RootsChat.Com
General => Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing => Topic started by: Alma on Tuesday 07 September 21 00:09 BST (UK)
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Our great grandfathers were brothers. We have both had DNA test done via same Company and no DNA has been confirmed between us. My sibling has also taken DNA test and he does not get a match to any of the individuals on the line of our g.grandfather's brother and nor do I? Is this usual? I'd surely appreciate some advice, thanks
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You have to work with the DNA results. If the 2 Gt. GF's shared even one parent from your x 2 Great Great Grandparents then you and your brother would show a % of shared DNA with the other person.
So you have to work back, have you found the Great GF's living in the same household as children etc. on census.
Remember that there was no formal adoption in the UK until 1926, children changed hands if a parent died , which mothers did frequently in childbirth, social conditions could be very poor for many.
Children became known by a surname and possibly didn't know their original family surname. They didn't need or carry the amount of ID that we do today. So look at any other close DNA matches to you and your brother , try contacting them or looking at trees and areas where they were born, any census with them showing. A lot of detective work, you have to take things slowly. And I'm sure someone else would give you similar advice
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Thanks for response. I have researched extensively however and the other line has been researched also. I am quite sure there were no adoptions looking at the various records. Interestingly I can establish links with other family members carrying the Surname back to early 1800s and have plotted them back to the village of origin of my family line - so in short - is it possible for two individuals who share g.grandfathers who were brothers to not have a DNA match or is this a silly question? Maybe the answer is sometimes "yes" and sometimes "no". I just find it odd that I have found DNA links to folks even more distantly related so this has become a bit of a stumbling block!!
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Sometimes the paper trail is not correct, especially following the male line.
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I agree the paper trail is vital
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Thanks for your reply Alma, and your question is not a silly one. But DNA is the vital point and the fact that if you and the other persons Gt GF were even half brothers, then you would share some cMs of DNA between them, yourself and your brother.
You may have to go to the extreme length of your brother doing Y DNA testing, and if the other person is male or has a close male relative who would also be willing to test. Not cheap, but might solve the ridlle if it's a paternal line
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Oh thank you so much - I do feel silly not being able to get the head around it all. I have been a tad cautious about accepting the relationship from day 1 just because of the lack of supporting evidence and also the place of birth has not been given other than "Ireland", and there is a different mother's maiden surname on marriage certificate but this has been ignored as not fitting with the facts and perhaps there has been family lore I am not party to but I have been informed we are definitely related but I am still a doubting Thomas. Its very easy to feel one is becoming obstructive - I'd happily accept it all but just feel we are on rough ground and perhaps the lack of supporting DNA is a pointer to my concerns. Oh dear - the down-side of a wonderful interest. I've got lots of links on my line worldwide but not a hint to this family....all very odd!
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Well if and when you can do so, it might be an idea to have your brother Y DNA tested. Y DNA changes very little over 100's years, and would give you a good idea. And there are many surname projects who would welcome your brother and give advice.
I was going to point out earlier that really , if these 2 Gt. GF's were brought up together then someone has Good Samaritan Great Great Grandparents, and you are all descendants. But you didn't answer my question about finding the 2 men together anywhere on census details.
Perhaps if you do find answers you could add another message on here, it's been read by a few people . And you can always ask for more advice if necessary
Good luck
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Hi Alma,
Your last post seems to cast doubt on the assertions belong made.
Is the other party claiming the relationship?
Are you basing this on published trees?
It is difficult when you just have ‘Ireland’ as a birthplace and you can only go on the evidence of the paper trail you have searched yourself.
Is it a popular surname that your ancestors share?
Heywood
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No I have never found the two men together in any census records. Yes, the other person is claiming the relationship. The Surname is reasonably common in the area in Ireland (I'd prefer not to mention here for obvious reasons). No mention of any relationships were published in the death notices but this was not common anyway in the relevant timeframe. Yes, the info was based on research carried out by the other family. I might have to get the brother tested with that other test! Thanks everyone!
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Wait for the sales at the end of the year around Thanksgiving & Christmas. Obviously you get more info if you go for the higher markers tests, but even to 37 markers may unlock the door
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Thanks again!
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I assume a male from the other family has to take the test, is that right?
Just to say, that my husband and I both have Irish heritage and looking at DNA contacts, if there is a published tree, although there are no obvious links, I can tell from the surnames which are local to our areas how the likely match has arisen. With the lack of records and emigration (I am going back to 1800s) matches cannot be made. But the DNA link is there.
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I will send a p/message re the Surname! Thank you!
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If the other family have a male available and willing to test it would possibly show up different Haplogroups on the YDNA if they were different, but equally it could show the same Haplogroup. But a different Haplogroup would certainly prove a different male surname line change somewhere . Alma's brother could also find matches that prove her research
There are certain markers that don't change or very little showing an ancestor in common many generations back. Big Y is the most recent on the market ( and the most expensive!!!) so not for the faint hearted. I manage a family kit that's tested to 111 Markers, one down from Big Y, so I have to check results & matches also in their project.. .
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Sounds very involved ! but thats for giving me the low-down
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Like most things the more you practise the better you become ( hopefully) because I'm definitely still learning. I have noticed more people with Irish Ancestry ( includes the kit I manage) are testing because it does help research on paternal lines.