RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Topic started by: Matt R on Friday 30 October 20 18:22 GMT (UK)
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Hello Rootschatters,
I am hoping that someone may be able to assist me in locating a birth certificate in Northern Ireland.
A baptism on August 30 1876 in Downpatrick's RC Church tells me that Ellen Owens was the daughter of Bernard Owens and Eliza Fox, but while I can find her siblings, her birth certificate eludes me.
Can I please ask if others mind looking her up for me, just for some new pairs of eyes? Her parents had married in 1858 so she wasn't illegitimate and as far as I can see as her parent's second youngest child, cannot see any evidence that she was adopted.
Any help you are able to provide would be warmly welcomed.
Kind regards,
Matt.
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Family Search has most extracted Irish births 1864-c1881 and I did a parent search without seeing a daughter Ellen listed. I also didn't find a record on Irish Genealogy so there might be a few possibilities.
1) birth never registered
2) child baptised and died soon after withour either event being registered
3) error in baptismal register
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Have you any sightings of her afterwards?
Only there is an Ellen Owens born Ireland 1876 in Scotland in 1891 as Adopted Servant age 15.
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Hello both,
Thank you for your responses to my query!
Ellen Owens was born in Downpatrick in 1876 and was baptised there 30/8/1876. As far as I can make out, she then moved with her family to Scotland in 1884 where she married twice before dying in 1933. The 1891 census showing her in Scotland is the one you have found, Millie!
i'm trying to think of why the birth of one child may not be registered when those before and after her were. Unless of course, she was adopted ...
Thank you both for your help. I knew I wasn't going spare!
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Here is the baptism - 1876
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633164#page/34/mode/1up
I can see a birth for Catherine Downey baptised 14th August and a birth for Hugh Gordon baptised September 15th.
I can’t, however, see a birth for Ellen, 30th August and Cornelius Loughlin, baptised 1st September.
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i'm trying to think of why the birth of one child may not be registered when those before and after her were. Unless of course, she was adopted ...
There's a birth registration missing from my grandmother's family c1870. It was child number 5 or 6 and 3rd or 4th daughter. The parents stayed in one place and baptisms of all the children were recorded, including birthdates. My grandmother's forename at birth and baptism wasn't the name she used later.
A family who were friends of my GF's family went to the other extreme and registered one son twice, once by each parent, 3 months apart, with a false date of birth on the second occasion. An elder son was registered with a different first name to the name he'd been given at baptism. Date of birth on a daughter's birth registration was incorrect.
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Hello
Just a thought
I was reading another roots chatter topic enquiring about the name Mary Ann. Some of the suggestion were interesting, for example, MaryAnn could have been called Mary or Ann or the name Mary Jane could have been called Mary or Jane and so on...
Could your Ellen have been a MaryEllen.
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Hello
Just a thought
I was reading another roots chatter topic enquiring about the name Mary Ann. Some of the suggestion were interesting, for example, MaryAnn could have been called Mary or Ann or the name Mary Jane could have been called Mary or Jane and so on...
Could your Ellen have been a MaryEllen.
Unlikley as the only Owen* birth registration in Downpatrick registration district in 1876 is for a male child called Patrick.
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I think it likely that she wasn’t registered for some reason.
As I pointed out the child who was baptised 2 days later seems not to have been registered also.
I have searched for Ellen and Owen* but can’t see her.
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My grandmother was one of ten children.
All nine others were registered at birth - her father was in the R.I.C.
I think her registration was overlooked because her father was relocated ~100 miles three weeks after her birth. I think the task of moving a new baby and six other children under twelve drove the registration out of their minds!!
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Eadaoin,
I thought that sometimes it was the priest who forwarded the details for registration - perhaps wrong there. I just wonder if there is a link to two consecutive baptism entries have missing birth registrations. :-\
I know that dates of baptism/registration can differ widely. My father was such an example, baptised before his ‘birth’. ;)
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I don't think the priest was involved in registration at all.
Though many baptisms in the later 1800s have a birth date included as well as a baptism date.
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Thanks. I thought I had read it but must be mistaken.
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Storm in a teacup. OP has a baptismal record, so what is the problem? A real problem only occurs when no record at all can be found. Which is all too often.
People don't seem to realize just how many births and deaths were not registered! (Or registered many years late).
That said, a marriage I know was registered, because it is in the index, but does not appear - for some unknown reason - on the Irish Genealogy site. So, the index should be checked as well as looking for the actual registration.
As for not finding any record of adoption, well of course not, there are no such records.
Apart from that, the birth was not in "Northern Ireland". There was no such place at the time.