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General => Armed Forces => World War Two => Topic started by: anne P on Wednesday 06 May 20 20:15 BST (UK)
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Please can someone tell me about the badge on my father's (back row, far left) right shoulder? He was Pioneer Corps and as far as I know landed on Gold Beach on D+3.
Thank you - Anne
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If it is a red cross it signifies First Army, if it is a blue cross it signifies Second Army. There is something under the shield on his arm which is not there on the others but what it is I am sorry I do to know. MaxD might be your best bet.
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On the shoulder are the two "pips" of a Lieutenant.
MaxD
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The 'something' that Crumblie refers to is the arm of service patch. Go to Wikipedia's entry for 'Brigade insignia of the British Army'. To the right of the 'World War II' entry you will see a chart with these on. You can see the man on the right rear has a similar patch.
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Also, if you go to Wikipedia's page for 'Higher formation insignia of the British Army, then scroll down to 'Second World War' and then 'Army' you will see the two almost-similar badges of the 'First Army' and 'Second Army'. I would say your father is wearing the latter - going by the position of the horizontal arm of the cross being higher than that of the 'First Army' which is centred. Also the sword is from 'top to bottom' whereas the First Army's is shorter.
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Thank you very much Crumblie, Max D and SiGr. That is really helpful - I'll definitely look at the Wikipedia page. I've worked out quite a bit from his war record and Pioneer war diaries but there is a gap in the information and I don't have confirmation as to which Normandy beach he actually landed on. He was separated from the rest of his Company having been ordered to accompany the unit transport from the Royal Docks, London. I'm fairly sure he told me King sector, Gold Beach which is where the main part of his Coy is recorded as landing. Is it likely that he + transport would have come ashore in a separate place from the rest of the Company, or is it impossible to know?
Anne
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I would have pointed you to the war diaries but as you have already seen them then I'd suggest there is nowhere else to look for the sort of detail you are after. I suggest it would be fair to assume that the transport would have been programmed to land at the same beach/sector to marry up with the earlier parties and would have done so unless there was some sort of problem.
Is there anything just after the landings that suggest problems with the transport?
MaxD
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Thank you for your reply MaxD. Dad's Statement of Services merely state - 6th Jun 44 embarked UK. The next entry refers to his transfer to the BAOR. 14 Coy War Diary refers to the main unit sailing from Newhaven on the 8th of June in R35 and R36. I don't know what these refer to - ships perhaps? Diary then says that the vehicles embarked R Albert Docks on S.M J or T?/51, also on the 8th. I believe it was an American Liberty ship? Main unit arrived Gold Beach 12.30 hrs on the 9th and was moved to a petrol depot at Sommerieu on the 10th. Diary then notes that on the 12th Lt Waterhouse plus vehicles arrived Coy safely. Dad himself told me way back that they had difficulty getting the lorries up the sandy beach and that they eventually found the others waiting in a field. I was puzzled by the delay until the 12th as Dad always said he was there on D+3. I guess you are right in that they had a problem with the transport, congestion on the beach and perhaps with their map reading!