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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Caernarvonshire => Topic started by: Ben Twr on Friday 04 September 20 03:02 BST (UK)
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Hello, I'm looking for information about my Grandfathers grave in Moel y Gest Cemetery.
His name was John Owens (1888-1936) PUDC grave space #447. Many years ago on a visit to the Grave the headstone was laying on the grave as it was broken. About 5 yrs ago when I visited there was no Grave there only a empty grass area. I also think a few other graves had been removed.
Could this have possibly happened when they demolished the nearby chapel? Anny information or direction would be appreciated.
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Hello
I believe that Moel y Gest is a local authority cemetery.
The local authorities have spent a lot of time in making cemeteries safe; this means that if a gravestone is damaged or leaning they would have put it down on the ground or if they could hold it up using supports they have on occasion done that. I would suspect that if the grave was beyond repair and they were unable to contact the family then the stone would have been removed.
They were apprehensive that if someone got injured by a unsafe gravestone then they would be sued; a sign of the times, I'm afraid.
I do not know if the LA made a record of the removed stones - to be honest I would doubt.
Nesta
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Hi
Inscription on gravestone PUDC 447, Gwynedd Family History Society(GFHS) M 081 No. C478, has following info:
Robert Evans (Seaman) d. Quebec 14/09/1908 age 36:
Elizabeth Evans (His wife) 13 Dora St. Portmadoc d. 19/02/1941 age 66:
John Owen (Her brother) d. 22/06/1936 age 49. (PUDC records: Sailor, 21 Smith St., Portmadoc).
The headstone has broken away from it's base, and is lying on the grave, just off horizontal as the top is resting on the base a few inches above ground level.
Emyr
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Hi, so the grave with the broken Headstone stone is still there. I must have been looking in the wrong place as I did not have the grave space number. Is there a plan or map of M-Y-G Cemetery available
giving grave space numbers etc. Thanks very much for your help.
Ben Twr.
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Hi
The Council will have one of course. The 2 GFHS Monument Inscriptions (MIs) Publications for Moelygest don't have a plan, and their numbering system is different to that of the Council. If you have the publications you need to look at the inscription on a stone and match the name(s) to the index in the publication to work out the numbering system. Best to pick an uncommon name.
Emyr
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Hi, the position I'm in is I am trying to find out if the grave/gravestone is still there.
If not what happened to it. The area I thought it was in was empty. This was 5yrs ago.
So if I contact PUDC (does it exist ?) or the relevant Authority they possibly can give me the answer re
the location of the grave and I could get someone to look for it as I live in Australia. Then if it's not there what happened to it. If the grave has gone there is not much I can do but if the headstone is accessible a photo could be taken. Thanks for you time and patience.
Ben Twr.
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Hi
As I've already said, the stone is where it should be, on the proper grave. The base it slotted into has split, and the stone has been placed nearly flat on the grave, writing side upwards. PUDC became part of Dwyfor Council in 1974, which became part of Gwynedd Council in 1996.
I'll take a photo sometime and give you an exact position. The inscription is in Welsh:
HEDD
ER cof annwyl am
ROBERT EVANS
(Seaman) A fu farw yn Quebec, Medi 14, 1908
Yn 36 ml. oed
Hefyd am ei annwyl briod
ELIZABETH EVANS,.
13 Dora St. Portmadoc
A fu farw Chwefror 19, 1941
Yn 66 ml. oed.
Hefyd am ei brawd
JOHN OWEN
A fu farw Mehefin 22, 1936
Yn 49 ml. oed.
Er mor chwerw ydyw danfon
Ein cyfeillion tua'r bedd,
Peidiwn wylo, ond melys cofio,
Tawel huno maent mewn hedd.
Emyr
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Hi Emyr, much appreciated, funny how the memory plays tricks.
I could have sworn the empty grassy area was where the grave was.
So I was very disappointed not to find it on my last trip to Port.
The grave belongs to my grandfather "Johnny Spanish" as he was known locally
brother of "Dafydd French" two local identities in their day or so I was told.
I have several photos of Dafydd French in Rhuleben POW camp if you are interested.
Thanks for all the help, the photo would be good but in your own time.
Regards, Ben Twr.
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Hi
Link to obituary of Robert Evans:
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3411048/3411055
Emyr
Middle of column 3.
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Hi, will pass this on to the Evans family.
Thanks for your research. Do you have anything on
John Davies a baby died around the 1910's mother and father
William and Louisa Davies in M-Y-G. If this is not inconvenient to you.
Thanks.
Regards.
Ben Twr.
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Hi
Somehow missed this posting until today !
John born 1904, died 1905.
His brother, William, 1910-1919, drowned in Llyn Bach.
Will call in cemetery this afternoon to check the inscription in M081.
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Hi Emyr, when you go if you want you can see the grave of the old
grandfather John Owens he gets a mention in the Gestiana.
He's straight up the middle path to the junction next to the tree.
wall side of the path.
Diolch yn fawr.
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Hi
Located William/John etc's grave - checked inscription.
Re. Old Granfather John Owens - can you give more info, burial date, others buried in same grave etc.
In what context is he mentioned in Gestiana ?
Emyr
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Emyr, I sent you a PM don't know if you got it, bit new to all this.
BT.
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Hi
Received your PM. Will contact you tonight or tomorrow.
I've got a second edition of Gestiana , in the original language Welsh. An English translation was published a few years ago. I'd found the bit about John Owen, and the death date in it is 1872 when it should read 1882 - Moelygest Cemetery came into use 1879.
I've located the entry in the GFHS MIs publication.
Found his Mariner records in 'Welsh Mariners Database' and in 'UK and Ireland, Masters and Mates Certificates, 1850-1927'.
Going to porthmadog shortly, will call at the cemetery on my way.
Emyr
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In memory of John Owen, Rigger, Portmadoc
Who died Feb 8, 1882 aged 77 years
Under Napier's flag he fought,
And to this port at last was brought,
Woun'd but anchored safe on shore,
From swords, and pikes, and cannon's roar,
And chance, and change of sailor's life,
Want, and plenty, rest and strife,
And all the perils of the deep,
He lieth well in silent sleep,
His spirits fled when sails were furled,
For pension in a peaceful world.
Also Jane, beloved wife of the above
Who died August 5th, 1893 aged 85 years.
A newspaper report on John Owen's life can be found at
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3536566/3536574/94/
(first column - last article in Gogledd Cymru)
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Dioloch yn fawr ynglyn carreg fedd John Owens.