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Some Special Interests => Travelling People => Topic started by: AVK on Monday 06 January 20 18:43 GMT (UK)
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Anyone no any info on the Woodward family from Nottingham also a keziah plumb who I thinks father was Everett plumb
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Welcome to Rootschat
Can you give some idea of what timescale is involved (ie) birthyears for the Plumb's
Who are "the Woodward family" without some christian names and birthyears it's impossible to start
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Keziah Plumb can be found on the 1871 census aged 9mths born Ibstock Leicestershire. Parents Everitt & Keziah
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VBXH-XFP
census info is free at www.familysearch.org
Bmd info is free at www.freebmd.org.uk - you will find she married Thomas Clover in Suffolk in 1885
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Keziah senior is Keziah Booth and described as a boarder.
The children seem to be in 2 groups, all said to be children of Everett. I wonder if Keziah is the mother of any of them. ??? Travellers sometimes have interesting relationships.
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Also listed on 1881
Louisa Maud
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rhank you so much for the reply looking for a keziah plumb born 1870 in bagworth Leicestershire her mum was kezia booth born in Eaton and her dad was everett plumb problem is keziah had children with a John Woodward don’t no if they were married carnt find a marriage record John Woodward has a brother called Tom they were from Nottingham and johns birth year was roughly 1870 that’s all I no
Can you give some idea of what timescale is involved (ie) birthyears for the Plumb's
Who are "the Woodward family" without some christian names and birthyears it's impossible to start
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thanks for the reply I’m not sure kesiah and Everett plumb got married it was quite normal for the children to all be given the fathers surname and also I no that kesiah in later years used the name as booth but just carnt seem to find a link on her children with John Woodward I no there was a daughter called Florence woodward born 1895 Leicestershire and died in 1918 and there was a daughter called Selina Woodward and a son call Everett but just carnt link them together thanks for reply’s
The children seem to be in 2 groups, all said to be children of Everett. I wonder if Keziah is the mother of any of them. ??? Travellers sometimes have interesting relationships.
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In 1871 the children are
James 5yrs
Henry 3 yrs
Keziah 9mths
and
Everett 7 yrs
Angelina 11yrs
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think that is senior keziah booths children so I’m looking for the keziah who was 9 months in 1871 she had children with John Woodward as follows Florence woodward 1895 Selina Woodward Everett Woodward around 1905 he was the youngest she also had a keziah Woodward a betsey Woodward a Fredrick Woodward a John Woodward and a Thomas woodward
In 1871 the children are
James 5yrs
Henry 3 yrs
Keziah 9mths
and
Everett 7 yrs
Angelina 11yrs
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On the census relationships are those to the head of the household, so the children are Everett's. They all have the surname Plumb.
Without finding baptisms or birth entries for the children we can't be sure who their mother was.
Their births should have been registered but may not have.
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HI,
I have a tree on this Woodward Branch, I work on it as a side line due to my 3rd great grandmother being a Woodward, what information you looking for ? This branch also has a small tree in the Elliot Blood line book.
This Woodward tree is my 2nd Woodward tree I have, which has a Smith/Woodward marry my 4th great aunt, my 3rd great grand mothers tree as of yet is unlinked to the other... One day hope to connect them.
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There is a large Smith family in a neighbouring caravan to the Plumbs in the 1871 census.
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There is a large Smith family in a neighbouring caravan to the Plumbs in the 1871 census.
Here Is Wilsher, Smith, Woodward at a fair ground, I keep meaning one day to trace the Woodward on it... I do Believe that Florence Ann Woodward age 15, is the child of John Woodward and Keziah Plumb too. The age would match and giving the family connection it would make sense.
1911 Chesterfield
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HI, would you be Albee to email me what information you have on them please as I carnt seem to find anything or connect it not sure how to private inbox you tho
I have a tree on this Woodward Branch, I work on it as a side line due to my 3rd great grandmother being a Woodward, what information you looking for ? This branch also has a small tree in the Elliot Blood line book.
This Woodward tree is my 2nd Woodward tree I have, which has a Smith/Woodward marry my 4th great aunt, my 3rd great grand mothers tree as of yet is unlinked to the other... One day hope to connect them.
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There is a large Smith family in a neighbouring caravan to the Plumbs in the 1871 census.
Here Is Wilsher, Smith, Woodward at a fair ground, I keep meaning one day to trace the Woodward on it... I do Believe that Florence Ann Woodward age 15, is the child of John Woodward and Keziah Plumb too. The age would match and giving the family connection it would make sense.
1911 Chesterfield
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Hi
i have found vast amounts over several yeares regarding the Booths Plumbs Woodwards and more great names, i hope in a later time to share these story's, when you combine oral history with the census records then the Newspaper Archives plus information contained in books you may come to understand the bigger picture, you also have to read about the history of the times you reseach in, plus the local landscape as in how was say Mansfield as a town back in the days of 1876, get a feel for the local culture, get a feel for the national culture of these times to, then with the records from the Archives and oral history you will start to truly understand who is who
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Hi
mail kiziah who posts on here, Kiziah knows all about the Booths, below is a record about how they used both names, i use the records i find to look deeper, when you find a story with a name on that you are searching for read of the other names of people in the storys and research them, this then brings more relatives that you never new of, plus research names of towns or villiages in the storys, names of a public house or a farmer, research this way and you will find more, plus do not be lazy and search on the internet sites where it says a refined search giving you only the names you are looking for, do it the hard way and look through thousands of records, in the refined search it will miss out plenty of times words transcribed wrong and just the computer miss reading a record, i have found many records that no one will find, you have to look the wrong way and beat the computer, lots of records have been mispelt so if you look for the true way you will not find the things that you may be looking for
Saturday 09 July 1887
Nottinghamshire Guardian
Nottinghamshire
RETFORD AND NEWARK QUARTER.SESSIONS
CHARGE OF STEALING A MARE. Everett Booth, alias Plumb, 24, hawker, was indicted for stealing a bay mare, the property of Robert Watling, at East Stoke, on May 4th. Mr. Joseph Smith appeared for the prosecution, — The jury ultimately found a verdict of Not Guilty,'' and the prisoner was discharged.
this one below is to show you how when you find a record do not think you have all the information, you must look at many records of the same account, offten there will be several vertions of the same story, you may find many clues by reading all the accounts, look how there is a Spencer Smith, he may be related to the Spencer Smith who his a relative of the Woodwards in the post above
Saturday 22 May 1869
Nottingham Journal
Nottinghamshire
BINGHAM PETTY SESSIONS. Thursday.— A Gipsy Trouble .— Thomas Elliott, a member of the gipsy tribe, was charged with using a dog for the purpose of taking game—P.c. Booth was on duty in Cotgrave on the I3th, when he saw a van and two carts coming down the Fosse-road; defendant was with the van, and when be came to a field in the occnpation of Mr. Hoard he pulled up, took out his dog from the vehicle, and put it into a field of wheat, and it went on until it came to a grass field, in which it killed the hare.— Mr. Belk, for the defence, cross-examined the policeman, but elicited nothing fresh, when the magistrates fined the gipsy £2 and costs, 10s- 8d. A Gipsy Assaulting a Policeman. —Thomas Elliott, the defendant in the last case, was charged with assaulting p.c. Booth.—The policemen stated he went up to the van and stopped the horse, upon which the defendant got him by the neck. —Mr. Belk endeavoured to prove how unsafe it was to believe the evidence of one policeman, and that he had no right to have stopped the defendant’s horse.—The bench, however, thought otherwise, and fined the defendant £l, including costs. Two More Gipsies in Search of Game. —Everett Plumb and Spencer Smith were charged by Mr. Burdott, keeper to the Earl with going into a field with three dogs in pursuit of game.—P.c. Harrimen was on duty on the 18th, and he saw a dog In a field at Cotgrave, which he said defendants put in.— Mr. Belk. however, in cross examination of the policeman showed that it was not proved it was defendants who sent the dog into the field.—Case dismissed. . A Gipsy Charged with Assaulting a Man.— John Smith, another member of the travelling tribe, was charged with assaulting Thos. Winfield, at Owthorpe, on the 13th.—Smith, who is horse dealer, had put some horses in the lane. —Mr. Belk said it was a case for the county court, if defendant had done any damage in the lane, and that complainant should not have tried to keep the defendant’s horses there against his will—Case dismissed
Friday 28 May 1869
Nottinghamshire Guardian
Nottinghamshire
— Thomas Elliott was charged with using a dog to kill game, and also with assaulting the police.— Mr. Belk, solicitor, appeared for the accused.— lt appeared that between five and six o'clock on the morning of the 13th inst., a considerable number of the gipsy tribe were wending their way in vans and other vehicles, accompanied by a drove of horses, down the old Foss Road, between Cotgrave and Kinoulton, and the accused set a dog on a hare, near to Mr. Hoard's field, which killed the hare, and he deposited it in one of the vehicles and drove off at a rapid pace. The policeman went in pursuit and he was struck with a whip and threatened.— The Bench inflicted a penalty of £2 and costs on the first count, and fined the offender £1 and costs for the assault on the policeman. The amount was paid.— Everett Plumb, Spencer Smith, and others were charged with a similar offence. They were all of the same tribe. In consequence, however, of the information being informal, the charges were withdrawn. — William Grey, another gipsy, was charged with using a gun and killing a hare on land in the occupation of Mr. Hoard, farmer, of Cotgrave Wolds. —Mr. Belk appeared for the accused, and asked for an adjournment in order to pro- cure the evidence of an important witness, which the Bench acquiesced
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I just put these on for you to show you how they mix their names up, look through all the clues, in these few posts above and below there are many clues, in the story above about Bingham and Cotgrave i have also found the Woodwards Smiths Bacons Elliotts Booths and more all connected through locations and names, if you use the story's to find clues then use the census reports and also ask for help you will find what many may never find, Sky told you of the fair at Brampton, i will show you in another post more information, i have a great many records about the Woodwards, hopefully one day i will be able to show you more, everyone is mixed up in many ways and related, there will be strong Gipsy connections and some not so strong
Thursday 05 January 1888
Sheffield Independent
Yorkshire
SAVAGE Assault by a Gipsy.—At Gainsbro yesterday a gipsy, named Wm. Smith, alias Booth, was charged with having assaulted Bernard Crossby, a gipsy from Lancashire. Last October these men had a desperate fight Crossby, the complainant, having expressed his desire to thrash all the Lincolnshire gipsies. He got the worst of the encounter, and was knocked down and savagely kicked by the gipsy in custody. It was found that Crossby had been seriously injured, his collar bone being broken and the bridge of his nose smashed. He was lying in pool of blood and was rendered unconscious by the injuries received, he was requiring medical attendance for some time. Prisoner had evaded the attentions of the police and escaped from custody once.—The Bench thought that Smith had been greatly provoked, and he would only be sentenced to seven days’ imprisonment with hard labour
Tuesday 13 November 1883
Lincolnshire Chronicle
Lincolnshire
DREADFUL GIPSY FIGHT AT HAXEY. _ AT the Lincoln and Notts Assizes, held at Nottingham, before Mr. Justice Cave, on Friday. Wm. Booth, alias William Smith, 21, gipsy, was indicted for having unlawfully and maliciously wounded Riley Smith with a knife with ..........
Saturday 14 March 1903
Derbyshire Times and Chesterfield Herald
Derbyshire
THE WEEK'S POLICE.
TROUBLESOME GIPSIES. FAIL TO APPEAR AT BAKEWELL. Several gipsies who the police complain of having caused a lot of trouble to the people of Beeley failed to put in an appearance in response to various summonses at Bakewell Petty Sessions Friday last. Wm. Smith, alias Booth, of no fixed abode, was summoned for using a waggon without having the name of the owner painted thereon at Beeley on Feb. 21st. He was also summoned for allowing two horses to stray at the same time and place, and further with unlawfully encamping on the highway at the same time and place Mackenzie Holland, travelling gipsy, was also sumoned for encamping on the highway at Beeley, and for allowing a mare to stray on the highway at Beeley. Supt. Savory said these people were gipsies and set everybody at defiance; he applied for a warrant for their arrest
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This is the place that Sky wrote of for you, many Woodwards are over this way i think i found Kiziah
there a while back i will try and find the record again
The Rodney Yard Brampton near Chesterfield is one of the old stopping Grounds where lots of my Mothers Relatives passed through over many years of travel, it as long since gone but by using the maps online it is easily found, Rodney Yard the Peoples and their Story's must be remembered and preserved for the future Generations, i never new of this place nor did I ever hear my Mother say She new, then one day I found it, I to have found many interesting story's of the history and the Peoples that connect in many ways to Brampton
at the Bold Rodney Public House, there is a Great Yard at the back of this Pub, this became a place that Gipsies who like the Wiltshire's who roamed over several Counties temporally used as a place to keep their Caravans, this yard in time became to, a sort of a settled community to all types of Hawkers and People, some of the times are of great sadness, others, well Gipsies I have found somehow possess in their life the Greatest of humour,
this place is rich in history, you can find the People I write about well back into the 1800s, and forwards to the 1920s, there to are many Big Names and story's of People like the Lees and Smiths who stopped there, I found true story's to of the Woodward's and Wiltshire's, there is much to learn from the story of Brampton, I was told the new building on the site of the old yard were erected in the 1990s
I found and have spoken to People who lived and grew up around this place and through my research on the internet and oral history of this time in researching I have found there were several things that all came together to make Brampton the hub for the Gipsies over hundreds of years,
this in what I am telling you is just an outline
in the fields around Brampton there is a very special clay that was dug from the earth to make pots, mugs bowls and the like, it was renowned for its looks as the unique Chesterfield Earthenware, also there was an abundance of local coal that was next to the clay fields, they the People of Chesterfield then made many many places to make pots, also there were natural waterways that ran through this place that provided the water needed in the process of manufacture of the pots than intern were fired in the kilns, it was a special place where everything in nature came together to create this hub, a place Gipsies found and exploited, I have found much information about the history of clay, coal , waterways and all the peoples, the Gipsies were one of those Peoples, I do know some of you on rootschat have spoken of not all pot dealers are Gipsies, I to have found your research to be true
I remember how the Great Men I found in the 1700s the Herons and the Boswells, and how the Boswell Man said of Himself He was a Man who went about the Country selling mugs, I have researched and read much up of the history of Scotland over hundreds of years, through this research long ago Gipsies became known as Muggers for being People who sell pots and mugs, then down through the years it became a bad name to be called a Mugger, but really the very old Gipsies were the Muggers for it was them who sold the mugs and pots, I have read Great information about the times that supports this from long ago, it was none Gipsies who called the Old Gipsies muggers, then years later mugger became a rallying cry for others to say you dirty muggers are not real Gipsies, I think through my research people alive now have been influenced by the wrong teachings of others, this is my view through reading the old accounts of the greatest of minds and writers, unknown to many and who's words of history are hidden in dusty papers and silenced, so Brampton its story's and history, may be used as an example, these storys will be replicated around Britain, you will find your People, you will find their history, many many Horses and trades were needed in the history of Brampton, I have found so much, but I will leave it for you, I respect all the Gipsies who passed through that place, I also hope this is just the start for the true story of their life to be told in an honest way, I am just summarising the many thousands of words I was going to write, there is so much more
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjTwv3u9rzSAhUiJcAKHaIFCMEQFggoMAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mernick.org.uk%2FBrownJugs%2FBrampton%2FBrampton.htm&usg=AFQjCNGiZeMxMJ36YsM0a8Iejut9bipcRQ
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjV3vCb8bzSAhUsKsAKHXddBlcQFgghMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.picturethepast.org.uk%2Ffrontend.php%3Fkeywords%3DRef_No_increment%3BEQUALS%3BDCCC001305%26pos%3D2%26action%3Dzoom&usg=AFQjCNEZCC6LSpc_KlHw8I6Tk2osDYAazA