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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cornwall => Topic started by: amandas123 on Thursday 28 November 19 15:13 GMT (UK)
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I am searching for the ancestral line of Charles Hawkey born about 1821 probably in Liverpool but I am wondering whether his father, named James in his marriage record, came from the Cornwall Hawkeys?
Charles married Ann Waterhouse in 1838 in Liverpool. They had two boys: John in 1840 and Charles in 1841 both in Liverpool.
I think (though not sure) that this particular family fell apart after the death of head of the household, Charles sr who might have been the death recorded in Liverpool of 1843 (under Haukey). I find the boys in the 1851 census attending an Industrial Poor School in Liverpool both under the name Hanley and with odd ages (probably guessed at) and both separated from each other. No trace of their mother, Ann but I think she might be an emmigrant to US in 1845, without the boys, obviously.
Later the younger boy, Charles, appears in the 1881 census as a servant in Glass House Farm, Wolstanton, Staffs.
I have dismissed a census from 1861 with a widowed fishmonger Ann because of the presence of another very young Charles (7 yo). Surely she would not have given the same name to another child?
Anyway - any help tracing this family to its roots would be very happily received.
Best wishes
Amanda Stone-Williams
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I think (though not sure) that this particular family fell apart after the death of head of the household, Charles sr who might have been the death recorded in Liverpool of 1843 (under Haukey).
The GRO index has the 1843 death as
HANKEY, CHARLES AGE 2
1843 June Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 20 Page 295
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ah ok - so this death is a child. That is helpful. Thank you loads.
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Hawkey or Hankey?
Marriage of Charles (indexed as Hankey) and Ann at Liverpool St Philip, 13.7.1838
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSJ9-XYWS?i=407&cat=673916
1841 census LIverpool image
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QSQ-G9GF-YQML?i=268&cat=510508
Baptism of Charles,11.1.1841 (poor image!)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-D154-MM?i=628&cat=122430
On the BT Charles is very bottom of left hand page, looks like Hankey
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6RSD-2C?i=384&cat=559776
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Double baptism at St Philip, 16 Feb 1846
John, born 7(?) April 1842
Ann Jane, born 31 January 1846
Father Charles a Porter
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-65G2-QC?i=869&cat=122430
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John,
Can you decipher what his father James occupation is on the marriage I can't make sense of it.
Rosie
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Yes those two births are contenders now the 1843 death has been ruled out. BUT they are the family that appear in the census of 1861 which have the very young Charles.
I have a photo of the marriage of Anne W and Charles and it looks like Hawkey to me but I can see this is a tricky one to transcribe.
The 1841 census you posted is the one I am taking to be the correct one. With Charles at 5 months old.
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The occupation of his father, James is a Warehouseman.
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I think James' occupation might be warehouseman?
But I haven't caught up with 1861 yet.
A death in same quarter as Charles
HANKEY, JAMES
Age at Death (in years): 3
GRO Reference: 1843 J Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 20 Page 285
Is it James, 1, in that 1841 image?
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Thank you for the occupation.
1841 has James age 1 and Charles 5 months
The address on those 1846 baptisms is Circus Street.
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I couldn't make that address out, so didn't mention it!
1861 has Charles born in Wrexham
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7RH-TTD
Daughter Elizabeth died in 1863 and there is a notice in the Liverpool Mercury, 28 March 1863
Birth of Grace?
HANKEY, GRACE
Mother's Maiden Surname: WATERHOUSE
GRO Reference: 1852 M Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 227
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Do you think that this record here might be the same Charles? Sorry I can't find the image in Family Search! There is also a John Hanley at the same institution on a different page.
Charles Hanley
Age
13
Estimated Birth Year
abt 1838
Relation
Scholar
Gender
Male
Where born
Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Civil parish
Walton on the Hill
Town
Kirkdale
County/Island
Lancashire
Country
England
Registration district
West Derby
Sub-registration district
Everton
ED, institution, or vessel
Industrial Schools belonging to the Parish of Liverpool
Household schedule number
1
Piece
2190
Folio
569
Page number
16
Household Members
13021631
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1871
RG10 /3839 f103 p55
Charles Hankey 53 bn Wrexham, Denbighshire
Ann 53
John 28
Ann J 25
Grace 19
Charles 17
Maria 13
rest of family bn Liverpool
ADDED
HANKEY, CHARLES mmn WATERHOUSE
1854 March Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 211
I think that 2 year old Charles that died in 1843 was probably the one on the 1841 census
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And here is the Charles Hawkey in the 1881 census in Wolstanton, Chesterton. Cripes can't attach ok so here are the reference numbers:
Registration district
Wolstanton
ED, institution, or vessel
8
Piece
2705
Folio
92
Page number
14
Household Members
19018771
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Sorry, I had just added this to my other post
HANKEY, CHARLES mmn WATERHOUSE
1854 March Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 211
I think that 2 year old Charles that died in 1843 was possibly the one on the 1841 census
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"I think that 2 year old Charles that died in 1843 was probably the one on the 1841 census"
OK - so that means I need to look for another birth. He says in the 1881 census that he was born in 1838.
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Rosie, you have it. Two sons called Charles born about 10 years apart.
So Charles Hanley and John in 1851 are from another family altogether (or families).
Charles and Ann Hankey appear on FamilySearch as Markey in 1851
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGYG-QZN
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At least we have birth registrations with mothers maiden surname Waterhouse to confirm that the 1851 onwards are all the same family.
Amanda who is your direct line
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"Rosie, you have it. Two sons called Charles born about 10 years apart.
So Charles Hanley and John in 1851 are from another family altogether (or families).
Charles and Ann Hankey appear on FamilySearch as Markey in 1851"
Yes that makes sense now.
So - I think I can tentatively say the two boys in the 1851 census in the workhouse school match the Charles in 1881 census. The other families are not likely connected.
the 1881 census is the key one for me because it shows the presence of a man I believe to be the father of my husband's illegitimate great grandpa living in close proximity to the mother.
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"At least we have birth registrations with mothers maiden surname Waterhouse to confirm that the 1851 onwards are all the same family.
Amanda who is your direct line"
So it is difficult to say the line because my husband's great grandpa was illegitimate. His name was also Charles and stuck out like a sore thumb from all other family names before and since. The 1881 census in Wolstanton shows his mother as a servant and Charles Hawkey/Hankey is living in a neighbouring farm. I believe (tentatively) that he is the father. I would love to have at least some inkling of where his line came from.
I think I have found a connecting line of descendants but their lines are from Cornwall - no surprise as this name seems to be a Cornish name.
I am waiting to see if one of them has taken a dna test to check for matches.
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Many thanks for you help - very much appreciated.
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What happens to 'your' Charles after 1881
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I have no idea. The couple didn't marry. She married another man - the widower of her dead sister and they moved with illegitimate Charles to Barnsley in Yorkshire.
I do see a death in Wolstanton in 1884 (I think that's the date) but I think that might belong to the other Charles Hawkey who was born and raised in Wolstanton. (That added to the confusion!)
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I have to keep remembering to ignore certian people and families.
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Anyway to sum up I think (I will review again tomorrow with a fresh brain) that the only two records that relate to my Charles Hawkey are the 1851 census where he is in the Ragged Industrial school and the 1881 census in Wolstanton.
It is possible - likely that the Ann and Charles family in Liverpool are related to him but not directly.
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I think tomorrow is a good idea. We might have some brainwaves overnight, or maybe not :)