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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Shropshire => Topic started by: Auckland1962 on Thursday 24 December 20 00:06 GMT (UK)
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Phew, where do I start? Help! I'm new at this. My Grand Mother, Harriet Davies, was born in, well that varies depending on which census record you look at. Her husband put Wiilmington on the 1911 census. Now I've looked for a Wiilmington in Shropshire to no avail. She was born in 1879 and on her marriage certificate it shows her father as George. I can't find any Harriet who's father was George. I have found a John Davies with at least her at the right age on the 1881 census for shropshire and at least three other siblings that I know of; all of the right ages. On the 1881 census I've found a Harriet Davies who's father is John and she is born in Chirbury. I can't find her on the 1891 census. Is there anyone out there who might be related?
My name grand father was a Joseph Pemberton, who also came from Shorpshire.
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Harriet & Joseph are in Ardwick, Lancashire in 1911.
Presumably this is their marriage - What information does the marriage give regarding her fathers occupation, who were the witnesses
Sep qtr 1900
Davis Harriet
Pemberton Joseph
Chorlton 8c 1246
1901 living Ardwick
Joseph Pemberton age 25 occ Lurry Carter (Railway) bn Whitchurch, Shropshire
Harriet age 22 bn Whitchurch, Shropshire
George age 2 bn Manchester, Lancashire
RG13/Piece 3675 Folio 80 Page 17
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Marriage image is available on FindMyPast:
14 July 1900 - St Paul, Chorlton on Medlock
Joseph Pemberton, 23, bachelor, Carter. Father: George, Farm Labourer
Harriet Davies, 21, spinster. Father: George (deceased), Farm Labourer
Witnesses: James Ashley and Martha Bayliss
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Thank you BumbleB :)
I assume that the age of young George in 1901 should be 2 months rather than 2 years. It does not state months on image
PEMBERTON, GEORGE mmn DAVIES
1901 Mar Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 785
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Her husband put Wiilmington on the 1911 census.
It actually says Willmitten. Wilmington is in Chirbury parish near Bishop's Castle.
https://ukga.org/index.php?pageid=24930
Debra :D
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Wilmington
https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by-side/#zoom=15&lat=52.60643&lon=-3.03938&layers=6&right=BingHyb
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I have no idea if this is relevant
The one witness on Harriet and Josephs marriage is James Ashley.
There is a birth on GRO S Qtr 1879 Harriet Davies MMN Ashley Newport in the Counties of Salop and Stafford.
There is a marriage for George Davies and Mary Ashley 1 Mar 1863 Liverpool, St Peter, Lancashire, England although Georges occupation is Mariner, there is also a death for George Davies 1873 Liverpool Lancashire age 35 years occupation Sailor
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All those that have replied so far to this request, I thank you for taking the time. Young George in the 1901 census is their son (Joseph and Harriet) who died later in 1903. yes, I got the Wiilmitten wrong. I still think this is, or should be Wilmington (guess or assumption on my part) John Davies who might be my great Grand Father, rather than the George on their marriage certificate. If it is John then he was born in Montgomeryshire (Kerry) which is just over the border from Chirbury, where, on the census for 1881 for John, Harriet appears age 2. I know its a long shot but I can't find a George, with a Harriet as a child who would be about 2 in any census of 1881 in Shropshire.
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Hi,
I can see a family in Wellington, Shropshire with a father George (who is a farm labourer) in 1881 - mothers name Mary. (Possibly Harriet's father?)
There is no Harriet present but there is a Harriet with Grandparents in Shrewsbury in the same census. Too early to say if connected but worth exploring more maybe?
A long shot - the mothers maiden name for the George/Mary children was Taylor. There is also a Mary Ann Davies born 1879 March Qtr Wellington which seems to fit with a Taylor as mothers maiden name. Could Mary Ann be Harriet?
Have to go out now but worth you looking at? Have you been able to establish Harriet's birth and death dates?
Alan
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Greetings Alan
Always know her to be Harriet and so does everyone else that knew her. Born 11th of May 1879 died in Manchester 1970, aged 91. I know all about her while she was in Manchester from her marriage in 1900. Where she lived etc. I even know something of her life prior to getting to Manchester, but its where she was born, and a birth certificate, once I can find that I can then establish her fathers name. I might have to settle on John as being her father and not George as on her marriage certificate.
Ron
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This may be a possible from the 1891 census although not a match for date of birth given on death reg
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:W9XF-SW2
I think the same girl is a nurse child with the same family in 1881 but named Hannah not Harriet
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q27J-1RCJ
Possible birth reg
Harriet Davies dec qtr 1877 Ellesmere vol 6a pg 743 mother's maiden name blank
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Hi,
I am confused.
You say Harriet died 1970 age 91.
In 1939 she is living with 2 sons and has the name Ellison wriiten Pemberton is crossed out, she married John T Ellison in 1942.
There is a death for Harriet Ellison in June 1974 that gives the same birth date as 1939.
Is this the correct Harriet and is the same father named on the marriage to John T Ellison?
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Hi,
You may want to just try purchasing a couple of potential birth certificates (and if they are wrong it rules them out) - The GRO site has a list of 25 Harriet Davies born in 1879. In the Shropshire area there are principally 2 - are they worth considering -
Harriet Davies - June Qtr 1879 District Forden 11b/215 mothers maiden name Davies or
Harriet Elizabeth Davies - March Qtr District Atcham 6a/739 mothers maiden name Lee
My own inclination would be to buy the first one to see if it helps to solve the problem.
Alan
PS - is her birth date 17 March 1879 and not as previously shown
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Always know her to be Harriet and so does everyone else that knew her.
It is not unusual to see names mistranscribed by enumerators in their copies of the original returns. Some handwriting was just as difficult to read then as it is now.
I might have to settle on John as being her father and not George as on her marriage certificate.
Don't do that. You don't know anything about Harriet - she may have been illegitimate, or born with a different surname, so many possibilities.
Debra :D
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Hello Ron,
I have looked at this problem again and am starting to wonder wonder if her father was actually John.
Her 1900 marriage certificate shows both fathers christian names as George - if this is an error (which is possible), probably the only things you can rely on are her father had died and he was a farm labourer. Also you have her birth date 17 March 1879.
A John Davies (agricultural labourer) was living in Whittington, Shropshire in 1891 and whilst Harriet is not there 5 of the 6 children shown were born in Whittington (the only exception being Thomas age 10 born in Chuchstoke). This leads me to wonder if Harriet said Whittington when asked because her parents lived there? John (a farm labourer) died 27 Jan 1896 according to some trees on Ancestry - this would fit.
The family in 1881 (Wales census for Montgomeryshire) included a Harriet (born Chirbury) living at Oak Cottage, Churchstoke - John is still shown as an agricultural labourer.
To see if it is her I would get hold of the birth certificate for the Forden district and if this shows the right birth date you may have found the answer.
Good luck
Alan
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Hello Alan
My apologies for not replying since your last message. It has been our Christmas holiday season here in New Zealand and my partner and I have been touring the South Island. I'm just going through my emails now I'm back home. I've found out that my grand mother married again in 1942, so I'm waiting on her marriage certificate (from the GRO) to see if she changed the name of her father. I hope it was John then I can start the trail anew. I hear what you say about mistakes, having only really started into this genealogy properly in the last few years, I'm finding that there are quite a few mistake sin records and that you have to sometime take things with a "pinch of salt"
Thank you for all your effort
Ron Pemberton