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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Amberella on Tuesday 08 January 19 02:55 GMT (UK)
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One of my ancestors married via licence which he got through the Vicar General of Canterbury on June 4, 1819. He married the next day.
Does a licence usually note the spouses' ages & parents? For the wife there is absolutely NO information about her other than her name so I have no idea when or where she was born or who her parents were. All I know is that the parish register (St. Botolph without Aldersgate, London) indicates that she was "of this parish" which says very little. She MAY have been born in the parish or, like her husband-to-be, she may have come to London from afar (in his case, Reading, Berkshire).
Does anyone know if the licences were kept or if the Vicar General of Canterbury had some sort of ledger where they noted the nitty-gritty details then issued a less complete licence?
PS - their first child arrived over a year later so I don't think she was pregnant at the time.
Thanks.
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The license will have little more than the register, although it may state parish of origin (where they were living at time of marriage). If the bride to be was underage there could be a declaration of consent by parent or guardian.
And you will get signatures if they signed.
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Thank you! Sort of what I expected. Really difficult when I have NO idea of her birth date & only a "guesstimate" when she died.
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Still worth looking at if you can access them. Occasionally you get an extra bit of information.
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Always good to obtain a copy of the Bond and Allegation (Licence was passed to the church) for the licence. They will usually give a little more information, ages might not be definite, i.e. aged 21 and upwards, but you will usually find an occupation for the groom. The names of the Bondsmen may also give you further insight.
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For a Church wedding the actual licence was issued to the bridegroom who presented it to the priest conducting the marriage. The licence could then have been kept by the priest, or returned to the diocesan registries, or given to the couple on their wedding day and kept within the family, but usually does not survive.
Stan
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Always good to obtain a copy of the Bond and Allegation (Licence was passed to the church) for the licence. They will usually give a little more information, ages might not be definite, i.e. aged 21 and upwards, but you will usually find an occupation for the groom. The names of the Bondsmen may also give you further insight.
I found the online information about the licence from the website of the Vicar General (Canterbury) & unfortunately it wasn't helpful. I know how old the groom was but it's the bride I'm trying to pin down. I know too the the groom was a veterinary chemist later in life but haven't been able to find where he studied OR if he apprenticed with someone. At some point it'll sort itself out! ;D
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The license will have little more than the register, although it may state parish of origin (where they were living at time of marriage). If the bride to be was underage there could be a declaration of consent by parent or guardian.
And you will get signatures if they signed.
The entry in the parish register has "consent given" (or whatever the term was) crossed out so I just assumed that the bride was of age. Sometimes there are great leaps of faith taken when doing genealogy!
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Some examples of marriage licences are on this site
http://anguline.co.uk/cert/mar_lic.html
Examples of various other certificates etc may be found here
http://anguline.co.uk/cert/certificates.htm
Cheers
Guy
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Always good to obtain a copy of the Bond and Allegation (Licence was passed to the church) for the licence. They will usually give a little more information, ages might not be definite, i.e. aged 21 and upwards, but you will usually find an occupation for the groom. The names of the Bondsmen may also give you further insight.
Hello Amberella
The Marriage Allegation and the Marriage Bond are in effect the Application and Oaths to get a Licence.
Every family historian who finds a Marriage by Lic / Licence ought to endeavour to obtain copies of both the Marriage Allegation and also the Marriage Bond where they survive.
A Bondsman might be related or a known associate to one of the couple.
Ages given for example "23 and upwards" usually appears to be their ages they gave (23 years).
Also their Marital status, where an early Register does not state it.
A book I have Tracing Your Family History by Anthony Adolph, p.100 (Indexed) says:-
"Be aware that, between September 1822 and March 1823 only, both couples had to produce evidence of baptism or an equivalent Certificate proving their age: these will be found with the allegation and are well worth seeking."
It would seem at least one party to the couple had to prove when and where they were baptised or born, unless between Sept 1822 and March 1823 when both had to.
In one Scarborough Marriage Bond (No Allegation) for a Mariner who was likely to be away for long periods, there was a paragraph on the reverse of the Marriage Bond, giving ages and occupation (snippets here) and a reference to whom the Licence was given to ...
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=783033.msg6376568#msg6376568
Bear in mind a party/parties to the Marriage with a parent / parents who is/are Nonconformist/s is unlikely to have had a Parish Baptism and this can be one reason for requiring a Licence and the fact that they may not want their Banns read in Church (for either Privacy, that they did not want to wait for Banns, or that they did NOT attend the Parish Church), so opted for a Licence due to one or several of these reasons.
Nonconformism is the refusal to conform to the C of E / Anglican or attend the Parish church. Research in some Towns and Townships indicate the first Erected dates of these Nonconformist Chapels were originally opened late 17th Century or during the 18th Century and some had followers in the area before the Chapel even opened in the locality.
Presbyterian / English Presbyterian (England & Wales)
Wesleyan / Wesleyan Methodist
Independent
(there are more)
Catholic (Up until the Catholic Relief Act allowing them to Legally Marry in their own churches).
The Marriage Act 1753, full title "An Act for the Better Preventing of Clandestine Marriage", popularly known as Lord Hardwicke's Marriage Act, forced the above and Nonconformists to marry in a Parish Church, until the Law was relaxed.
Jews and Quakers had their own Wedding arrangements.
When you see "Lic" or "Licence" or any other secondary record mentioned in any document, I personally would always obtain a copy, (ages are important and not always in the Marriage Register) and until the Allegation & Bond are both seen, you don't know what snippet/s (if any) of further information lurk in them?
In the case of Marriage Licences, go for the Allegation and Bond, as these are the Oaths and part of the application process. In my Marriage cases the Licences haven't survived as I have asked for them too.
If one happens to be under the age of 21, a parent (or relative where the parents are deceased, or away on business e.g. Mariner) may be a signatory?
Mark
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Thank you for that information - much appreciated! I came across the topic of Marriage Allegations & Bonds just yesterday & was going to check it out today. One ancestor in a different branch, had a Sarum Marriage Bond & it gave quite a bit of information; it finally dawned on me that a MAMB would most likely be worthwhile to explore.
Now all I have to do is find out where these might exist for marriages done by licence. Let's hope something surfaces because I now have more brick walls than I'd like! It took me 3 years, & some extraordinarily helpful people in Ivybridge, Devon, to finally figure out where a g-g-uncle had disappeared to after his parents died so for me, it's never say never!!