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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: Ed1946 on Tuesday 19 November 19 03:37 GMT (UK)
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I am trying to locate the death date and place of Jack Grant. According to his WWI Service Record he was born at Dalmorton, June 30, 1894 (page 54). Dalmorton is near Grafton NSW. Any birth at Dalmorton would normally be registered at Grafton, but I can’t find a birth for any ‘Grant’ in the Grafton area around 1894.
Link to his Service Record: - https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/ViewImage.aspx?B=4669981
According to his Service Record his father’s name was also Jack, living at the village of Lawrence, also near Grafton, but certainly not close to Dalmorton. Contradictory, on page 2 and page 41 of his service record he gives his place of birth as Ulmarra, also near Grafton, but Ulmarra is not near Dalmorton and any local would not confuse the two places.
His service record mentions other towns for various reasons. They are Toogoolawah, Queensland mentioned in 1917 and Bathurst NSW is mentioned in 1952.
There is a Jack Grant who died at Orange, NSW on November 2, 1965 – parents Jack and Elizabeth
Funeral Notice reads: Grant. – The Relatives and Friends of the late JACK GRANT, of 181 March St., Orange, are kindly invited to attend his funeral, to leave the St. Mary’s Catholic Church, East Orange, after prayers commencing at 12 noon TODAY (Wednesday), thence for interment in the Catholic portion of the Orange Cemetery. Members of the R.S.S. and A.I.L.A. are requested to attend.
Orange City Council advised me that he is buried in Orange Cemetery Lot Number J185, an unmarked grave.
It is unlikely this is the Jack Grant of interest as in his service record (page 40) there is a claim for
Repatriation benefits dated January 13, 1966 i.e. after the death of Jack Grant in Orange. Although, the dates are relatively close, I guess it is possible he died while the application was going through the process? And, in 1952 he was in the Bathurst area which is not far from Orange.
I would greatly appreciate any help or suggestions that will confirm Jack’s date and place of death.
Regards,
Ed
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There are Probate packet which may hold more information https://tinyurl.com/rshnsj8
NRS-13660-47-238-Series 4_604914 | Jack Grant - Date of Death 02/11/1965, Granted on 13/01/1966
and this may be connected as same date of death
NRS-13660-46-198-103028/1989 | Jack Grant - Date of Death 02/11/1965, Granted on 07/03/1989
You could post a request for Ros to kindly check out these probate packets on her next visit to the Archives. https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=703011.0
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Did he also enlist for home service in WW2? The WW2 records often show a date of death.
http://www.ww2roll.gov.au/Veteran.aspx?serviceId=A&veteranId=308613
Debra :)
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Thanks cupoflife - I forgot about probate, I will do as you say.
Just found probate notice in SMH and now know that he married in 1955 to Selinda Beatrice McBride which may help further, but of course I still can't be sure the 'Orange' Jack Grant is the person I am looking for.
Thanks again for reminding me about probate.
Ed
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Hi Debra,
Looks like it's the same Jack Grant in WWII - I will check it out.
Many thanks - Ed
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Who is Mrs Wakely, of Petrie Terrace?
Jamjar
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I wonder if this might be his father, given that Jack/John are often the same:
3286/1927 GRANT John parents Alexander and Margaret MACLEAN
I can’t see a death notice, but you’ll find one for his brother Hugh on Trove 1942.
Obits for Hugh, 4th column: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article192466690
5th column: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article192479794
https://www.clarence.nsw.gov.au/cp_themes/metro/csearch.asp#cresults
They arrived in Sept 1876: http://marinersandships.com.au/1876/09/056tam.htm
Jamjar
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J. GRANT, Toogoolawah mentioned, 3rd column: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article213488894
A Mr and Mrs Grant, Tooloolawah, 1929, 3rd column. Maybe someone with access to electoral roles can see who they are?: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article21405136
A Miss Palmer visiting her sister, Mrs Grant, at Tooloolawah:
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article254086195
A marriage in QLD: 1928 C1770 Daisy Hilda Palmer to John George Grant
Birth: 1905 C10802 Daisy Hilda Palmer parents John Henry Palmer and Daisy Valentine Williams
Australia, Electoral Rolls, 1903-1980
Daisy Hilda Grant
Residence 1934 city Cowper New South Wales Australia
COWPER is literally across the road/river from BRUSHGROVE, where HUGH died.
VIC death: 22465/1989 GRANT Daisy Hilda parents John Henry Palmer, Daisy Valentine Williams born Toowoomba spouse John George Grant 83 Years
GRANT Daisy Hilda Death notice 27AUG1989 Death late of Molesworth Nursing Home Melbourne The Age (Melbourne) 30AUG1989
Daisy Hilda Grant Springvale Botanical Cemetery Cremated 30 August 1989
1019/661
DAISY HILDA GRANT Date of grant: 23 Jan 1990; Date of death: 27 Aug 1989; Occupation: PENSIONER; Residence: Glen Iris
DATE:1989
SERIES:Wills
AGENCY:Master of the Supreme Court
CITATION:VPRS 7591/ P15 unit 80, item 1019/661
Jamjar
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Hi Jamjar,
You have been a busy girl!
And, given me lots of information to follow up.
The death of John Grant in 1927 was the result of suicide - Daily Examiner, Grafton, issue dated February 19, 1927 - Page 4.
However, the newspaper article, any many earlier newspaper mentions, provide very little helpful information.
I will see what I can find from the information that you have provided as soon as I have a chance.
Thanks for your help.
Regards Ed.
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Poor man, an extreme way to kill oneself. :'(
His age in the paper write-up fits with the age on the Scotland census:
I have all the deaths for the siblings of this John. Interesting is that that all have Margaret as mother.
On the 1861 census SUTHERLAND 046/15/22 we see:
Alexander 48
Katherine 42
Margaret 28
Gustavus 0
Charles 2
Robert 3
Hugh 5
John 7
Katherine 8
In 1871, SUTHERLAND 046/15/19, no Margaret
Father Alexander is buried at Rookwood with Catherine.
Deaths:
Alexander 1894 in Sydney
Catherine 1883 in Sydney
Gustavus 1900 in Cairns
Charles 1898 in New Guinea
Robert 1905 in Sydney
Hugh - Brushgrove
John - Brushgove
Catherine married Macleod died 1935 Sydney
Jamjar
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Hi Jamjar,
Thanks for the additional information.
I have just ordered a death certificate for the Jack Grant who died at Orange, NSW, in 1965 - I had ruled him out previously because he died before a claim was made for Repatriation benefits. However, his date of death & the date of the claim are so close they could have crossed in the mail ...so to speak.
I'm hoping that the death certificate will provide some clues that will rule him in, or out. I guess it may depend on who the informant was for the death information. I now know that this Jack Grant married late in life but this may have been his second marriage - anyway hopefully I will find out. There is a Jack Grant from Orange who enlisted during WWII about the same age and if this is the same person his next of kin was Evelyn Grant ...maybe his first wife???
I will let you know what the certificate reveals in due course.
Thanks again for your help.
Regards, Ed
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I think his wife was Daisy. The John who married her wasn’t the son John of Hugh, as he died in WW1.
Or, not: Mr J. G. Grant from Inverness, Scotland, marriage 4th column: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article181772372
There has to be some connection to Jack and the others, though. :-\
It would be good to see who Daisy is living with in Cowper.
Jamjar
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Hi Ed1946,
Just wondering how you went with the certificate? I've only just started researching my ex-husband's family and discovered today that Selinda Beatrice McBride was his Great Grandmother!
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Hi Nicky,
I haven't received the certificate as yet but will let you know when it arrives.
Regards, Ed
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Hi Nicky,
Jack Grant's death information is attached.
If you come across anyone with any knowledge of Jack Grant during your research I would appreciate hearing from you.
Regards,
Ed
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Hi Ed,
Thank you for the certificate, it is very much appreciated.
I have attached a marriage certificate for Selinda's daughter, Gertrude. Gertrude was from Selinda's first marriage to Jack McBride and my ex-husband's Grandmother. If I find any more information, I will gladly pass it on.
I'm not sure if you live close by, but if you find Jack has a headstone and where it's located within the cemetery, I'd be more than happy to go and take a photo for you.
Regards, Nicky
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Hi Nicky,
Thanks for the certificate and for your offer to help.
I live in Grafton, NSW but I did contact Orange Council some time ago regarding Jack's burial and they advised that he was buried in Lot J185, an unmarked grave.
Thanks,
Ed
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Nicky,
Jack Grant's Funeral Notice is attached.
Ed
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Thanks, Ed.
May I ask where you sourced the funeral notice from? Does CWD have online records?
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Nicky,
I requested the notice from Orange Library quite some time ago. Note that there is no mention of his wife although there may have been a death notice with that information which the library didn't find or send?? The other interesting thing is that there is no headstone.
I have ordered his 1955 marriage certificate to see if that reveals any information - I'm wondering if he had an earlier marriage. I will forward you a copy of the certificate as soon as it arrives.
Ed
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Ed, I've spent quite some time in the Orange Library. They have wonderful resources and very helpful staff.
Jack's funeral notice didn't mention a wife, although his death certificate states, married. It's also interesting to note that his stepson, A N McBride was the informant and lived at the same premises.
Nicky
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Hi Nicky,
Just thought that I should fully explain my earlier post regarding Orange Library when I said "there may have been a death notice with that information which the library didn't find or send?" I'm certainly not suggesting that the library was in any way unhelpful. Sometimes death notices are placed in newspapers weeks after a funeral notice and I never ask or expect staff to search more than a few days.
I have contacted many libraries for information for various voluntary projects I have worked on during the last 20 odd years and with great success. One occasion that will always stand out in my mind is a request to Queensland State Library for a funeral notice - I explained to the library staff that I needed the notice to see if it revealed any contactable relatives as I was looking for a photograph of a WWI Soldier for a memorial. I was hopeful of receiving the notice. However, their response, before contacting me, was to find the notice and then make numerous phone calls throughout Queensland eventually finding the late soldiers daughter living in Maleny, Qld. And, she had a photograph! Needless to say I was enormously grateful as they certainly far exceeded my expectations.
Kind regards,
Ed
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Hi Ed,
That's amazing that they went to so much effort.
In regard to the Orange Library staff, in no way did I think your comment was negative and apologise if my comment read that way.
Kind regards, Nicky
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Hi Ed and Nicky
On page 53 of the war record, Jack signs a stat dec saying he lost his discharge papers and requests a copy. He thinks he may have accidently destroyed them after the death of his wife 2 years previously. This was signed in 1952. So definitely looks like there was a previous wife.
Regards
Jennaya
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Hi Jennaya,
Thanks for your post; I should have noticed that but didn't!
I did suspect there was a earlier marriage due to another comment in his service record where he stated "no" to being married but later that was crossed out and replaced with "yes".
Anyway, the marriage certificate between Jack and Selinda McBride arrived last night which confirms the earlier marriage as Jack declared his marital status as 'widower'. See attached.
Although the confirmation of the earlier marriage has not helped much to identify his first wife at this stage. There is a Jack Grant who married Maude Rodrick on July 17, 1915 and she died on August 8, 1950 - that would fit the "two year earlier" period but that marriage took place while "my" Jack was in England.
Another death is Evelyn Agnes Grant who died at Manly on February 2, 1950 again in the time period but the only marriage I can find so far between Jack Grant and anyone called Evelyn Agnes is Evelyn Agnes Kenna who married John Grant in 1943 - just can't make that one fit at the moment. "My" Jack is called Jack, not John, on all other official records including his probate notice but that's not the only reason I can't make this marriage fit.
Anyway ...I will keep looking!
Thanks again for your post.
Regards,
Ed
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Hi Ed and Nicky
The probates have both marriage certs and death certs for both wives and for Jack
Just taking a quick break - will send you links tonight
Ros
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Hi Ros,
You are worth more money!!!
Will look forward to hearing from you tonight.
Regards,
Ed
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Ros, you are worth you weight in GOLD!!!
(http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/money/coin-shower-smiley-emoticon.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/)
What a beautiful gem you are
Cheers :)
CoL
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So did you find the first wife? Would love to know.
Regards
Jennaya
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Thanks Ed and CoL :) It was CoL's inspiration to photograph it :)
Here's a snippet for you Jennaya :) - still uploading them all....
Ros
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Evelyn’s first NSW marriage:
4708/1906 KENNA John to PARROTT Evelyn A at MERRIWA
Daughters mentioned in Evelyn’s death notice:
11293/1926 BATES Andrew to Agnes M KURRI KURRI (this is Maud)
9801/1928 HUNTER George D to KENNA Madge A WEST MAITLAND
3703/1930 EADY James B to KENNA Mary J WAVERLEY
HUNTER Margaret Ada Death notice 1 Oct 1999 Publication 90 Newcastle Herald 1 Oct 1999 (this is Madge)
PEARSON Patricia Florence Death notice 28 Aug 2005 Death 85 late of Dapto, formerly of Maitland Illawarra Mercury 30 Aug 2005
Someone has an interest in Evelyn: https://www.geni.com/people/Evelyn-Kenna/6000000008050995871
Jamjar
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Thanks Rosball
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Hi Ros,
I would like to fully reiterate Cup-of-Life’s earlier post; you really are a beautiful gem!
Thank you so much for taking the time and the trouble that you so clearly have. Your assistance is genuinely appreciated and has provided very helpful information.
Thanks again.
Warm regards,
Ed.
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Thanks Ed :)
It is really a pleasure to help when I can.
Just shout if you want any more records photographed - usually one record gives clues to more.
Ros
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I am a member of the Orange Family History Group. I have been looking for soldiers in unmarked graves in Orange Cemetery. Just wondering if those folk in this discussion are still online and whether they would help with information regarding Jack for the bio I am doing.
Eventually his grave will be marked with a white cross and eventually he will have a headstone (fingers crossed).
Kind regards
Sharon