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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Caernarvonshire => Topic started by: Owenthomas on Sunday 05 April 20 19:46 BST (UK)
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I hope this is the correct county page to post this on. I am getting back into genealogy (recently retired) and searching for information on Evan Jones and Elizabeth Parry. Evan was a seaman and born 1831-1834 in Tydweiliog (hopefully correct spelling). He died in 1913. Elizabeth was born 1834-1836 at Gremp in Bryncroes. She died on October 24, 1889. Any help to go further back would be much appreciated.
Thank You !
Owen Thomas
Colorado
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I started with the 1881 census and look for Elizabeth as she was born in Bryncroes which was in Caernarvonshire. Think this is her in the 1841 census aged 6 living at Penybont with Ann (head), 40; Elinor 15; Elizabeth 10. If Evan was a seaman he may not show up on census if he was at sea.
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Hi
Very busy at the moment - something of help for anybody else who has some free time is the following info:
The Welsh patronymic 'surname' system complicates things in this case. Evan Jones is the son of Thomas Jones and his name in the Parish Marriage Register is given as Evan Thomas. Similarily Elizabeth Parry, daughter of Thomas Parry, appears as Elizabeth Thomas.
January 22nd 1856 at the Parish Church of Tydweiliog/Tudweiliog :
Evan Thomas Full Age Bachelor Sailor Residence: Rhôs y llan Father: Thomas Jones - Labourer.
Elizabeth Thomas Full Age Spinster - Tyddyn-difyr Father: Thomas Parry - Sailor.
By Banns Evan signed mark of Elizabeth Witnesses Richard Davies/Ann Parry (mark)
Can be viewed on Find My Past.
Emyr
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Hi
There's a problem with the 1861 Census for this area on Ancestry. The Transcript and Image have gone out of sequence. The Transcript is correct but wrong image.
The family, surname Thomas are at National School House, Llangwnadl(e), Caernarvonshire. Evan 27 Mariner born Tudweiliog RG09/4333/21/4 Find my Past.
Emyr
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Hi
Suggestion as to marriages of parents of Evan & Elizabeth:
Evan - 26/07/1831 Thomas Jones, Tudweiliog TO Catherine Jones, Penllech.
Elizabeth - Thomas Parry, Rhiw TO Anne Owen, Penllech.
Emyr
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I hope i can restart this thread, since i have additional information. I can start another thread, if that would be better. I now have the marriage certificate if William Jones. He was married to Anne Thomas on July 6, 1832 at Tudweliog. I have not been able to find a birth nor death certificate for ether of them. I have looked through many 1841 & 1851 census, but have not been able to find them either.
I also have the birth certificate of their son Evan, which clearly shows Thomas and Anne as parents. Evan was born April 8, 1833 and baptized June 5, 1833 at Brynrodyn Chapel, Carnarvonshire.
Any additional information on this family would be much appreciated.
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I can see that bapt on FreeREG
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ELIZABETH Jones bapt 25 Oct 1835/born 01 Oct 1835
Entries have Fathers place Tydweiliog
So could this be them in 1841 Census living there?
Jone Jones 60
Thomas Jones 30 Labourer
Ann Jones 30
Evan Jones 8***
Elizabeth Jones 5***
John Jones 2
Richard Thomas 2 Weeks
There are a couple of 1839 Birth Reg GRO for a John Jones Pwllheli mmn THOMAS
Such a hard name to research and I may be way off here?
EDIT same Family in 1851;
Jane Williams 71 Head Widow
Thomas Jones 43 Son
Anne Jones 42 Daug in Law
John Jones 12
Jane Jones 6
Janet Jones 4
JONES, JANE mmn THOMAS
GRO Reference: 1845 D Quarter in PWLLHELI UNION Volume 27 Page 344
JONES, JANNET mmn THOMAS
GRO Reference: 1847 M Quarter in PWLLHELI UNION Volume 27 Page 377
I'm hopeful it is right :)
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There was ann Evan Jones baptised at CALVINISTIC METHODIST, TYDWEILIOG, on 5th June 1833, son of Thomas and Ann, which ties in with the censuses mentioned by Trish.
Also Elizabeth on 25th October 1835
The 1841 census has his probable mother as Jane Jones, presumably the Jane Williams in 1851.
David
P.S. Sorry, I see you have some of the above already.
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I am a little confused now. Trish said that Elizabeth Jones was baptized on 25 Oct 1835/born 01 Oct 1835. But I show Evans wife’s maiden name was Elizabeth Parry. She was baptized on October 2, 1831. Her father was William Parry and mother Anne Owen.
I think you are correct about the 1841 Census of Evans Family. He would have been 8 at that point, being born April 8, 1833. I think the Elizabeth in this census entry is Evans sister, not his wife. Is the person you have named Jone Jones actually Jane Jones? Census says she is female. I have not seen the name Jone in the past. Could that be Thomas Jones mother? Was it common to have your parent live in same house? I assume she is at the top because she is the oldest.
I am not aware of the house Ty Forgan showing on the 1841 census. Is there some where to identify where that was located? We went to Llyn peninsula last year and went to some of the ancestors homes, but was not aware of this one at that time.
Also a couple questions on the 1851 census. That seems like the logical family. Is the Jane Williams a different person than the 1841 census, or could it be the Williams was her maiden name of Jane (or Jone) Jones in the 1841 census? Also I assume we don’t see Evan because he was 18yo and probably not living there. Exciting that there are some additional children (so new relatives!). I could not find that census though. Can you direct me where to look?
Thank you both so much for the time you took to look into this. Hopefully over time, i will learn all the places to look and ways to research.
Owen thomas
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the marriage given by EmyrBorth in reply no. 2 shows Elizabeth's father as Thomas Parry and Evan's as Thomas Jones
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01scv/ - map of Tydweiliog
to help others searching
1911 census
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X7VF-36P
1901 census
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9BW-CLN
1871 at sea
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VBJQ-Q95
1861
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M726-XT6
baptism for Elizabeth - daughter of Thomas Parry & his wife Anne
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FMM8-HVF
1871 census - Laura Roberts is aunt to Elizabeth
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:V51N-BNR
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1841 census for Elizabeth referred to by WelshGen in reply no. 1. Address is Penybont
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7QT-5DB
1891 for Evan at Gremp
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:4PPD-LMM
son Henry is next door with aunt Ann Parry, Elizabeth's sister
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:4PPD-Z6Z
Elizabeth's mother Ann Owen was of Penllech at marriage in 1825, husband Thomas Parry of Rhiw.
Laura Roberts, aunt to Elizabeth, has place of birth of Penllech so probably her mother's sister. Possible marriage 21 Feb 1834 in Denio of William Roberts of Denio & Lowry Owen of Penllech, witnesses Hugh Roberts & Evan Evans Pwllheli.
1851 census for Laura, husband William a mariner.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGVL-X4L
1841
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7QT-LXF
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possible baptisms in Penllech in patronymic form
10 April 1807 Lowry daughter of Owen Griffith & Elinor
14 May 1797 Ann daughter of Owen Griffith & Elinor his wife. Owen noted as yeoman of Congl y Cae
Also 23 Sept 1810 Hugh
map of Congl y Cae
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01scw/
Looks like it's now a holiday cottage
https://www.menaiholidays.co.uk/cottage/North-Wales-Snowdonia-Pwllheli/Congl-Cae-1090727.html
Don't know if you have these baptisms to Evan & Elizabeth in Llangwnadl
4 May 1859 Thomas son of Evan Thomas sailor & Elizabeth of Penybont
23 May 1859 Ann daughter of Evan Thomas sailor & Elizabeth of Penybont
20 April 1861 Henry son of Evan Thomas mariner & Elizabeth Schoolhouse.
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This map has the location of Ty Forgan/Morgan: https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by-side/#zoom=17.1&lat=52.90717&lon=-4.62014&layers=168&right=ESRIWorld
I can't see it on any map but some nearby houses on the census are Ty'n-y-weirglodd, Ty Newydd and Ty'nylon.
Tyn y Ffynon is not shown on the map, but it is still there, opposite Ty'n-rhos.
I think Ty Morgan may be the house opposite the entrance to Ty Newydd and is now Rhos y Grug.
There is a reference to Ty Morgan about a tenancy agreement in 1868: https://diogel.gwynedd.llyw.cymru/DATRhagorol/RhestrEitem.aspx?iaith=cy&rhif_archif=12&rhif_rhiant=103001&rhif_tudalen=3
He was there in 1881, born 1808 in Tydweiliog, shown as Jane Williams son in 1851: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2WS-F2GL
In 1861 he was at Penycha Rhos, Tydweiliog: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M72F-W2B
David
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The bapt 1835 I quotes was for Elizabeth Jones, sister of Evan Jones.
Its late here and will have to look over all of this again as I may be mistaken.
osprey looks to have a lot of info there for you :)
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will of Owen Griffith, Congl y Cae, mentions sons John Owen & Griffith Owen, daughters Anne & Lowry, wife Elinor, sons Thomas & Hugh, & daughter Jane. Will written 7 Feb 1830 & proved 9 March 1830
https://viewer.library.wales/814887#?xywh=2%2C682%2C2625%2C2204&cv=
executors names as Ellin Griffith, Thomas Griffith, Hugh Griffith & Jane Griffith
Burial Penllech
11 Feb 1830 Owen Jones 69 Congl y Cae (his father Griffith Jones?)
Then will of Ellin Griffith written 9 March 1830 names sons John & Griffith, daughter Anne & daughter Lowry is executor.
https://viewer.library.wales/572640#?xywh=653%2C753%2C1519%2C1275&cv=
Burial Penllech 19 March 1830 Elleanor Lloyd 59 Congl y Cae (next entry after Owen's)
1841 census has Thomas Owen at Congl y Cae - or near attempt at name on census return
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7QT-PG5
parish marriage Penllech 26 Sept 1833 Thomas Owen Congl y Cae & Margaret Parry, both otp.
By 1851 Margaret is a widow, still at Congl y Cae
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGV2-4JN
Burial Penllech 5 Dec 1847 Thomas Owen 55 Congl y Cae
Baptism of Owen & Elinor's eldest(?) son Griffith 9 May 1790 Penllech
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Thank you all so much for the information provided. I was able to ascertain some missing links and now know new places to look for data.
Owen