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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: SteveKNS on Monday 05 October 20 18:56 BST (UK)

Title: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: SteveKNS on Monday 05 October 20 18:56 BST (UK)
Henry Powell was baptised on 28th May 1820 at St Mary's, Harrow, Middlesex. His baptism record indicates that his father was not known, but there is a "Barchild" reference that I haven't seen before - does anyone know anything about this? I assume it just means Henry was illegitimate.

The image shows another baptism, for William Tillyard, by way of comparison.
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Pennines on Monday 05 October 20 19:05 BST (UK)
Do you think it may be Baschild - for Bastard Child? I do agree that it looks more like an 'r' - but it's a bit squiggly so may be an 's'.
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: MaureeninNY on Monday 05 October 20 19:05 BST (UK)
I think it's base child.

Maureen

EDIT: Or an abbreviation of bastard child/baseborn child....
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: SteveKNS on Monday 05 October 20 19:13 BST (UK)
Thanks for that - bastard child or baseborn child do seem the most likely. I think I got a bit hung up on the "r"  :)
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Pennines on Monday 05 October 20 19:15 BST (UK)
Or did you just feel like going to the local bar, Steve!
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: SteveKNS on Monday 05 October 20 19:16 BST (UK)
Yes, I think I need a drink after that  :P
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Norfolkman47 on Monday 05 October 20 20:37 BST (UK)
I'm wondering whether Barchild could have been the father's surname, the mother not knowing his given name (if perhaps she had been seduced by her employer). That surname is not unknown.
Alternatively could there be a connection with the heraldic bar sinister which I believe was the indication of illegitimacy.
It would be instructive to look elsewhere in the register to see how other illegitimate births are recorded. You don't usually have to look far to find one!
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: [Ray] on Monday 05 October 20 20:43 BST (UK)
Hi     

Compare the "r" from Henry above it, to the letter in "B___.Child."     

R

Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Rena on Monday 05 October 20 21:11 BST (UK)
Having looked at an enlarged negative image, all I can say is it is unusual to start writing an "a" with a straight downward stroke.

Most of the first syllable is a blodge due to too much ink, but I see:-

B i e r child.

I've tried using a wildcard on familysearch of "B*child" but there's too many pages of results to trawl through - but maybe the name is shown on familysearch as:-  "Berechild" or "Bearchild", or, or, or;
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: SteveKNS on Monday 05 October 20 21:35 BST (UK)
I checked for a dozen pages or so in both directions from Henry Powell's baptism record and the closest I can find to "Barchild" is "base child" - see image. It's in different handwriting, so not very helpful for comparison purposes, unfortunately.

I did find a few other illegitimate births but none were marked as such i.e. the only indicator was the absence of the father's name.
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Mike in Cumbria on Monday 05 October 20 21:50 BST (UK)
It must be a slightly blotched "base child" - there's nothing else that would make any sense there.
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Gadget on Monday 05 October 20 22:20 BST (UK)
I agree with Mike and others. It is base child.
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Viktoria on Monday 05 October 20 22:58 BST (UK)
I'm wondering whether Barchild could have been the father's surname, the mother not knowing his given name (if perhaps she had been seduced by her employer). That surname is not unknown.
Alternatively could there be a connection with the heraldic bar sinister which I believe was the indication of illegitimacy.
It would be instructive to look elsewhere in the register to see how other illegitimate births are recorded. You don't usually have to look far to find one!
I once mentioned the ” bar sinister” denoting illegitimacy , in a reply to a post.
Someone with more knowledge than I,corrected me on that point .
Can’t find the posts now , but it seems I was mistaken.
Just a point, as I said I am not really informed enough but had gone on what used to be the accepted explanation.
Viktoria.
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Mike in Cumbria on Monday 05 October 20 23:08 BST (UK)
I'm wondering whether Barchild could have been the father's surname, the mother not knowing his given name (if perhaps she had been seduced by her employer). That surname is not unknown.
Alternatively could there be a connection with the heraldic bar sinister which I believe was the indication of illegitimacy.
It would be instructive to look elsewhere in the register to see how other illegitimate births are recorded. You don't usually have to look far to find one!
I once mentioned the ” bar sinister” denoting illegitimacy , in a reply to a post.
Someone with more knowledge than I,corrected me on that point .
Can’t find the posts now , but it seems I was mistaken.
Just a point, as I said I am not really informed enough but had gone on what used to be the accepted explanation.
Viktoria.
You weren't entirely mistaken, as you do see "bar sinister" used as a euphemism for illegitimacy, but it doesn't make any sense as a heraldic  term. A bar is a horizontal element, so can't be either sinister or dexter, unlike a "bend".

In this birth record, it would make no sense at all.
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: majm on Monday 05 October 20 23:11 BST (UK)
I agree with Mike and others. It is base child.

Yes,  I agree.  And I recall that on Church of England  parish registers for baptisms that that particular column heading does not allow for details about the parents... Afterall, Parent/s details are for the column/s immediately to the right, so it is not a surname for baby's parent/s.

JM
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Guy Etchells on Tuesday 06 October 20 08:20 BST (UK)
Yes in that register there are a number of base born children with base being spelt in various ways including base, bas., bar.
Perhaps the main clue that ties in all these different abbreviations/spellings is there is no father's name given.

Cheers
Guy
Title: Re: "Barchild" on baptism record - see image
Post by: Viktoria on Tuesday 06 October 20 10:18 BST (UK)
I'm wondering whether Barchild could have been the father's surname, the mother not knowing his given name (if perhaps she had been seduced by her employer). That surname is not unknown.
Alternatively could there be a connection with the heraldic bar sinister which I believe was the indication of illegitimacy.
It would be instructive to look elsewhere in the register to see how other illegitimate births are recorded. You don't usually have to look far to find one!
I once mentioned the ” bar sinister” denoting illegitimacy , in a reply to a post.
Someone with more knowledge than I,corrected me on that point .
Can’t find the posts now , but it seems I was mistaken.
Just a point, as I said I am not really informed enough but had gone on what used to be the accepted explanation.
Viktoria.
You weren't entirely mistaken, as you do see "bar sinister" used as a euphemism for illegitimacy, but it doesn't make any sense as a heraldic  term. A bar is a horizontal element, so can't be either sinister or dexter, unlike a "bend".

In this birth record, it would make no sense at all.
Thanks Mike.
Viktoria.