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General => The Common Room => The Lighter Side => Topic started by: Ray T on Thursday 16 September 21 09:59 BST (UK)
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Ann Binnersley's occupation on the 1911 - "Goes out working" - the mind boggles!
https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=1911England&indiv=try&h=21037116
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I see that they've given her occupational code 020, which is charwoman:
https://ourgreatancestors.co.uk/census-record-occupation-codes/
:D
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That’s presumably the enumerators interpretation of “goes out working”?
I believe the traditional interpretation of “working girl” was “dressmaker”!
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Yep - but we know no more than the coder.
Are you casting nasturtiums :P :-X
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In 1901 she was a General Servant (domestic) - 3351/16/23
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My GGrandmother was a ‘dressmaker” - to be exact a fine finisher -beads lace etc.
My father remembers going with her to the posh shop to take back garments
she had embellished for a customer.
My wedding dress was made at the same shop ,Affleck and Brown’s ,Oldham St Manchester.
Viktoria.
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My great aunt was too, Viktoria. She made lovely beaded dresses :) The family were strict Methodists
I remember Affleck and Browns :)
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I have a very very vague recollection that "goes out working" was indeed used as a euphemism for "charwoman" by my mother in the 1950s. In those days when wives were largely expected to stay at home looking after house and children like herself, mum was slightly disparaging of those who "worked", even when in the case of my posher schoolmates, the work may have been in a professional position enabling them to employ a charwoman.
My own favourite unusual occupation I came across in a local census, maybe 1871, was a "velocipede assistant". I assume he worked in a bike shop, but I have visions of him helping old ladies up the local hills for a farthing a shove!
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In Alwyn James' book he describes an entry in the 1841 Census for Edinburgh where there was a large number of female servants and a husband and wife describing themselves as "fleshers" (butchers). The word "flesher had been crossed out and brothel keeper added in red.
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In 1901 she was a General Servant (domestic) - 3351/16/23
I'm sure that there were dressmakers who made dresses and those who didn't!
I assume that's her in 1901 - still showing as married, rather than widowed in 1911. It's really her husband George I'm trying to track down. He was born Shropshire c.1876 - never registered - and they married in Congleton in 1895. Where was he in 1901? I think he may have there died in 1903 - the info I have is all very sketchy. I can't even be sure I have the right Ann - this one was was around 19 years older than George
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I digress- on a 1950’s / 60’s show, A sagger maker’s bottom knocker ——it was something like “ Guess my line”, unusual occupations.
That one was to do with the potteries ,a sagger being something to do with unfired pots,and a frame they were transported on to the kilns.
Any clarification welcome.
Viktoria.
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I digress- on a 1950’s / 60’s show, A sagger maker’s bottom knocker ——it was something like “ Guess my line”, unusual occupations.
That one was to do with the potteries ,a sagger being something to do with unfired pots,and a frame they were transported on to the kilns.
Any clarification welcome.
Viktoria.
http://www.thepotteries.org/bottle_kiln/saggar.htm
My grandfather was a “planker”.
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Thanks for the info, I remember the hilarity in the programme.
Now a planker,I don’t want to cast aspidistras so will look it up ,but I hope you don’t mean one of them there things like wot Del Boy called Rodders- ie a Plonker!
Viktoria,
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It’s one of the many processes in felt hat manufacturing and involves rolling freshly made wet felt between blankets in order to shrink it. The factory had a machine to do it but never used it.
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Of course "Dressmaker" was not always a euphemism for the actual occupation. Sometimes it was real and sometimes that occupation was spelled out in clear, as in the 1861 entry for Elizabeth Kennedy, an 18-year old from Stockport, who was living in Back Piccadilly, Manchester (RG9/2948 folio 88 page 31. Her actual trade and that of her neighbours, is there in the census sheets.
How did the enumerator know?
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Well, he must have done the rounds as there are a number of addresses in the area where females are attributed with an additional profession ::)
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There were 4 of them at that address and another 3 two doors away. Other pages have other "euphomisms".
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Sanitary Engineer——emptied the “ Dolley Vardens” .
Loos, lavies , W,Cs, only there was no water.
Seemingly because part of these “ conveniences” resembled a bonnet as worn at the time of Dickens and Dolly was a character of his.
Help—- “ The Old Curiosity Shop”.?
Viktoria.
Just looked it up,—“ Barnaby Rudge “ and it was “ the night soil cart ,” with its distinctive lid which was nick named The Dolly Varden.
The cart emptied the none flushing toilets.
V.
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We called the council men who emptied ours "the ping-pong men" - well, us kids did! :o :o
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In case anyone's interested in "Back Piccadilly" you'll find it just SW of centre here - https://luna.manchester.ac.uk/luna/servlet/detail/maps002~1~1~338859~123079:%3Ca-rel=-license--href=-http---creat?sort=reference_number%2Ctitle - that was in 1945 and, looking at Google earth, much of it is still there but, alas, not the house Elizabeth Kennedy lived in.
The night soil men were known in these parts as the "Midnight Mechanics" and, so I'm told, they emptied the cans of waste into a large tank on the back of a wagon. The story goes that, one night, one of them was seen leaning over with his hand in the tank and his mate asked what he was doing? "I've dropped me jacket" came the reply. "Well, you won't be for wearing that again" said his mate. "I know" came the reply. ".... but me dinner's in t'pocket".
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In 1887 my 74 year old ancestor was a shoeblack. I heard that also occasionally was a euphemism for a prostitutes pimp. What at 74? ;D
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Manchester is much changed from that map.
Tib St. is now the next street to Oldham St.
Intersected by Church St further up, at the intersection ( near Affleck’s there is a Banksie)
A little lane ran from Oldham St to Present day Tib St.
Not marked but perhaps also “Back Piccadilly “
The side of C&A one side Saxone on the other , it continued across Oldham St behind Woolworth’s to Lever St. There named as Back Piccadilly.
Yates’s Wine lodge on the corner of it and Oldham St. - a very funny sketch by Mike Harding re a “ Ten pound budgie”,a confusion between a turkey etcetc at Christmas in Yate’s Wine lodge.
The promenade in front of Piccadilly gardens was always a place for “ladies of the night - in inclement weather “ Lewis’s Arcade.”
(Around Queen Victoria’s statue ,the “ Ladies in waiting!” )
The arcade AKA “ The Fairy Grotto “ by Uni students at Rag Week
Complete with Father Christmas on Shrove Tuesday.
Many little streets have gone ,Bread street was the name of the street between Tib St and High St,not named on some maps.
Then also named as Back Piccadilly .
Viktoria.
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I was looking at t’other end of Back Piccadilly - near the Rochdale canal - where Elizabeth and the girls lived.
Theres a famous film in the archives somewhere, taken from the Tibb Street end of several people struggling to breathe and waiting to be rescued whilst Woolworths burned. That and the mention of Yates’s reminds me of the time somebody threw a petrol bomb into the wine lodge and, before it had time to go off, somebody had drunk it!
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In 1901 she was a General Servant (domestic) - 3351/16/23
I'm sure that there were dressmakers who made dresses and those who didn't!
I assume that's her in 1901 - still showing as married, rather than widowed in 1911. It's really her husband George I'm trying to track down. He was born Shropshire c.1876 - never registered - and they married in Congleton in 1895. Where was he in 1901? I think he may have there died in 1903 - the info I have is all very sketchy. I can't even be sure I have the right Ann - this one was was around 19 years older than George
??
GRO Births
BINSLEY, GEORGE mmn SIMMONDS
1875 J Quarter in OF NEWPORT IN THE COUNTIES OF SALOP AND STAFFORD Volume 06A Page 828
Maureen
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Thanks for than Maureen - definitely him. I’ve been looking on and off for several years.
Binnersley seems to be one of those names which either gets changed or mis-heard. I have one branch which moved from Shropshire to Wolverhampton and for some inexplicable reason consistently used the name “Billingsley”.
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There used to be a very big church nearby ,St.Andrew’s .
Designated as The Cathedral should the Cathedral be destroyed in the blitz.
Demolished later and the many burials covered with a huge concrete raft ,
No building to be allowed ,but ——
My sister in law was working at Woolworth’s when the fire started, do you know, the assistants had to cash up and take the cash to the office!!!
No one would have had any idea of how bad it would be,the top floor had soft furnishings and the polyurethane foam was giving off the lethal fumes.
S in l worked in the food department in the basement .
People ignored the alarms,- customers , and got belligerent when she refused to serve them .Wanted loaves of bread.
Could not get her coat etc ,just had to get out.
With the cash which she handed to a Policeman with the till roll.
The office was upstairs as I understood it.
My M in L rushed down as it appeared on the TV news .
The bus stopped where Newton St. met Piccadilly ,so a short walk along Piccadilly ,but there were cordons etc preventing people getting near for obvious reasons.
However she was alright , we were in Belgium at the time and it was even on the news there .
On the BBC radio too.
That was a very sad day.
Viktoria.