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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: DaveMcC on Sunday 06 February 22 21:13 GMT (UK)
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My 3rd Great-Grandmother was Elizabeth Dornan who married my 3rd Grea-Grandfather Samuel Warnock Patterson on 04 October 1861 in Belfast Registers Office: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1861/09605/5483183.pdf
Their marriage certificate says Samuel Warnock Patterson was from Lower Malone, Shankill, Belfast and his father was James Patterson a weaver. I don't know anything about if James had any more children other than Samuel or who James wife was or when he died. The certificate says Samuel was 25 at time of marriage so he would have been born 1835-1836.
Elizabeth was 22 and also from Lower Malone, Shankill, Belfast. Says her father was William Dornan, a farmer but I don't know anything else about William Dornan or his wife or if they had anymore children besides Elizabeth.
Samuel and Elizabeths children that I know of: Elizabeth (Born 1871), Jane Lemon Patterson (Born 1862), Sarah (Born 1873), Samuel Warnock Patterson (Born 1874) married Margaret Elizabeth Patterson from Leverogue, Drumbo. Samuel Warnock Patterson and Margaret Elizabeth Patterson are my 2nd great-grandparents.
Samuel Warnock Patterson and Elizabeth Dornan lived at 71 May Street, Belfast and he was a publican. He died of Smallpox on 24 May 1874: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1874/020663/7250598.pdf
Elizabeth Dornan remarried a Henry Marshall in 1877: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1877/11122/8071996.pdf
Elizabeth and Henry had one child, William Henry Marshall 3rd April 1878 25 Joy Street, Belfast: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1878/02968/2087432.pdf
I would like to find out what happened to William Henry Marshall as I can find no records of him beyond his birth. I also searched Census for Pattersons in Malone and found a number of Pattersons living on the Malone Road, one in Malone Upper and one Malone Lower but two in Malone Lower and Upper were from County Tyrone.
David Patterson on Malone Upper Aged 10, grandson, born County Antrim: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Malone/Malone_Upper_part_of__rural___c_/198275/
Davids Birth record: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1900/01999/1768929.pdf
David's parents Hugh Patterson from Malone and Martha Doran from Drumbeg, marriage 18 May 1895: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1895/10525/5833446.pdf
The Pattersons on the Malone Road:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Cromac/Malone_Road/165478/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Cromac/Malone_Road/165480/
I am not sure if there is a connection to these Pattersons and the James and Samuel Warnock Patterson in my family but would like to find out.
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I was given some documents one of my grans reletives, a Patterson made when he researched these Pattersons and his documents and his research said:
James Patterson (Weaver), father mentioned on the marriage certificate of Samuel Warnock Patterson and Elizabeth Dornan was from Ballynagarrick, Drumbo and that his son, Samuel Warnock Patterson was baptised in Drumbo Presbyterian Church on 28 December 1836 and he was born 2 December 1836 and that his mother, James Pattersons wife was a Sarah Morrow.
It seems these Pattersons were from Ballynagarrick, not Belfast and only Samuel Warnock Patterson Jr who married Elizabeth Dornan I mentioned in my first post, lived in Lower Malone then 71 May Street in Belfast.
There is no record of a Samuel Warnock Patterson in 1901 Irish Census, there is however a Warnock Patterson aged 24 living with his aunt, a 75 year old widow named Jane Lemon and they were living in Tullyard, Drumbeg: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Ballymacbrennan/Tullyard/1239383/
In 1911, Samuel Warnock Pattersons son, Samuel Warnock Patterson (Wife was Margaret Elizabeth Patterson from Leveroge, Drumbo as I mentioned in my first post) was widowed living in Tullyard, Drumbeg according to this Census record: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Ballymacbrennan/Tullyard/248539/
Could the Warnock Patterson in 1901 be the same Samuel Warnock Patterson in the 1911 census, even if the age is a few years off? Also can anyone help me with who that Jane Lemon is? In my first post I mentioned a Jane Lemon Patterson, daughter of Samuel Warnock Patterson and Elizabeth Dornan and could be named after this Jane Lemon?
An interesting thing I discovered when looking up Jane Lemon Patterson was two marriage certificates. The first is for Jane Lemon Patterson and William David McClean who were married on 29 October 1880 in Dunmurry: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1880/11048/8041205.pdf She was 18 so born 1862 and it says she is a spinster and her father was Samuel Warnock Patterson, Publican. That is the Samuel Warnock Patterson who married Elizabeth Dornan.
This later marriage certificate is for a John Wilson and a Jane Patterson on 30 January 1892 in Belfast. It sais Jane Pattersons father is also Samuel Warnock Patterson, Publican but the odd thing is that it says she is a spinster? https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1892/10621/5869502.pdf
If this is the same Jane Patterson as the Jane Lemon Patterson, then why does it say she was a spinster when she married John Wilson?
One last thing I found. There was a Warnock Patterson living in Ballymagarrick in 1901 and had a 5 year old son, Samuel Warnock Patterson so I am assuming there could be related to the Samuel Warnock Pattersons I mentioned above? They are from the same location where James Patterson was from when Samuel Warnock Patterson Sr was born.
This Warnock Pattersons wife was Eliza Thomson: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Drumbo/Ballymagarrick/1238893/
Warnock Patterson and Eliza Thomson marriage: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1883/10923/5990934.pdf
Is Ballynagarrick and Ballymagarrick the same townland?
Can anyone help?
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Could the Warnock Patterson in 1901 be the same Samuel Warnock Patterson in the 1911 census, even if the age is a few years off? Also can anyone help me with who that Jane Lemon is? In my first post I mentioned a Jane Lemon Patterson, daughter of Samuel Warnock Patterson and Elizabeth Dornan and could be named after this Jane Lemon?
Probate for Jane Lemon’s will was granted to Samuel Warnock Patterson and James Swan - both farmers
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01rak/
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I read your post last week and there is such a lot to unpick. (My concentration - not your post).
I was hoping that someone with more knowledge and access to the area would read it.
Do you have this - is it relevant? The image explains it a bit better, I think
http://censussearchforms.nationalarchives.ie/search/cs/details.jsp?id=11402
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This is better re Jane Lemon’s will. I couldn’t access it earlier. I hope it works
https://apps.proni.gov.uk/willscalendar_ie/WillsSearchImage.aspx?id=247959
It is an image - Jane Lemon leaves the farm to her nephew Samuel Warnock Patterson and that he pays her niece Jane Lemon Patterson alias Wilson an amount of money.
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Starting with the two marriages-
1) 1880 Dunmurray Presbyterian Church (Jane born c1862 if age is correct)
2) 1892 Great Victoria St. Presbyterian Church, Belfast
bride is Jane Patterson (no middle name), father Samuel W. Patterson (just middle initial)
John B. Wilson & wife Jane in 1901 with son Samuel-
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Clifton_Ward__Belfast/Evelyan_Gardens/1004464/
Jane born c1863. Son Samuel's birth gives mother's maiden name as Wilson which would seem to rule them out.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1900/01988/1765195.pdf
Checked N.I. births 1880-1894 (father- McLean, mother- Patterson) without finding any children to 1st marriage. Also unable to find a death for William McLean in Lisburn or Belfast districts (could have died elsewhere).
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John B. Wilson & wife Jane with sons Samuel & George in 1911-
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Duncairn/Innisfayle_Road/170917/
Son George is George Anson Wilson, mother's maiden name Wilson-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1901/01946/1752038.pdf
Strangely enough, says John & Jane married 22 years (c1889) and only 2 children born but eldest (Samuel) not born until 1900.
Added-
Wilson John Brown of 2 Manilla Terrace Skegoniel Avenue Belfast commercial traveller died 12 May 1925 Probate Belfast 27 January to Jane Wilson the widow. Effects £2205 3s. 6d.
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Death of Samuel Lemon - informant Jane of Tullyard
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05926/4682784.pdf
I can’t see a marriage to find the connection.
Added
Here we are - Samuel’s will - she was Jane Dornan
https://apps.proni.gov.uk/willscalendar_ie/WillsSearchImage.aspx?id=213888
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Wilson Jane of 161 Duncairn Gardens Belfast widow died 7 December 1940 Probate Belfast 17 January to George Wilson clerk. Effects £1134 7s. 11d.
Snippet-
Belfast Newsletter, 9 Dec.1940: December 7, 1940, at her residence, Duncairn Gardens, Jane, ... John Brown Wilson. Deeply by her sorrowing Sons, George, also her Sister, ... _son, Glengormley. House and private.
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Death of Samuel Lemon - informant Jane of Tullyard
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05926/4682784.pdf
I can’t see a marriage to find the connection.
Possibly married before 1845?
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Yes that’s the only thing I could think of. Jane was 75 in 1901 so it is possible that they married pre 1845.
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Not sure if this has been posted yet but Elizabeth (Dornan) Patterson Marshall died shortly after giving birth to son William Henry Marshall-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1878/020514/7198891.pdf
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Interesting snippet re the 1880 marriage to McLean-
Belfast Weekly News, 6 Nov.1880: ... William David, son of the late _ M'Lean, Hill_l, to Jane, eldest daughter of the late Samuel Warnock Patterson, and ...
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Samuel and Elizabeths children that I know of: Elizabeth (Born 1871), Jane Lemon Patterson (Born 1862), Sarah (Born 1873), Samuel Warnock Patterson (Born 1874) married Margaret Elizabeth Patterson from Leverogue, Drumbo.
Some things incorrect or incomplete that you've posted at start of this thread.
There were at least 2 daughters named Sarah (neither born 1873). Sarah born 1867 probably died young-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1867/03501/2286897.pdf
Another Sarah born 1871-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1869/03412/2251529.pdf
A son William born 1865-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1865/03576/2318066.pdf
Two possible marriages for him-
William Patterson (c1871) m.(1894 St. Anne’s COI, Belfast) Mary Fleetwood
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1894/10576/5852865.pdf (groom- 63 Lindsay St., father- Warnock Patterson publican, witnesses- James Stewart, Elizabeth Stewart)
William Patterson (1865) m.(1898 St. Anne’s COI, Belfast) Theresa McAravey
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1898/10423/5795081.pdf (groom- 46 Claremount St., father- Warnock Patterson labourer)
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Pottinger/Beersbridge/1216017/ (Teresa)
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Victoria__part_of_/Foundry_Street/225140/
A son James, likely born before 1864, went to Scotland-
James Patterson (c1865?) m.(1885 Scotland)
https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Patterson-10150
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I don't have a lot of time to read through all the replies properly now but thanks everyone for the information so far. Is there a way to access Drumbo Presbyterian Church and Church of Ireland baptism and marriage records? I think that would help me in finding out more about these Pattersons and other relations from that area if I had access to those records.
Heywood, I read the first post of the Census extract and I hadn't seen that before, but the name Maxwell as Josephs mothers name, looks like there is a connection as checking my DNA results on Ancestry, I got a match to a man with the surname Maxwell and another who has an Elizabeth Maxwell from Drumbo and a John Dorman born 1813 as their direct ancestors.
I was told by my granny that my 2nd great grandmother, Margaret Elizabeth Patterson, wife of Samuel Warnock Patterson, when they lived in Tullyard, Drumbeg, she helped a nearby neighbour who was very ill and had tuberculosis. She then she caught it of him and died from it. Perhaps there is a connection to that Dorman and my Patterson family.
Death record of Margaret Patterson: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1909/05464/4529236.pdf
I think the person she was helping was that Robert John Dorman mentioned on that record sheet who died with Phthisis as those Dormans lived in Tullyard also. Dormans on a 1901 Irish Census: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Ballymacbrennan/Tullyard/1239385/
aghadowey, thanks for the record of Elizabeth's death after giving birth to William Henry Marshall. I also didn't know about the first Sarah Patterson birth but I looked again at the documents I was given on the Patterson research and it made a mention of James Patterson but no information so the James Patterson you found who went to Scotland, looks like him.
I found this: https://alison-stewart.blogspot.com/2011/07/reid-wilson-and-agnes-leveletlavalade.html it says In his brother Reid Wilson's will of 1890, Reid only mentions Joseph's son, John Wilson. John Wilson had been born somewhere in England in about 1868 - this according to the census returns of 1901 and 1911.
On 30th January 1892 in Great Victoria Street Church in Belfast, John Wilson of Moira, Co. Down, son of commercial traveller Joseph Wilson, married Jane Patterson of Belfast, the daughter of publican Samuel W. Patterson. This wedding was witnessed by Thomas Agnew and Elizabeth Bertha Hogg.
Jane Patterson was the daughter of Samuel Warnock Patterson, son of James Patterson, and of Elizabeth Dornan, daughter of William Dornan, who had married in Belfast on 4th October 1861. Samuel Warnock Patterson was a publican at 71 May Street in Belfast, but he died young on 31st May 1874. His wife, Elizabeth , was pregnant when he died, and a son, Samuel Warnock Patterson, was born a few months later on 18th October 1874 at 71 May Street. As well as Samuel Warnock and Jane Lemon, Samuel Warnock Patterson and Elizabeth Dornan also had a daughter, Sarah Patterson, who was living with her sister Jane Lemon Wilson, in 1911 at 40 Beechfield Street.
John Wilson and Jane Lemon Patterson had a daughter, Edith Jane Wilson, at 88 Bryson Street on 24th May 1895.
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Death of Samuel Lemon - informant Jane of Tullyard
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05926/4682784.pdf
I can’t see a marriage to find the connection.
Added
Here we are - Samuel’s will - she was Jane Dornan
https://apps.proni.gov.uk/willscalendar_ie/WillsSearchImage.aspx?id=213888
There is a published tree with a newspaper snippet:
When your Jane Lemon Patterson married Mr McLean, she was described as daughter of the late Samuel Warnock Patterson and niece to Samuel Lemon, Tullyard. Important relationship?
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There is a published tree with a newspaper snippet:
When your Jane Lemon Patterson married Mr McLean, she was described as daughter of the late Samuel Warnock Patterson and niece to Samuel Lemon, Tullyard. Important relationship?
That's probably the snippet I posted earlier (reply #12).
The Patterson children were all minors when their father Samuel Warnock Patterson died in 1874. Their uncle by marriage, Samuel Lemon, might have been the guardian to all or at least some of the children. Since Samuel Warnock & sister Jane Lemon were mentioned in the Will of aunt Jane Lemon they might have lived with the couple in Tullyard (since Jane seems to have been named after her aunt she might have looked after her).
To further complicate things, Elizabeth (Dornan) Patterson remarried a few years later then died the following year leaving the children without either parent.
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Oh sorry, aghadowey.
I missed your reference. That seems to be a good explanation.
So the family connection is Dornan rather than Lemon, do you think? Even though Jane had it as her middle name.
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Yes, Jane named after childless aunt.
Here's the correct John & Jane Wilson in 1901-
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Pottinger/Beechfield_Street/1215796/
daughter Edith Jane's birth-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1895/02220/1837629.pdf
In 1892 marriage John's occupation is commercial traveller which is very different from 1901 but closer to labourer in 1895.
Same family in 1911- Jane's sister Sarah transcribed as Pallerson which explains why I couldn't find her earlier.
Boarders listed with family in 1911 so this newspaper article makes sense-
Belfast Newsletter, 19 Jan.1899: ... December till the 2nd inst., and never paid anything during that time. His bill amounted to £1 4s. Mrs. Wilson, 40, Beechfield Street, said the prisoner came to her house in December, 1897, and remained two weeks, his bill amounting to 15s or 16s. He ...
An Edith Simpson at same address in 1924-
Northern Whig, 20 Oct.1924: ... Edith Simpson, 40 Beechfield Street; ...
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Yes, Jane's daughter Edith Jane married Samuel Simpson-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1912/09911/5601936.pdf
son Richard born 1913-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1913/01465/1597915.pdf
son John Wilson born 1914-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1914/01414/1581349.pdf
son Samuel born 1916-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1916/01347/1556019.pdf
son died only 2 days old in 1917-
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/BurialSearch/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7661.33201
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1917/01306/1540298.pdf
daughter Jane Lemon born 1918- informant was grandmother Jane Wilson-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1918/01266/1525446.pdf
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Is there a way to access Drumbo Presbyterian Church and Church of Ireland baptism and marriage records? I think that would help me in finding out more about these Pattersons and other relations from that area if I had access to those records.
https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/publications/guide-church-records
PRONI, Belfast have microfilmed many church records- see above link for details.
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Yes, Jane's daughter Edith Jane married Samuel Simpson-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1912/09911/5601936.pdf
son Richard born 1913-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1913/01465/1597915.pdf
son John Wilson born 1914-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1914/01414/1581349.pdf
son Samuel born 1916-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1916/01347/1556019.pdf
son died only 2 days old in 1917-
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/BurialSearch/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7661.33201
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1917/01306/1540298.pdf
daughter Jane Lemon born 1918- informant was grandmother Jane Wilson-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1918/01266/1525446.pdf
Thanks again. I also found this on GRONI, could be the the same Edith Jane, Widowed, a marriage for a John Wright and widow and Edith Jane Simpson housekeeper widow:
Registration district: Lisburn
Place of marriage: Christ Church, Church of Ireland, Derriaghy, Lisburn
Date of marriage: 26th September 1934
Party 1 name(s): John Wright
Gender of party 1: Male
Age condition at marriage of party 1: Full, Widow
Rank or occupation: Soldier
Residence at time of marriage: Antrim Steet, Lisburn
Fathers name and occupation: Thomas Wright, Rougher
Party 2 name(s): Edith Jane Simpson
Gender of party 2: Female
Age condition at marriage of party 2: Full, Widow
Rank or occupation: Housekeeper
Residence at time of marriage: Bridge End, Derryaghy
Fathers name and occupation: John Wilson (I couldn't read occupation)
Also this, Northern Whig Saturday 21 November 1936: "Simpson - November 19, 1936 at the County Antrim Infirmary, Lisburn. Elizabeth (Betty), dearly-beloved daughter of Edith Wright and the late Samuel Simpson Funeral from her residence, Kennel Lane, Antrim Road, Lisburn to-day (Saturday) at 2 p.m., to Derryaghy"
As that said Kennel Lane, I also found this on PRONI Wills: "Wright John of Kennel Lane Antrim Road Lisburn Antrim salesman died 21 February 1938 at Lisburn Probate Belfast 12 April to Isaac Edward Neill solicitor's manager. Effects £314 17s. 4d."
Would these be for the right Edith Jane and John Wright?
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I found a bit more and it does look like you've found the right people.
Edith Jane Wilson (1895-aft.1938) m.(1912) Samuel Simpson (c1886-10 June 1930); m.(1934) John Wright (d.1938)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1895/02220/1837629.pdf
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1912/09911/5601936.pdf
Belfast Telegraph, 5 Apr.1924: … Samuel Simpson, Beechfield Street, stated that on the 13th March accused took lodgings at witness's house. Prisoner said he was …
Northern Whig, 12 June 1930: SIMPSON— June 10, at his residence, Kosh [?], Tally na<ra [?], Lisburn, Samuel, dearly loved husband of Edith Simpson. Funeral to-day (Thursday), at 3 p.m., to Drumbo.
Belfast Newsletter. 3 Apr.1937: … regretted her sorrowing Father, Step-mother, Step-brothers, Step-sisters, and Uncles, Kennel Lane, Antrim Road, Lisburn. _ -Aprii 2, 1937, Annie, dearly- Sister of May Wright. Funeral from her sister's residence, 48, … Lisburn, to-morrow (Sunday), … [John Wright's daughter from his previous marriage]
Belfast Telegraph, 22 Feb.1938: WRIGHT— February 21, 1938, at his residence, Kennel Lane, Antrim Road. Lisburn. John Wright, dearly-beloved husband of Edith. Funeral to-morrow (Wednesday), at 2-30 p.m., to Derriaghy Churchyard. Deeply regretted by his sorrowing Daughter, Son-in-law …
Wright John of Kennel Lane Antrim Road Lisburn Antrim salesman died 21 February 1938 at Lisburn Probate Belfast 12 April to Isaac Edward Neill solicitor's manager. Effects £314 17s. 4d.
An ancestry tree has Edith died 1965 but married to a David Simpson which is incorrect- https://www.ancestry.co.uk/genealogy/records/edith-jane-wilson-simpson-24-gcpthy
Known children-
1. Richard Simpson (1913)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1913/01465/1597915.pdf
2. John Wilson Simpson (1914)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1914/01414/1581349.pdf
3. Samuel Simpson (1916)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1916/01347/1556019.pdf
4. Son (1917-1917)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1917/01306/1540298.pdf
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/BurialSearch/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7661.33201
5. Jane Lemon Simpson (1918)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1918/01266/1525446.pdf (informant- grandmother Jane Wilson)
6. Elizabeth “Betty” Simpson (c1926-1936)
Northern Whig, 21 Nov.1936: Simpson - November 19, 1936, at the County Antrim Infirmary, Lisburn, Elizabeth (Betty), dearly-beloved daughter of Edith Wright and the late Samuel Simpson. Funeral from her residence, Kennel Lane, Antrim Road, Lisburn to-day (Saturday) at 2 p.m., to Derryaghy.
GRONI's index gives her age as 10 years.
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Death of Samuel Lemon - informant Jane of Tullyard
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05926/4682784.pdf
I can’t see a marriage to find the connection.
Possibly married before 1845?
I was looking up some marriage records and I found these marriage records, and I wonder if its for Samuel Lemon and Janes sons?
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1864/11608/8272777.pdf (https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1864/11608/8272777.pdf)
A double wedding on June 2nd 1864 in the Presbyterian Church, Drumbo:
William John Lemon and Margaret Gordon McMurray - Says he is living in Tullyard and father is Samuel Lemon? A farmer. Does it says Margaret is from Ballyaughlis? Robert Lemon was a witness.
Robert Lemon and Agnes McMaster, again for Robert, same location and father.
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A double wedding on June 2nd 1864 in the Presbyterian Church, Drumbo:
William John Lemon and Margaret Gordon McMurray - Says he is living in Tullyard and father is Samuel Lemon? A farmer. Does it says Margaret is from Ballyaughlis? Robert Lemon was a witness.
Nope....one on the 2nd June, the other on the 3rd June.
Yes, Ballyaughlis townland (as spelt locally)
https://www.townlands.ie/down/castlereagh-upper/drumbeg-down-portion/drumbeg/ballyaghlis/
KG
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A double wedding on June 2nd 1864 in the Presbyterian Church, Drumbo:
William John Lemon and Margaret Gordon McMurray - Says he is living in Tullyard and father is Samuel Lemon? A farmer. Does it says Margaret is from Ballyaughlis? Robert Lemon was a witness.
Nope....one on the 2nd June, the other on the 3rd June.
Yes, Ballyaughlis townland (as spelt locally)
https://www.townlands.ie/down/castlereagh-upper/drumbeg-down-portion/drumbeg/ballyaghlis/
KG
Yes one wedding was on the the 3rd of June, my mistake. Thanks on the townland name.
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I have been researching my Dornan's again and might have found out why I was unable to find them. This is my 3rd Great-Grandparents marriage: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1861/09605/5483183.pdf
It says a Alexander and Margaret Crawford was present at the marriage. I looked them up and found this marriage for a Alexander Crawford and Margaret Dorman in 1856, both living in Drumbo at the time of marriage. Says her father is William Dorman, a farmer: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1856/09513/5447983.pdf
I checked my DNA matches on ancestry for people who has Dorman on their tree and I got several matches who have Dormans from Drumbo and Tullyard, including two who have Alexander Crawford and Margaret Dorman. Their trees say Margaret's parents were William John Dorman (1810-1866) and Grace McCullough, see attached image.
What I would like to confirm is, could my 3rd Great-Grandmother's surname actually be Dorman not Dornan and the Alexander and Margaret Crawford at her and Samuel Warnock Patterson's wedding be the same as on the tree and Margaret is actually Elizabeth's sister?
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Hi There
I am descended from William McCullough Dorman who looks to be the brother of your ancestor?
I have a DNA test at ancestry and myheritage - are we a DNA match?
Cheers
Jane Bailey from NZ