RootsChat.Com
Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: whifflet on Tuesday 13 August 19 18:03 BST (UK)
-
Hi. Would appreciate any help to find where my great great grandmother and Grandfather are buried A Joseph Watson b. 1809 in Aberdeen and a Jane Dunstan Watson b. 1805 from Banffshire I believe. I found Joseph in the 1871 census in Motherwell with his Daughter Helen but not Jane his wife. Had she died? Their daughter Helen was born in Edinburgh 1844. Can anyone throw light on this for me? Many thanks .
-
Is Joseph shown as a widower in 1871? Was Helen still alive in 1861?
Have you looked on Scotlands People to establish when and where they both died?
www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk
-
The only match in 1861 is this one in Stranraer. You would have to pay to view the image to see if Joseph was a widower but I think it's likely he was
Joseph Watson 53 painter b Aberdeenshire
Margaret 24 wife b Ireland (don't think she is Joseph's wife - possibly his daughter in law)
John 3 grandson b Stranraer
ED3 page 20 line 9
Jane was alive in 1851 but they were living in Glasgow so seems they moved around a bit
Looks like Jane may have died between 1851-1861
-
Hi. Would appreciate any help to find where my great great grandmother and Grandfather are buried A Joseph Watson b. 1809 in Aberdeen and a Jane Dunstan Watson b. 1805 from Banffshire I believe.
Was Watson her maiden name?
I note that FindMyPast's transcription of the 1851 census says that Jane was born in 'Fochabers, Banffshire'. It so happens that Fochabers is not in Banffshire, but in Moray. However it is in the parish of Bellie, which is mainly in Moray but partly in Banffshire. The Banffshire part of the parish of Bellie is also part of the anomalous parish of Enzie (pronounced 'ING-ie') which remained fairly strongly Roman Catholic throughout the 17th and 18th centuries, in defiance of the prevailing Protestantism all round about. So I suspect that your Watsons may have been Roman Catholics.
FreeCEN's transcription has, in my view not very helpfully, amended the birthplace to read 'Morayshire, Fochabers' with a note that the original reads Banffshire.
But at least FreeCEN has managed to state that St Davids is in Glasgow; FindMyPast simply says, 'St David's, Lanarkshire'. And it adds supposed years of birth which do not feature in the original document.
In 1841 (FindMyPast) Joseph, Jane and John are in Church Street, Inverness.
Joseph Watson, journeyman house painter, aged 47, married Margaret Carruthers, aged 20, in Stranraer on 13 April 1857. His parents were William Watson, merchant, and Charlotte Watson maiden surname Shand. Hers were William Carruthers and Margaret ?Strain?.
So Jane must have died between 1851 and 1857. There is no likely-looking death in the SP index so it looks likely that she died before 1855.
Noting that Joseph and Margaret's son was named John, I wonder if Joseph's son John by his first wife had died young?
-
Jane Dunstan Watson
How accurate is this name, and where is your source?
Malky
-
Just to add to Carole's posts.
JOSEPH WATSON/JANE DUSDAN
Son JOHN born 11/9/1836 baptised 18/10/1836 Inverness, St Mary's RC church
Whch might explain why I could not find the births or Marriage of Joseph & Jane
1841 WATSON = Church Street, Inverness
Joseph M 30 Painter OUC
Jane F 25 OUC
John M 4 INV
1851 WATSON = Dempster Street, Glasgow
Jos Head 42 House Painter (Journeyman) ABD Aberdeen
Jane Wife 46 BAN Fochabers
John Son 13 Scholar INV Inverness
Helen Dau 6 Scholar MLN Edinburgh
Colin
-
Thank you all for your info. I will try and find Jane's death from this. Joseph definitely got around yes. In the note I have Jane and Joseph's daughter Helen had a lot of children, one being Jane D. Cowan. I believe the name has been passed down through the family as Dunstan. Thanks again all for your speedy replies
-
From Reply #3
"So Jane must have died between 1851 and 1857. There is no likely-looking death in the SP index so it looks likely that she died before 1855"
A MI would be a good find if it exists/is recorded?
Have you found a death for Joseph?
Are both parents deceased on the marriage of dau Helen, where/when did she marry?
Annie
-
Hi Rosinish. No I do not know when Joseph died. Helen his daughter married in Glasgow 1863 to a Robert Cowan . They moved to Motherwell where my family came from. Thankyou
-
Helen his daughter married in Glasgow 1863 to a Robert Cowan
Can you please state exactly what's written in the parents column?
Annie
-
Hi It's not too clear for her maiden name. But it could be Dutton. Her father is Joseph Watson :)
-
Hi It's not too clear for her maiden name. But it could be Dutton. Her father is Joseph Watson :)
But does it say (Deceased) after either or both names?
-
Hi. Both father's alive. Mothers deceased
-
That confirms other information, i.e. that Jane had died and Joseph was still alive.
I see that Joseph is described in the 1871 census as a widower, aged 62, born Aberdeen Old Machar.
There is no death of a Margaret Watson, other surname Carruthers, in the deaths index at SP. So did Margaret leave Joseph and go back to Ireland with their son? Did she die in Ireland between 1861 and 1871?
There are six Joseph Watsons born 1808 plus or minus five years in the deaths index on SP:
Age 61, died 1873, Edinburgh Canongate (YoB 1811/1812)
Age 67, died 1876, Dumfries (DoB 1808/1809)
Age 77, died 1882, Paisley
Age 79, died 1882, Dunfermline
Age 78, died 1884, St Martins
Age 77, died 1888, Auchinleck
There are five Joseph Watsons born 1808 plus or minus five years in the 1881 census:
Age 78, Dunfermline, born Renfrewshire
Age 75, Paisley, born Campsie, Stirlingshire
Age 74, St Martins, born Perthshire
Age 71, Lochlee, born Errol
Age 69, Ayr, born Ayrshire
I've coloured the ones who match, leaving just two possibles for your Joseph. The one who died in Edinburgh is a few years too young. Have you looked at the death certificate of the one who died in Dumfries?
-
Thankyou Forfarian. What a pal. I will find him. I will look at the Dumfries records. So glad I came on to Rootschat again. Lots of dead ends everywhere else I looked. 🙋
-
Joseph Watson died on 3 November 1880 at North British Buildings, Coatbridge (at home of his daughter Ellen and husband Robert Cowan who registered the death). I have been unable to find a death record for his first wife Jane Dustan who I pressure must have died between 1851 (living in Glasgow) and Joseph remarrying in Stranraer in 1857. There is a death recorded for a Jane Dustan in Old Machar, Aberdeen on 16/5/1854 which I've not been able to determine if related (Joseph was born in Old Machar).
-
Is this the deaths...
WATSON JOSEPH - 63 - 1880 - 652/2 431 Old Monkland (Middle District)
DUSTAN JANE - 73 - 16/05/1854 - 168/B 210 584 Old Machar
Have you viewed the image for Jane, age seems out but?
Annie
-
WATSON JOSEPH - 63 - 1880 - 652/2 431 Old Monkland (Middle District) is the correct death for Joseph Watson.
I agree that Jane (DUSTAN JANE - 73 - 16/05/1854 - 168/B 210 584 Old Machar) is too old. Thanks. I had been looking at (DUSTAN JANE -16/05/1854 - 168/B 200 86 Old Machar), which doesn't give an age but which I think relates to the same death.
Joseph Watson's death certificate states he was the widower of his second wife Margaret Carruthers which is incorrect. It is strange and unusual but she was 30 years younger than Joseph when they married in Stranraer in 1857 (she was the sister of his son John Dustan Watson's wife Eliza Carruthers). She remarried twice 1) Henry Trentum in Glasgow 1/1/1869, with who she had 3 children and 2) James Monteith in Stranraer 29/9/1885 before her death in Kirkcaldy in 1903 (CARRUTHERS MARGARET - 61 - 442/41 Kirkcaldy and Abbotshall).