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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Renfrewshire => Topic started by: Rod Blackshaw on Wednesday 19 May 21 11:44 BST (UK)
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Hi
I have been trying to sort out the early life of my gggranny Agnes GENTLES SHARPE. She was born in Paisley in 1843 though I cannot subsequently find her in any census records until she turns up in London in the 1871 census. Her parents were Janet GENTLES and Andrew SHARPE who married in Paisley and, as far as I know, had all their children there.
She married Alexander STEVENSON SCOTT (1834-1877), an engraver from Edinburgh, in October 1861. They had 6 children. The first, Agnes GENTLES PATRICK SCOTT was born in Duddington in August 1861. I initially doubted this record because of the two dates but have a photograph of the mother and child. By 1866 the family were in London.
Agnes GENTLES SHARPE was a legatee of Robert PATRICK who was at 4 Bank Street Paisley when he died. Unfortunately I have no will to cast light on the relationship, only financial records. If I have the right one, Robert PATRICK married Agnes GENTLES in Paisley in 1831.
Has anyone got any light they can shed on this consortium of families, clarifying relationships and/or antecedents?
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I guess you may have seen this on SP?
Robert Patrick Inventory only Paisley Sheriff Court 16/2/1880
sometime residing in Bank Street, Paisley, latterly in Canal Street, there, d. 23/09/1878 at Paisley, testate
SC58/42/47
Colin
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This is how the record appears on SP.
AGNES GENTLES SHARP ANDREW SHARP/JANET GENTLES Born 24 MAY 1842 Baptised 12 JUNE 1842 PAISLEY - GEORGE STREET UNITED SECESSION
Colin
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I note the family were at Incle St. Paisley (Abbey) 1841 & 1851 below.
SHARP Andrew Head M M 51 Handloom Weaver RFW Paisley
SHARP Janet Wife M F 45 Weaver Pirn Winder RFW Paisley
SHARP Margret Dau U F 21 Shawl Sewer Warehouse RFW Paisley
SHARP Andrew Son - M 11 School RFW Paisley
SHARP Robert Son - M 8 School RFW Paisley
SHARP James Son - M 6 RFW Paisley
SHARP Janet Dau - F 4 RFW Paisley
HART Ellisabeth - U F 18 Servant RFW Paisley
Strange that Agnes is not with them. I do not see her elsewhere in Scotland. Also I do not see birth records for any of the children above in Renfrewshire?
Colin
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On the 1861 census at 6,East Buchanan Street Abbey Burgh
Robert Patrick age 57
Agnes Patrick age 60
Agnes L Patrick age 16 born Paisley ( niece ) ???
Also Alexander Scott 26 born Edinburgh ( artist engraver )
Don't see Agnes with her family on other census forms so maybe this is a possibility
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This is how the record appears on SP.
AGNES GENTLES SHARP ANDREW SHARP/JANET GENTLES Born 24 MAY 1842 Baptised 12 JUNE 1842 PAISLEY - GEORGE STREET UNITED SECESSION
Colin
Appears to have been a twin birth for Robert Patrick Sharp 24 May 1842
Rosie
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You are right Rosie, strange that did not show up on SP when I did a surname search?
ROBERT PATRICK SHARP
ANDREW SHARP/JANET GENTLES
24 MAY 1842
12 JUNE 1842
PAISLEY - GEORGE STREET UNITED SECESSION
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Others are there now.
John 1837
Andrew 1839
James 1844
Jessie 1847
Colin
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Yes think something funny is going on I thought it was my internet must be gremlins ;D
Rosie
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On the 1861 census at 6,East Buchanan Street Abbey Burgh
Agnes L Patrick age 16 born Paisley ( niece ) ???
Don't see Agnes with her family on other census forms so maybe this is a possibility
This is the record on freecen, with the others you mention but why Patrick?
PATRICK Agnes G Niece U F 18 RFW Paisley
On SP
AGNES C PATRICK 18 Abbey Burgh, Renfrew
Colin
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Maybe brought up by her Aunt ??? She names a son Robert Patrick Scott born Surrey about 1867:..Still can't find her on the 1851 census
Rosie
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Think I have found her in Midlothian on freecen census 1851
17,Cheyne Street Midlothian
Robert Patrick 45 born Ochiltree Ayr salesman in distillery
Agnes Patrick 47 wife born Paisley
Agnes Patrick 8 born Paisley niece
Rosie
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ROBERT PATRICK married AGNES GENTLES
14/05/1831 Abbey
Colin
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ANDREW SHARP married JANET GENTILES 15/12/1823 Abbey
Colin
SP does seem to be misbehaving.
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Looks like they were sisters ;)
Rosie
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Maybe half sisters?
ROBERT GENTLES to CHRISTIAN MCFARLANE 14/11/1793 Paisley High Church
Children: AGNES 25/09/1794, MARION 1796 & ROBERT MENZIES 1798
It is possible Christian died 1798 – 1800 but no records for Paisley High Church on SP.
ROBERT GENTLES to MARY MCEWEN 26/10/1800 Paisley High Church
James 1801, William 1803, JANET 26/08/1804
Colin
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The death for Agnes Gentles other name Patrick 1873 age 78 Abbey Burgh
Mothers maiden name McFarlane
Rosie
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In 1841 Robert Patrick 35 a Cooper born OUC & Agnes Gentles 35 born RFW (as noted) are at Blackhall Buildings, Abbey, Paisley.
There a no birth records for any children. The 1861 census notes that Robert was born in Ayrshire. However I cannot find an 1851 census for them, which might explain no record for Agnes Sharp/e?
Colin
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Reply 11.. I found them in Midlothian on Scotland's People also
Rosie
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Sorry Rosie missed that. Problem solved I believe?
Colin
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1871 census 4,Bank Street Abbey Renfrew
Rob Patrick age 66 born Ayrshire spirit dealer retired
Agnes Patrick age 69 born Paisley
Agnes Gentles Patrick age 8 born Paisley
There is no births for a Agnes Gentles Patrick but there is one for
Agnes Gentles P Scott 1862 Abbey Burgh so this is the daughter of Agnes Sharpe and Alexander Scott
Rosie
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I don't know why the change in the name did you get a copy of the marriage certificate on
Scotlands People to see what it says ..Address and witnesses
Rosie
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Hi
You have been working hard and I am impressed by what you have found out. It does help clarify things. The birth date of 1862 for Agnes GENTLES PATRICK SCOTT is later than the one I had previously found and fits better with the marriage date of the parents. I have no record of her death but she does not feature in any census data I have seen.
I have re-checked the executor accounts for Robert PATRICK and there looks to have been three legatees - Agnes GENTLES SCOTT, Alexander STEVENSON SCOTT and Robert PATRICK McMULLEN. Agnes was the principle legatee and my records show that she was receiving £12/month from the estate in 1912. Alexander got a watch and chain which would have been no use to him because he died the year before! Robert received £100.
Many thanks for getting things this far. I still have a few credits on SP, so I will dive in again and see how fare I can get base don what you have found out.
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Glad it has cleared up some things for you are you talking about the death of Agnes Gentles born 1862 ..I will have a look I'm sure I found her in England
Rosie
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That's the one. I have been unable to find her. She can't be more than a year old in the picture I have of her but that is the last trace I have. If you have come across something about her in England that would be great.
Her mother is a bit more of an open book: widowed in 1877; 'housekeeper' for a single man in 1881 with her kids in boarding school or elsewhere; cited in a divorce in 1888; remarried in 1889; honeymooned in Russia; put her second husband in an asylum; died in 1919 in Christchurch and, judging by the tenor of her will was probably not much mourned!
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Found your Agnes Gentles Patrick Scott
Marriage 30 March 1887 St Mary Lambeth
Agnes Scott age 24 spinster residence Paisley father Alexander Stevenson Scott artist
Spouse George Faaz age 26 bachelor hotel clerk father John Faaz
One of the witnesses was Agnes G Scott
Death for Agnes Gentles Patrick Faaz 1892 Lambeth England age 30 years
Burial 11 October 1892 Norwood Cemetery Lambeth
Address was 90,Sandmere. Road Clapham
Rosie
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1891 Census Sandmere Road
George Faaz age 36 hotel clerk
Agnes Faaz age 28 her place of birth is down. as England
George Faaz age 7 son
Albert Faaz age 6 son
Winifred Faaz age 5 Daughter
All births can be found on gro.gov.in mothers name Scott
Children all born before the marriage
Rosie
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George Faaz died 21st December 1909 Strand London according to probate record
Probate record for their son Albert Faaz of 6,Childebert road Surrey was last seen alive 21 January 1929. Body was found on 3 rd Febuary 1929 Ankwyrke Corner Ethan Surrey
Probate London to his sister Winifred Agnes Yougi wife of Edward .The name is Jungi
Winifred married 1907 Portsmouth Andrew Jungi
British Army overseas marriages George J Faaz spouse Rose M Pradal Algiers 1906
He died 1937 ..
Rosie
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Thanks for all the effort finding this stuff out. It really is much appreciated. I am still at a loss to explain where the younger Agnes Scott spent her childhood but this is nothing new for me - I have a granny with a similar record gap between birth and marriage.
Kind regards
rod
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Yes it's strange she was not with her parents.. going by the census records she appears to have been with Robert Patrick and his wife Agnes ..She died very young very sad
Rosie