interestingly there are entries for "Gertrude Ross" at the address 147, Hardgate from 1929-33. I googled the address and 147, Hardgate was the address of the Bethany Orphanage run by nuns. I wonder if this is the Gertrude I am looking for in this entry and the nuns took her in as she had become pregnant.Maybe they arranged for her to have my dad in Edinburgh and then gave her work for a few years when she returned?? Just a theory! It doesn't explain why she also appeared why she appeared living with her Auntie Isabella in 1929. I've asked around for documentation relating to Bethany House (Aberdeen City Archives, Aberdeen University, Local Studies Library etc) but drawing a blank. Waiting to hear back from the CoE archives. Apparently they hold records relating to the Scottish Episcopal Church. 🤞
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And finally here is some more info on John Fowler Ross who Gertrude Married...
Get the popcorn out for this one! 😂
Well around 11 years ago I had a little breakthrough and managed to find the son of John Fowler Ross. I managed to find him through a relative of Gertrude's brother Sydney whose descendant somehow found him on ancestry. It turns out John Fowler Ross joined the army in 1926 and was away serving with the Royal Scots in Egypt, India China during the time my dad was conceived and born. More reason for me to think that he was illegitimate.
I have his some of his service books passed on to me. He came out of the Army in 1933 and signed up again in 1939. No idea where he was during the time in-between but when he signed up in 1939 he was living at the King's Arms Hotel in Wood Street in Swindon. Then I found a newspaper article of 1939 which mentions court dispute between a John Fowler Ross and a Mary Ivy Ross over a child. John had no made child payments and Mary was stopping John from seeing the child saying he was unfit. I wish I knew how to post pictures on here, else I would post the article! I will endeavour to at a future date! 😂
Now to give you a bit of context, John Fowler Ross’s son remembers his dad saying he was “sorely wronged” and saying regular prayers for Patricia. Low and behold I researched the child of this pair and she’s called Patricia. Born 1935. Her mum (Mary Ivy Ross Nee Hill) then remarried a Mr Bigg in 1942. It seems Patricia took on his name and dropped the “Ross”. She went on to marry George W Phillips in 1953. She died in 2001. Haven’t managed to find any children from their marriage yet. I have ordered the marriage certificate of John Ross and Mary Ivy Hill to see if this is indeed him. We'll see!
After the war John Fowler Ross turns up in Dukinfield, Cheshire and meets Sarah Battersby (Nee Pickersgill). They had two children together. The pair then split up when J was very young. J remembers his dad as a nasty man. Unfortunately John's mum died when he was only very young and he had to go and live with his dad which was a very miserable time for him. John Fowler Ross went on to marry a woman called Nellie Twigg but was only married to her a few months before they slplit acrimoniously! J remembers him whispering to her in the kitchen saying that he might be committing bigamy if he married her. At first we both thought this would be in reference to his marriage with Gertrude but it could indeed be his marriage to Mary. Will have to find out on that one!
So not complicated AT ALL!! 😂😂😂 Have you had enough yet!! 😂😂
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I have ordered the marriage certificate of John Ross and Mary Ivy Hill to see if this is indeed him. We'll see!
Please come back and let us know the outcome
So your John Fowler Ross
Married 1925 Scotland Stephen
Married 1934 Wiltshire Hill
Married ?
Battersby/Ross no marriage entry on FreeBMD
(Pickersgill married Battersby 1933 Ashton and looks as if she died age 40 as Battersby 1953 Ashton)
Married 1957 Ashton Lancashire Twigg
Died 9 Sept 1989 buried Dukinfield Cemetery Lancashire
https://billiongraves.com/grave/John-Fowler-Ross/8670943
Find a grave gives their plot number A5 DUK, Grave 382
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Hello Hollyhocker
Have been looking but not found a death for your Gertrude Ross nee Stephen
Can I ask do you know if Gertrude’s husband John Fowler Ross remarried? If so, when and where did he marry maybe obtaining this marriage certificate might be of help if it states he’s widowed :-\
brought forward (reply 8 ) - is this the same Gertrude?
I don’t know if this might relate a snippet from the newspaper
26 June 1946 - The Scotsman - Edinburgh
A notice in the paper to Sheriffs Court against Mrs Gertrude Ross last known address
19 M’Donald Road , Edinburgh, current address unknown to sell an Alvis Motor car to recoup the garage dues that are unpaid…………….
Hmm, quite possibly, was this a relation of her husband?...
ROSS GORDON Tenant HOUSE 19 MCDONALD ROAD EDINBURGH 1940
Do you know if he is related to John?
Hi Ladyhawk. John Fowler Ross possibly married a women called Mary Ivy Hill in Swindon in 1934. I have ordered the certificate and just waiting for it to arrive. He met his partner Sarah Battersby (Nee Pickersgill) after the war in 1945 in Dukinfield,Cheshire. They never married but had a son John Ross in 1946 and a daughter Susan Ross in 1948. John Ross the son is still alive and we are in regular contact. He is 75 now and as keen as me to get to the bottom of this family mystery! Sarah and John Fowler Ross split up when John was young and JFR went on to marry a woman called Nellie Twigg. They split acrimoniously a few months later. John Fowler Ross died in Dukinfield Cheshire in 1989
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Spot on LadyHawk although I am not 100% he married Mary Ivy Hill. Waiting for confirmation on that when the certificate arrives!
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Stephen family grave. Heard back today that Isabella is not interred there although her name is on the stone. Also no sign of Gertrude.
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Here's the divorce newspaper article between Maggie Jane Brown and John Stephen, 1917
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I think this could be Gertrude...
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:68P4-6HZX
c/o 35 Union Street, Aberdeen
Age is hard to read could be either 37 or 31 (which would fit)
Annie
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Yes Annie. I saw that record and also thought for a while it could be her. The thing is there is another Gertrude Stephen on the ship from Seaton Cottage, Bridge of Don. When I checked the electoral rolls for that address there were two Gertrude Stephens there so I was inclined to think that the pair on the boat were relatives and were the Bridge of Don Gertrudes. What are your thoughts? 35a, Union Street was the offices of Mackay Bros and co who were a shipping company so I thought it was just the address of the travel company. However, on my family tree on ancestry I noticed that one of John Stephen's cousins Anne Buyers (whose mum was Ann Falconer) married a Charles Begg at 35A, Union Street on 2nd Dec 1915. Not sure if that is a connection or a coincidence?!?! I'm just on the fence about this record. Would be interested to know what others think
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You have all your research i.e. you now need to track that Gertrude from when the ship landed?
Annie
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Here are the births in Aberdeen for Gertrude which should help.
I haven't included other areas as your Gertrude was born Aberdeen i.e. any further docs with place names other than 'Scotland' you'd be looking for Aberdeen as her PoB.
Annie
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I think you can eliminate this one unless she travelled & returned?...
STEPHEN GERTRUDE GRAY 64 - 1979 - 300/ 485 Aberdeen
Annie
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Thanks Rosinish. I have all the details of the birth for Gertrude and all her family. Have you seen my earlier posts?
I just need to trace her after she gave my dad away
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Again Rosinish, not done any research as to when the ship landed...
1. Because I discounted it being her because of the two Gertrude Stephens being on the same ship
2. Because I have no way of searching the Canadian records. I did contact the Canadian Records office in January to ask them to search for a death certificate of a Gertrude Stephen emigrating there and asked them to look into it but haven't heard anything back yet.
Thanks for you help. Really appreciate it
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Again Rosinish, not done any research as to when the ship landed...
1. Because I discounted it being her because of the two Gertrude Stephens being on the same ship
2. Because I have no way of searching the Canadian records. I did contact the Canadian Records office in January to ask them to search for a death certificate of a Gertrude Stephen emigrating there and asked them to look into it but haven't heard anything back yet.
Thanks for you help. Really appreciate it
Each Canadian province, as with each state in America, keep their own vital records. In the last 20 years or so lots of those places have made it more difficult to get vital records unless they are considered 'historical' (sometimes more than 100 years old) or you are a close relative.
Nova Scotia, for example have deaths up to 1970 which you can search online and also marriages until 1945 (in case Gertrude married there)-
https://archives.novascotia.ca/vital-statistics/
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Thank you. Will check that link.
EDIT: Couldn't find anything in Nova Scotia
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The 2nd Gertrude was only 22 yrs old which can be eliminated easily if you find marriages/deaths in Canada which I was suggesting.
The ticket no's on the journey were 100s apart, doesn't look to me as if they were 'together'
I just need to trace her after she gave my dad away
That journey was 9th Oct 1937 which was after the birth of your dad.
Annie
Add...on saying that, it conflicts with...
26 June 1946 - The Scotsman - Edinburgh
A notice in the paper to Sheriffs Court against Mrs Gertrude Ross last known address
19 M’Donald Road , Edinburgh, current address unknown to sell an Alvis Motor car to recoup the garage dues that are unpaid…………….
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Thanks Rosinish. I have all the details of the birth for Gertrude and all her family. Have you seen my earlier posts?
I just need to trace her after she gave my dad away
I posted the others born in Aberdeen to help you eliminate them from those who travelled which narrows it down to 2 born Aberdeen as opposed to 3 as there's 1 from that list who died in Scotland?
Unless that Gertrude travelled to Canada & returned then you are only looking for 2 but one of them (the 22 yr old) can be eliminated by her age/dob on any further docs/info?
That leaves only 1, the older of the 2 on that journey to look for by age/dob?
The question is...did she revert to her maiden name which can't be discounted & I think there's a good chance she may have?
The passenger list in 1937 doesn't seem to give any clue to status although her trade/calling is Housewife but I don't know if it means married/separated/divorced/widowed but it seems an odd trade/calling of a single person?
Annie
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Related thread to save duplication of effort...
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=861995.msg7313827#msg7313827
Annie
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Just wanted to let you know that I've managed to find Gertrude's Aunt Isabella!! FINALLY!! She died on 5th January 1947 in JERSEY!!! Full thread her on an Isabella specific look up request I made...
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=861995.msg7316234#msg7316234
Have also managed to find the wills of Isabella Stephen, Gertrude's Aunt Eliza Tulloch and Gertrude's father John Stephen.
Hopefully these documents (when I finally get to see them) can help me move my research forward a bit.
Many thanks for all your help and advice with this
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Thanks for the update Hollyhocker that's great news :)
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Just wanted to update this thread with another little skeleton in the closet!
I found out that Gertrude has another baby to John Ross in 1926 so my dad has a sister!
Her name was Joan Isabel Ross, date of birth 28th January 1926. Born at 12 Hollybank Place Aberdeen, District of St Machar.
Mother Gertrude Ross. Father John Fowler Ross. Her father signed her certificate as informant.
Sadly, Joan's birth certificate states she was ‘adopted’.
I'm unsure whether she was adopted at birth or sometime after, having not seen the certificate. So John and Gertrude marry Nov 1925. Joan is born Jan 1926 and John Fowler Ross joins the army in April 1926. It seems slightly strange that they would go to the trouble of marrying and then have the baby adopted. Also I don't think adoption was made official in Scotland until 1930.
Also why adopt that baby and then go on to give my dad away (without adoption papers) in 1930. Struggling to make sense of it all. And STILL can’t find Gertrude! I’m on the waiting list to see the wills in Edinburgh. Feels like a very long wait! 😂
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Hi everyone! I'm not sure how to mark this enquiry "solved" but it is! I've found Gertrude!
Many of you on here have helped me so much and I'm so grateful, the least I can do is update you on my progress!
After a fair amount of research, I found out that Gertrude moved to Jersey in 1945. She met her "husband" [although I still can't find their marriage certificate yet] Harold Arthur Goldsmith and they moved to Jersey, where Harold was from, along with Gertrude's first born daughter Joan Isabel. They adopted a two day old baby boy in 1945 in Guilford just before the move. I wonder whether this was related to any guilt that Gertrude might have felt at giving away my dad at birth??
I've spoken to Gertrude's adopted son on the phone and he was really friendly and kind. Told me lots of information and he's going to send me a photograph of my grandma.
Gertrude died age 47 in Brompton Hospital in London in 1954. Apparently she was ill while on Jersey and went to Brompton to get treatment and died there. She is buried in a common grave in Brompton Cemetery.
I would still be interested to know where Gertrude was between 1930 (in Edinburgh) and 1945 (in Jersey). She and Harold had a brief spell in Milford Haven, Pembrokeshire in 1945 but I have no idea where she was before that! Scratching my head as to what brought her so far down south. But this helps explain why her Auntie Isabella died in Jersey in 1947. She was obviously down there visiting.
Also Gertrude's daughter Joan returned to Aberdeen to give birth to her daughter J ***** in 1949 so there is obviously still some connection to Aberdeen.
I just wanted to say thanks SO much everyone here on Rootschat for all your input and help, especially @hgs46
I can't actually believe that I have found her!!
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What a wonderful update!
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After a fair amount of research, I found out that Gertrude moved to Jersey in 1945. She met her "husband" [although I still can't find their marriage certificate yet] Harold Arthur Goldsmith and they moved to Jersey......
I've spoken to Gertrude's adopted son on the phone and he was really friendly and kind. Told me lots of information and he's going to send me a photograph of my grandma.
Gertrude died age 47 in Brompton Hospital in London in 1954. Apparently she was ill while on Jersey and went to Brompton to get treatment and died there. She is buried in a common grave in Brompton Cemetery.
I can't actually believe that I have found her!!
That is wonderful news Hollyhock thank you for the update so pleased you've managed to find her :)
Is this Harold?
https://catalogue.jerseyheritage.org/collection/Details/archive/110058126
https://catalogue.jerseyheritage.org/collection/Details/archive/110058127
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Thanks Ladyhawk. No it's not Harold. He was born in 1914. It's Harold's father.