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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: artlover123 on Thursday 18 February 21 14:51 GMT (UK)

Title: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: artlover123 on Thursday 18 February 21 14:51 GMT (UK)
Dear Friends,

Please find photographs below of the front and back of a portrait I have recently acquired. I am at a loss regarding the sitter despite the information provided on the back of the painting. It was catalogued as Colin Campbell (British Army officer, born 1776), however, I don't believe this to be correct given the names of the sitter's relations present, also his being Royal Navy. There are some interesting leads on first searches and any help would be most appreciated!

Best wishes,

Joshua
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: artlover123 on Thursday 18 February 21 14:53 GMT (UK)
PS
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Kay99 on Thursday 18 February 21 16:41 GMT (UK)
I think this may be his son's marriage  https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QLS4-MV12

The press notice states that his father Captain Colin Campbell was from Spa, Gloucester and in 1841 Colin Campbell Capt RN age 60 born Scotland was living in Littleworth Gloucester  with wife Elmira

Kay

Added - Looks like he died in 1842 and his will is on Anc and his wife's will  1843 which is much more detailed is also on Anc
Name:    Colin Campbell Esq
Residence:    Littleworth, Gloucestershire, England
Probate Date:    5 Dec 1842
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Kay99 on Thursday 18 February 21 17:39 GMT (UK)
Marriage Walcot Somerset 9 Dec 1823
Colin Campbell  Capt in Royal Navy - Widower to Elmira Gore - Widow

Kay

Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 February 21 19:28 GMT (UK)
Marriage Walcot Somerset 9 Dec 1823
Colin Campbell  Capt in Royal Navy - Widower to Elmira Gore - Widow

Kay

Widow of the late Lieut, General Richard Gore.
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 February 21 19:31 GMT (UK)
Wonder if this is them.

11 September 1828 - Sun (London)

Or is it the younger Capt Colin Campbell RN who appears a lot? (Not related as far as I can see) and I think married 1847.
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 February 21 19:37 GMT (UK)
Then there is this Colin Campbell RN

29 September 1836 - Caledonian Mercury

Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 February 21 19:41 GMT (UK)
The Ardpatrick one someone else?

30 June 1827 - Durham County Advertiser

Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Kay99 on Friday 19 February 21 05:05 GMT (UK)
John Campbell   21 Apr 1831
Marriage Place  South Hamlet, Gloucestershire
Spouse:    Jane Smith Stone

This may be the couple in 1861 living in Hastings   John is listed as a retired Capt in HM Indian Army
 
John Campbell  56 Stepney, Middlesex
Jane Campbell Wife 64 Dorton, Buckinghamshire
Eliza A A Stone Niece 21 Brendon?? Buckinghamshire
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7T7-QKY

And 1881 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q27J-6S4S

Kay

Added - Eliza A Stone living with the family as a niece 1861 married  James Taylor 7 Apr 1863 at St.Stephens, Westbourne Park and I think in 1881 she was living in Oxford with her family including son Colin which ties in the detials on the back of the portrait https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q27H-TS87
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Kay99 on Friday 19 February 21 05:38 GMT (UK)
As John lists his birth place as Stepney in 1861 this might be his baptism

John Campbell
Birth 15 Oct 1804
Baptism    8 Nov 1804   Saint Dunstan,Stepney,London
Father:    Colin Campbell
Mother:    Amelia

Kay
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Kay99 on Friday 19 February 21 05:47 GMT (UK)
Marriage John Campbell - Ameila Patterson
11 Nov 1802 St. Mary'S, Lambeth, Surrey
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Rosinish on Friday 19 February 21 07:32 GMT (UK)
I think 'the sitter' is this chap...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_Campbell_(British_Army_officer,_born_1776)

Annie

Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Rosinish on Friday 19 February 21 07:38 GMT (UK)
A look through this lot may be worthwhile...

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_q=colin%20campbell

Annie
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: mckha489 on Friday 19 February 21 09:00 GMT (UK)
I think 'the sitter' is this chap...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_Campbell_(British_Army_officer,_born_1776)

Annie

Isn’t he an Army chap, where as the man in the painting is Royal Navy
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Kay99 on Friday 19 February 21 09:20 GMT (UK)
I think 'the sitter' is this chap...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_Campbell_(British_Army_officer,_born_1776)

Annie

Isn’t he an Army chap, where as the man in the painting is Royal Navy

Looking at the wiki entry this Colin isn't listed with a son John and he was colonel in the 99th Foot 1834–1836 not a Captain
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: mckha489 on Friday 19 February 21 09:35 GMT (UK)
One of the daughters of Eliza A Stone and James Taylor was Leila Campbell Taylor.
What with that, and calling a son Colin, they were obviously very attached.
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 19 February 21 20:29 GMT (UK)
This painting was up for auction yesterday. I saw link yesterday and now can't find it  :-\

Maybe from same auction house, see page 17 https://parkerfineartauctions.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/Parker-18th-February-correct-tag.pdf

46.James Ramsay (1786-1854) BritishPortrait of Sir Colin Campbell (1792-1863)Oil on PanelSigned, Inscribed and Dated 1837 on the reverseUnframed, 12” x 10” (30.5 x 25.4cm)£300-£400

Colin Campbell was born in Glasgow in 1792, the son of a carpenter.His uncle paid to educate him and introduced him to the Duke ofYork as a candidate for a commission in the army.Campbell’s extraordinary military career began in 1808, sailing toPortugal with the 9th Regiment with Sir Arthur Wellesley’s (later tobecome the Duke of Wellington) expedition and he soon rose to therank of Captain. Nearly 30 years later, after many more campaignsand distinguished service, Campbell went to China. He reachedHong Kong in 1842 and was involved in the Opium Wars, where hewas mentioned in despatches, appointed aide-de-camp to QueenVictoria, promoted to Colonel and created a CB.He was appointed a KCB in 1849, following a posting to India and longed to retire, but he was persuaded to stay for another three years.He returned to England in 1853 after an absence of 12 years and took a year’s holiday before going to Crimea and fighting at the battle of Alma. He was appointed as commander at Balaclava and made a GCB the following year. Campbell was sent to Calcutta in July 1857 in response to the Indian Mutiny and the death of General Anson. In 1858 he was elevated to the peerage as Lord Clyde of Clydesdale and he left Indiain poor health in 1860. He died in August 1863 and is buried atWestminster Abbey.


However....that is the wrong Colin Campbell, as the CC described above was also army. Quite a lot on him online such www.westminster-abbey.org/abbey-commemorations/commemorations/colin-campbell-lord-clyde

Think you guys have got the right Captain Colin Campbell  ;)

Monica
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 19 February 21 20:33 GMT (UK)
Sold for £550 (reserve was £300)!

www.easyliveauction.com/catalogue/lot/48bfa840e4a2ee46ec0f3db924857823/0af8d24542e81eb9357e7ef448a6646f/fine-paintings-sale-lot-46/?utm_source=barnebys&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=barnebys&utm_content=2021-02-18

Monica
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: artlover123 on Sunday 21 February 21 16:51 GMT (UK)
Thanks all!

So what we know is that Capt. Colin Campbell died in 1842 was from Spa, Gloucester, married in Somerset 1823 and that the marriage details on the reverse of the picture refer to his son Capt. John Campbell. Has anyone come across his date of birth, his life story, or family tree?

Many thanks again,

(Sorry if I missed anything above, was hard piecing the various posts together)

Joshua

PS. I did succeed in the auction on this one yes, I think its a rather marvellous thing visually but would love to know more about the man in the picture and even how he met James Ramsay, as far as I can see there is no record of this picture but then again there is no expert on the artist from what I can see, despite being somewhat well known. Thanks again.
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: spendlove on Sunday 21 February 21 22:35 GMT (UK)
As Captain Colin Campell RN was born in Scotland

Could this be him, they do state died 1851 but this could be an error.

https://collections.rmg.co.uk/archive/objects/510520.html

Spendlove
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: mckha489 on Sunday 21 February 21 23:36 GMT (UK)
But that one was a rear admiral in the finish.  They would have surely put that on the obit of our one. The trouble is there are at least three and perhaps four  Naval Colin Campbells I have found so far.

Also, There is only the one son John mentioned in his will.
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Kay99 on Monday 22 February 21 02:55 GMT (UK)
Sadly on this death annoucement in the Cheltenham Journal and Gloucestershire Fashionable Weekly Gazette on 10 October 1842 no mention is made of his birthplace

Kay
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: mckha489 on Monday 22 February 21 03:00 GMT (UK)
and there was one notice that said he was 73, and another that said 70.
GRO ref says he was 70
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: artlover123 on Monday 22 February 21 14:49 GMT (UK)
How confounding! If only our ancestors were better documented
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: Malcolm419 on Wednesday 17 March 21 02:44 GMT (UK)
This is a great portrait and a great find - congratulations to the buyer!  I don't have the answer to the sitter's origin, only a clue - might he be the naval Captain Colin Campbell referred to in the following obituary of Captain Robert Campbell of the Bombay Army, published in Blackwood's Edinburgh Magazine, February 1821 (vol. 8, p. 601)?  This Colin Campbell is NOT the Rear-Admiral Colin Campbell of Ardpatrick mentioned earlier in this thread; Rear-Admiral Colin was of the well-documented and wealthy Shawfield Campbells. The sitter is also emphatically NOT Field-Marshall Colin Campbell, later Lord Clyde, with whom the auctioneers seem to have him confused.  If the sitter is the brother of Captain Robert of the Bombay Army, his origins remain obscure.  There's nothing in the public records of either Robert or the other surviving brother, Major John Campbell, indicating their parentage.

Major John Campbell settled as a planter in Jamaica (owning estates at Belgar and Lucky Hill in the parish of St Thomas in the Vale), following his war injuries.  He appoints his brother, Captain Colin Campbell of the Royal Navy, as one of his executors in a will made in 1832.  Major John (promoted to Lieutenant-Colonel in his retirement) dies in 1835; his will is among the PCC wills available on ancestry.

I'd be delighted if any of this rings any bells which could point of the parentage of this "band of brothers". 
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: slmdem on Sunday 27 June 21 14:54 BST (UK)
Following extensive ONLINE research, and considerable untangling of all the many individuals of the same names who lived at that time, a summary of the principal data found for these "Band of Seven Brothers" (the first 4 being as yet unknown) is as follows:-

(5) Capt. Colin Campbell, Royal Navy (c.1776-1842), retired RN 1814, lived at Brunswick House, Gloucester,
married (1st) 1802 (London), Amelia PATERSON (1783-1808), dau. of Daniel PATERSON (London), had an only child,

       Capt. John Campbell, HEICS (1804-1884), married 1831, Jane Smith STONE (1796-1885), no 
       issue;

married (2nd) 1823 (Walcot, Somerset), Elmira PAGE (c.1774-1843), widow of Lt.-Gen. Richard GORE, no issue.

(6) Lt.-Col. John Campbell, 55th Regt., (c.1780-1832), half-pay 1818, lived at Belgar, Jamaica (coffee plantation),
married 1808 (Exeter), Anne ROWLAND, dau. of Edward ROWLAND (Liverpool), had issue (who all lived and died in Jamaica),

   1.- John Charles Campbell (1809-1854), married Louisa Samuels (surname unknown))
   2.- Edward Colin Campbell (1813- ?)

(7) Capt. Robert Campbell, 9th N.I., HEICS (c.1782-1820), Barrack-master at Surat, India,
married 1819 (Edinburgh), Jane CAMPBELL (c.1793-1852 at Saughton Hall Mental Asylum, Edinburgh) *SEE NOTE BELOW*, dau. of Archibald CAMPBELL, writer (Edinburgh) [see "The Scots Peerage", Campbell of Breadalbane], had an only child,

   Archibald (1820-1820), died infant in Bombay

NOTE :- There is an important error in "Records of clan Campbell in the military service of the honourable East India Company 1600-1858", which has been subsequently repeated in many pedigrees online, indicating that Jane Campbell married Capt. Robert Campbell (died 1840) of Ardchattan; this has now been proved to be INCORRECT (see proofs in the family tree mentioned below).

The complete family tree (named CAMPBELL) of the above, with all the proofs attached, can be found on Ancestry – when researching the "Profile" for an individual, please click on "GALLERY" to find all the items of evidence, and in particular download the WORD file named for that individual, in which will be found many screenshots from online sources that considerably expand our knowledge of their lives (e.g. there is a fascinating eyewitness account of Capt. Robert in a field hospital at Bergen op Zoom in 1814 after being wounded by grapeshot).

Frustratingly, apart from the fact that the England Census 1841 indicates that Capt. Colin was born in Scotland, and that Capt. Robert was married in Scotland, no link has yet been found to any family there. Some clue to their origins might be found by deeper research into their individual service records. If anyone can provide any further details of the family of these "Magnificent Seven", do please post here.
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: slmdem on Monday 28 June 21 13:00 BST (UK)
https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=GBM%2FGREP%2FNAVY%2F00530117

Register of Captains, Commanders & Lieutenants applying for Greenwich Hospital out-pensions

An interesting commentary for Capt. Colin Campbell, giving his age in 1835, some details of his service, his present health, and reference once again to the "Band of Seven Brothers".
Title: Re: Latest portrait: Who is the sitter?
Post by: slmdem on Monday 28 June 21 13:08 BST (UK)
https://threedecks.org/index.php?display_type=show_crewman&id=4317

Further details of Capt. Colin Campbell's service record:-

copyright image removed