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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Perthshire => Topic started by: Jdkrags on Monday 30 September 19 03:23 BST (UK)
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Hello, I would love some help tracing back my branch of the McMartin family. Donald and Isabella McMartin (McLeod) are the branch I descend from. Donald (1827, Ontario-1916, North Dakota) and Isabella (1824, Nova Scotia-1913, North Dakota) are correct for sure. I am confident on their parents (Duncan & Agnes (Nancy) Mcartin (Ferguson), and (George and Catherine McLeod (Stewart), but I’m not 100% sure. I’ve already traced Duncan McMartin (1791, Perthshire-1879, Ontario) into Scotland using Scotland’s People but I’ve not been able to get farther then that. I’d also like to confirm Donald and Isabella’s parents. Thanks for the help, and I’ll give more info if need be.
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Welcome to Rootschat ;)
Can you list the children of Donald & Isabella in order as this can often be a clue to parentage?
Have you found any passenger lists or any baptisms i.e. what lead you to the suspected parents?
Are there any clues as to which area(s) in Perthshire?
This may be worth a look at: http://www.borenich.co.uk/Marriages.html
Annie
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Yes. Here’s the photos of the McMartin family biography from the Pembina County Pioneer Daughters Collection Index. I’ll have to post them separate. As far as I am concerned the McMartins are from Killin, Perthshire.
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#1 sorry I posted these two twice. They are the same.
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#2
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#3
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Is this correct (from a quick look at an online tree, possibly yours & easier to follow)?
Children of Donald & Isabella;
Duncan c1851
George c1853
Christina c1857
Anne c1858
Peter c1861
Donald c1865
Mary Belle c1870
+ 2 who dii
Often when there's been a dii, the next child is named the same although not always.
From the above, Donald's parents could be Duncan & Anne, Isabella's could be George & Christina although the naming pattern wasn't always used?
I haven't time to read through your images in full but can you please answer the questions in my 1st post so people know what you have/don't have i.e. what to look for in order to help you.
The main question being why you think Killin & if you know when they arrived in Canada?
I found this which may be of interest as it shows area names: http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ofs/
One in particular 21 Apr 1824;
"Representation and petition of Donald McMartin, Killin, tenant, Easter Moiarlanich, Glenlochay, to be continued in his farm another year though he cannot pay all the rent at once"
Annie
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Those parents of Donald and Isabella are correct, although my tree has the names spelled a bit different. I had found Duncan’s birth record in Killin on 4 Jul 1791. His parents are listed as Donald and Mary McMartin. That’s why I have been led to believe they are from Killin. The original picture is too large to post. I don’t know when they came to Canada and to clarify, Donald and Isabella are born in Canada. Donald’s parents are from Scotland and Isabella’s were born in Canada but were Scottish in heritage.
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I see that the original index on SP doesn't say what the surname of Duncan's mother was, just naming her as Mary.
I also note that two other children were baptised in Killin to Donald McMartin and Margaret née McMartin, Duncan, 13 November 1790; Patrick, 13 June 1794. Is it possible, I wonder, that Duncan baptised in 1790 and Duncan baptised in 1791 are actually two records of the same person, the second listing getting his mother's name wrong? It's not unusual for the name Margt (abbreviation for Margaret) to be confused with Mary.
Incidentally, it is customary in Scottish documents to refer to a married woman by her maiden surname, or as 'xxx yyy or zzz' where xxx is her given name, yyy her maiden name and zzz the surname of her husband. She is never referred to as 'xxx yyy zzz', which is open to confusion because in Scotland yyy would normally be interpreted as a middle name.
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Yeah I could totally see that being true. I had also found Donald and Mary’s marriage record in Killin on 22 Mar 1789. It said that Donald was of Weem and that Mary was of Kenmore (right across the Loch Tay). I also saw a record of marriage to a Donald McMartin and Margaret McVean on 4 Aug 1793 in Killin. I am leaning more toward the first one because Duncan’s birth didn’t mention McVean. I also wanted to find Donald’s birth in Ontario to Duncan and Agnes to confirm them as his parents before I dove too far into the Scottish records, but I can’t find his birth in Ontario.
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Hi again! One issue I have found is that as I’m conducting research, it seems like I keep running into two different McMartin families around the same time in Ontario. The one I hail from are the McMartin’s of Huron, Ontario. The ones I keep getting confused with are the McMartin’s from Glengarry, Ontario. This might be possible if both McMartin surnames come from Killin, and I’m just getting messed up between the different lines? Or they are two different families who happen to share the same surname. I’m still wondering, however, if this Margaret McVean who I’ve seen in a marriage record to a Donald McMartin is in fact Duncan’s mother’s real maiden name, or if there were multiple Donald and Duncan McMartins in the same village. It’s quite confusing because in my lineage, they have alternated between Donald and Duncan for at least 4 generations. Any help is greatly appreciated :)
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Here are the Donald's you have discussed plus the others in the time frame:
Notes indicate where born if I have the OPR record.
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Be aware that there were three groups of McMartin Families. The McMartin of Killin - some of which moved into adjacent Balquidder and Callander and were all related. The McMartin of Lawers, Kenmore and the McMartin of Roro, Glenlyon - who were kin also to those of Killin. All three families had branches that immigrated in part to New York early on - with one of those founding Martintown in Ontario after US Independence.
More than one family from Glenlyon (or perhaps Callander) immigrated to Argenteuil, Quebec on the northside of the Ottawa. This land was poor, so often the families here crossed the Ottawa into Prescott, Osgoode or into Glengarry Stormont.
"In the beginning of the present century, JOHN MCMARTIN of Genlyon, Perthshire,
Scotland, decided to try his fortune in the New World. His wife having relatives at
the Bay of Chaleurs, on the north of New Brunswick, thither he went, and prepared
for himself and family a home. A year or two subsequently, learning that two of
his brothers, farmers in Scotland, were about emigrating to Canada, he decided to
seek with them, when they arrived, a more suitable place for agriculturists than could
be found near the Bay of Chaleurs. In that locality the inhabitants subsisted almost
wholly by fishing; but as this method of procuring a livelihood was not congenial to his tastes, and the land there was generally sterile, he gladly availed himself of a
chance to dispose of what he had purchased. This he exchanged with his wife s
uncles for land which they had received for service rendered the Government -md
which was situated in the County of Huntingdon, Quebec. On reaching Montreal
however, he learned that his estate in Huntingdon was in an unbroken wilderness
and that should he settle there, his nearest neighbour would be thirty miles distant.
At this time Major Murray was in Montreal, endeavouring to obtain Scotch set
tlers for his Seigniory on the Ottawa, and Mr. McMartin was induced to sell his land
in Huntingdon, and with his brothers take up his residence in the Seigniory. Accord
ingly in 1801, or the year following, he came hither, and purchased two lots on the
south side of the River Rouge which are now owned by the family of the late Geo.
Hyde. The inevitable log house and small clearing were here on his arrival, but in
a few years, about 1810, he built another house, which, with some alterations and
additions, is still standing and occupied by the family of Mr. Hyde. Mr. McMartin
added another lot to those which he first purchased, and with the help of his sons
cleared up the greater part of these three lots ; he died in 1847. Four of his sons
Finley, Duncan, Daniel and Martin, joined the Cavalry Company of Capt. McLean
in the Rebellion of 1837-38, and all remained in it, till advancing years induced them
to yield their places to younger men. Mr. McMartin had fifteen children, thirteen of
whom arrived at maturity ; eleven of them settled on the River Rouge ; the youngest
son, Martin, lived and died on the homestead. "
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Thank you so much for the family chart visual. I come from Donald and Mary McMartin, whose sons were Duncan and John ( they are represented in the chart ). I haven’t been able to trace back Donald or Mary’s lineages with certainty, have you?
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I have not. I am currently working my way through the other families in the parish records. On Campbells. I am trying to map out families on the Scotland side to eliminate candidates from those that emigrated. Do you have a public tree that is viewable - or can you DM info on the top part of your tree?
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Yes, here’s a link copy of my tree on Ancestry: https://www.ancestry.com/family-tree/pt/RSVP.aspx?dat=MTE2NzUzOTY4OzswNTIxYmQ1Ni0wMDA2LTAwMDAtMDAwMC0wMDAwMDAwMDAwMDA7MjAyMDA5MjkxMzEzNTM7MQ==&mac=+WjttQrExhsS+BOTiQ7UCg==
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I have a huge line of McMartin family that originated in Killin. They moved to Fulton/johnstown/mohawk valley New York, then on to charlottenburgh/Martintown glengarry Ontario Canada.
I'm curious if we are related. Is there anyway you could send me those pages so I can see if we are the same line. I have about 14 pages of names, dates and marriages I'm going through currently.
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Hi,
Just following up on this.
I messaged Trish, but will post this here as well:
https://www.electricscotland.com/webclans/atoc/cameron_macmartin.htm (https://www.electricscotland.com/webclans/atoc/cameron_macmartin.htm)
The McMartins of Martintown who are labeled as originating from Letterfinlay used the alias of Cameron.
This is only visible in the OPR for George Cameron or McMartin who gave birth to a daughter Margaret in 1828 in Urquhart. He is referenced in the 3rd last paragraph of the above link.
This makes identifying the Martintown family more challenging and may make current trees assuming Killin parish suspect and in need of revision.
Having indexed the McMartins in Fortingall/Kenmore/Weem/Killin - I have managed to assemble the trees for Fortingall to a good degree this week.
The McMartins of Roro, residing at Balnahanaid, Balnacraig and Inverinian largely settled at Argenteuil, Quebec and Fulton/Leicester New York. One family settled at Wolfred, Ontario. There are one or two other McMartin families that were in Quebec and moved to the states that have not been linked yet - because of lack of birth records including a Finlay that ended up in Minnesota.
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/71146847/finlay-mcmartin?_gl=1*4motnj*_ga*MTYxNTE4MzAyMS4xNjI5MzQ4OTIy*_ga_4QT8FMEX30*MTY2NDIzOTA0MC4yNjcuMS4xNjY0MjQ4NjY1LjAuMC4w (https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/71146847/finlay-mcmartin?_gl=1*4motnj*_ga*MTYxNTE4MzAyMS4xNjI5MzQ4OTIy*_ga_4QT8FMEX30*MTY2NDIzOTA0MC4yNjcuMS4xNjY0MjQ4NjY1LjAuMC4w)
I believe he is related to the Roro branches. Will take a bit of combing through Quebec parish records.
There is one family Donald McMartin/Marjory McCallum who settled at St Eustache. Their son Finlay b 1812 is said to have been from Inverness. There is indeed a 1812 birth in Kilmorack there from a Donald with no mother. This may be a Roro branch where Donald just went to Inverness prior to immigrating as it is the only McMartin record there. Or like the Letterfinlay family may be aliased Cameron. Settling next to the other McMartins makes me lean towards the former.
Each of the senior McMartin of Roro branches married a McKercher or McNaughton of Roro so I am seeing DNA matches in my or other McKercher descendants for some of these branches.
Now Jdkrags family from Duncroisk, Killin also went to St Eustache like the family I mentioned above. The children's naming scheme differs, so it is unlikely that they were of the same family, but could be cousins of a fashion.
Donald b 1827's (probable) grandparents were Donald McMartin of Weem and Mary McMartin of Kenmore.
There were two detached portions of Weem and Kenmore in Glenlochay, Killin. So they could both be from Glenlochay born near each other and just in different parishes becuase of how messed up boundaries were. Or maybe Donald was from Roro - which was part of Weem at that time. Not sure at this point. More of the Killin trees need to be sorted out.