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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Warwickshire => England => Warwickshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Richview on Wednesday 17 October 18 14:49 BST (UK)
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Hi All,
I'm researching John Allard born around 1873 Birmingham. 1893 John married Mary Ann O'Hare the marriage certificate on Ancestry is blank gives no information other than his signature and the two witnesses! ( Sent for a copy from the GRO today)
John died 1935 his death certificate shows his address as Ladypool Road Sparkbrook, using the address I discovered a long criminal past convicted of many crimes including manslaughter in 1912.
Further research took me to an article in the press where he is listed as one of the "Peaky Blinders".
I can find no trace of the man prior to the 1911 census does anyone have any ideas please, BMD shows no birth, from the criminal records he was known to use aliases so perhaps he wasn't born Allard - would the authorities check his birth record when he was sentenced?
Richview
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would the authorities check his birth record when he was sentenced?
No they would not. It was not until the late 1870's that the birth registration system was tightened up so it is possible that his birth was never registered
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Thanks Rosie, perhaps the marriage cert will help. Strange it's blank on Ancestry same as many others for that period.
R
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Hopefully the information that they forwarded on to the GRO gives more detail
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I hope say, they were very helpful, if they have a blank record they will return the fee. It's annoying I can find him so easily in the newspapers but that's all!!
R
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In all the press reports and the death entry about John he is born about 1869.
The latest newspaper reference i can find is on June 2nd 1921 when he was reportedly 52.
He was certainly a Peaky Blinder according to the company he was keeping at that time..
There is a John Allard in Eckington Worcs that fits the birthyear and he disappears from census after 1881.
I also see that John was referred to by other gang members as Jack.
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Hi,
Marriage cert arrived and is complete but not much help - John Allard married at St Gabriels Church 1893 his father is shown as Henry occupation painter.
I have a list of convictions
alias
John Wilson,Jack Wilson,John O’Hara, Jack Allard,John Hallard
R
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I have just read about violent London gangs and in it they mention a Jack Allard who served 7 years for manslaughter and 18 months in 1921 they say he was born in a Derbyshire workhouse.
Found John Allard b Belper 1870 in Belper workhouse 1871 with mother Mary Allard age 28.
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Hi
I think you have found John/Jack Allard! Thank You!!
1 Mar 1912 did feloniously kill and slay Charles Cutler. Accused violently assaulted Mr Cutler then killed him by driving an umbrella through his eye
5 May 1921 Surrey Assizes wounding with intent
1912 he was charged with murder that changed to manslaughter and he served 7 years. I did find an army record Feb 1891 ( he failed to attend training!) he stated his age as 18 yrs 7 months - 12 months later he was 22 when he married - I thought 1870 would be about right based on the prison records.
Researching his son tonight he had some minor crimes recorded, William died 1936 but one trial he's referred to as Jack Allard Jr.
R
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Name: John Henry Allard
Year: 1925
Ward or Division/Constituency: Sparkbrook
Street address: 43 Ladypool Road
Residence Place: Birmingham
Also at the same address are Mary Ann & Henry
Could this be John’s father
Henry Allard 55 Carpenter
Louisa Allard 49
William Allard 26
Clara Allard 22
HENRY Allard 20 occ Painter
Catherine Allard 12
Emma Allard 7
Sarah Tustam 69 wife’s mo
Sarah Tustam 46 wife’s sis
1861 RG 9; Piece: 2123; Folio: 60; Page: 61
Could this be John’s parents and sister
Henry Allard 28 Birmingham occ Grainer
Mary A Allard 29 Coleshill
Annie Allard 2 Months
All born Birmingham
1871 RG10; Piece: 3103; Folio: 39; Page: 11;
ALLARD, ANNIE mmn ORAM 
GRO Reference: 1871 M Quarter in BIRMINGHAM Volume 06D Page 108
There’s also this birth with same mmn
ALLARD, HARRY mmn ORAM 
GRO Reference: 1873 S Quarter in BIRMINGHAM Volume 06D Page 81
Death entry
Henry Allard age 36
1880 Apr-May-Jun
Registration district: Birmingham Warwickshire
Volume: 6d Page: 77
ADDED
there’s also this Henry occ painter & grainer
1861 RG 9; Piece: 2172; Folio: 134; Page: 37
Joseph Allard 45
Lydia Allard 48
William Allard 24
Mary A Allard 22
HENRY Allard 19 Birmingham occ painter & grainer
Jane E Allard 16
Harriet E Allard 13
Henry Allard
Baptism 14 Aug 1842 St John,Deritend and Bordesley,Warwick
Father: Joseph Allard
Mother: Lydia
Possible death Annie Allard dau of Henry & Mary Ann
Annie Allard age 3
Mar 1873 Birmingham Volume: 6d Page: 66
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Good Morning,
Yes Ladypool Road is on his death certificate and mentioned in the newspapers, 1893 - 1911 he lived at Belgrave Road Balsall Heath ( no trace of the family 1901 census)
It's a difficult family John Sr married Mary Ann O'Hara 1893 within weeks he appears in the newspapers and that continues until the 1920's. He had 2 sons William born 1899 who was a petty criminal also used various names and Henry born 1902 who was aka John. Henry appears on the 1939 living at Ladypool Road with a wife and 2 children - no trace of marriage or the sons birth, he much later married a widow.
Based on a few army documents 1891 John Sr was a caster - no next of kin - place of birth Birmingham age 18 yrs and 7 months , marriage cert he was living at the same address as his bride Floodgate Street father is Henry Allard Painter marriage was witnessed by assumed a friend and a young girl who lived with the O'Hara family.
I did wonder about Harry Allard born 1873 but can find no census for 1881 for his widowed mother or himself. Knowing his criminal past I'm starting to wonder if one of the alias names was his real name.
R
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Hi, am new to roots chat, found your post whilst browsing. I am a direct descendant of John Allard and his son William. I knew something about their past but recent revelations have been an eye opener.I can fill in some of the blanks and would be interested in newspaper reports etc following their careers !
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Hi,
Yes it is an eye-opener widely documented, I assume you are aware of the murder/manslaughter trial re John Allard?
R
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Hi, yes I have read some details of what happened it came to light when the Peaky Blinders series was televised. I knew the Allards were Bookies/Runners from family info but not the scale of involvement.
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I was asked to research the Allard family for a friend, John Allard had a very long list of convictions for violence and then came the manslaughter trial. His son also appeared in court on numerous occasions. It is quite an easy family to follow the court records are freely available and using the death certificates for father and son their addresses link.
Richview
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Hi, I have a birth certificate for John which I am almost certain is the right one. He was born 07/06/1873 11 Court, Hope St, Birmingham name on Birth Cert is Harry, Father given as Henry occupation Grainer. Mother Harriet Allard formerly Oram. According to family info told to me some years ago he was brought up by maiden aunts and lived off Broad Street, these were probably the ones mentioned in earlier posts, Mary, Jane and Harriet. His father Henry seems to have died but cannot find any trace of his Mother, also are Mary Ann Oram and Harriet Oram one and the same ? This is confusing. I'm not sure his parents ever married. He worked with his Father in Law, one Patrick O'Hara, that is how he met his wife Mary K/A Polly and apparantly would visit Ireland as his wifes family were something to do with horses !!
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Hi,
John was 22 at marriage occupation caster, he married Mary Ann O'Hara 16th April 1893 so a birth 1870/1871. This birth would also match his Army papers. He states his father was Henry a painter an occupation John follows later.
Obviously he is difficult to follow on the census records due to his criminal activity, his first court appearance was a month after he married Mary.
I did follow the "Harry" family initially and totally ruled them out.
R
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Good Afternoon, it is a bit of a mystery, Henry Allard born 1842 is shown as a painter/grainer and seems to match both Harry and John. Did 'John' Allard lie about his age to join the army and did he also lie to marry as I understand you had to be over 21 to marry without permission from a parent or had he in fact used someone else's identity. Harry Allard, Mary Ann Oram/Allard and Harriet Oram/Allard seem to have disappeared altogether. I did find a death for a Harriet Oram whose age could have been the one on Harry's birth cert. She died in All Saints asylum Birmingham 1907, this would explain why Johns parents were not around and would support the story that he was looked after by maiden Aunts or was he using someone else's story
I would be grateful if you could advise me as to how I go about accessing the newspaper and court records.
n.b John's son Henry was always known as Harry.
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To be honest little makes sense with John Allard did he lie about his age or indeed his name. The man used so many aliases it is near impossible to be certain. However having read the book about the London underworld of which he was part that did confirm my theory that he was born in Belper 1870 to a single mother.
The problem with this family is the changing of names to suit, your a descendant of William I assume he changed his name just to add to the confusion.
I have used various finding aids oddly enough Trove gave a full account of the murder the rest is in the British newspaper archives , the jail court papers are public record on FindMyPast.
I am certain of the marriage to Mary Ann O'Hara and certain that son William married Doris Hill and they had 3 daughters and 1 son.
R
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Just checked his age on the Court papers 1912 he was 42.
R
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Thanks for the info, you are correct about the marriages to Mary Ann and Doris, John and Mary Ann were my Gt grandparents and William was my Grandfather. I knew that both of them had been involved with the betting world. William sometimes took my Mother with him when he went away to the races. When I first investigated John Allard and his criminal activities I was not sure he and my Gt Grandfather were one and the same. William's children were certainly not fully aware of either their Grandfathers or their Father's past and my Grandmother never revealed it.
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John on release from jail lived with Doris and William and Lillian. I can be 100% certain that they are the same family as the newspaper reports link the addresses.
It is difficult when people use an alias but in some respects can be an advantage with family research if you are lucky enough to find court records they are all listed. John was fortunate the jury were swayed to the lesser charge of manslaughter I think we can guess why, it was premeditated murder and there can be no doubt that he would have faced the death sentence. Henry "John" Allard there is very little for him it's possible he married twice although I can only find the marriage to Phyllis Snape nee Arkle.
Doris it's difficult to follow her family as her mother was a relatively young widow.
R
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I can confirm that it is the same family especially as John went to live with William Doris and Lillian. Lillian was born in 1923 so I assume this was after he was sentenced for his part in the Birmingham Boys fracas after the Epsom Races . Another relative linked John with Joseph and Lydia Allard but they were unable to confirm John's birth. Interestingly Lydia Allard nee Wragg was born in Handley Derbyshire.
Henry John Allard ,John's son lived with a woman called Lena (they were never married)they had a daughter of the same name. According to my late Mother they would leave Lena with John and Mary Ann and then travel around selling things, she also thought the older Lena may have been a Romany. Lena passed away and eventually Henry (Harry) married Phyllis Snape. The family lost touch with the Allard side of the family after my Grandfathers death in 1936.
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John was sentenced to 12 months for Larceny to the person at Worcs 1928 , Liberation was the 27 Feb 1929 his address 19 Lower Essex Street.
Henry Allard's birth was registered 1902 he was known as John Jr - 1939 his occupation was a lorry driver and mechanic. He had two children with Selina/Lena Stevens John Henry 1924 and Lena Susie 1928. His brother William was also a driver at the time of his death in 1936. It would appear from the obituary for Mary Ann that John and Lena lived with her.
Alan Snape added a number of photographs for John Desmond to his tree on Ancestry which may be of interest to you.
I see no connection to John Allard with Joseph & Lydia - looking at his numerous convictions it looks as if he was indeed born 1870.
R
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I think you are right about no connection with Joseph and Lydia, I think we have been barking up the wrong tree LOL. John Desmond was my uncle, he was only four when his Father passed away, from the info you have given I think I can see why John snr's Grandchildren were told that Grandad had gone to Ireland to visit. My Mother was very attached to her Grandfather and there was nothing in family memories to link him with violence etc. When he died my Mother said there were a lot of smart men in bowler hats at the funeral she thought they were something to do with the council !! They were certainly to do with something but I don't think it was the council.
It just shows that when you start to look at your family tree you have to be prepared for anything.
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Over the years I have researched many families both in the UK and overseas, the only way is to start with a blank canvas.
I did read about the gang wars and violence prior to researching John Allard it was later that I learnt of his connection to Billy Kember.
John was a career criminal from an early age I would assume as records are released more of his past will come to light.
At some point a tree will be released on Ancestry.com, to complete would require a visit to the archives, police museum and cemetery that may happen next year.
The research has been more than interesting and rather shocking.
R
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Shocking indeed, thank you for all the info. I am hoping to have access to photographs when the police museum is eventually open to the public, I suppose a mugshot would be better than none at all.My Grandfather William is buried at Brandwood End, I would stay with my Grandmother every week end as a small child and would frequently go with her to the cemetery to tend his grave. It had no memorial stone she could not afford one. Will keep an eye on Ancestry. Looks like I will have to re do the tree.
So, Who were you John Allard ?
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Your very welcome, hopefully I have been able to point your in the direction of the records available.
I have no direct connection with the family , I was just asked to help someone with research, I have been assisting people with family history for many years.
R
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Thanks again :)
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I have just found this chat on the Forum and hope that you may pick up this post although nearly twelve months later.
I am Henry John Allard's daughter Phyllis, my father was known as "Harry". He was a shop keeper and market trader. When I was first born we lived at 43 Ladypool Road, Sparkbrook and my father rented a shop across the road which my mother ran. (His father also lived at this house before I was born) He was mainly a market trader and sold leather goods which he made himself. We later lived behind a shop in Prince of Wales Lane. My father had another shop in Newtown Row as well. He was well known as Harry the market trader in the 1960s.I understand he used to travel around the country selling these bags and purses before he married my mum (Phyllis Snape, Alan Snape's mother).
My dad kept his family history pretty much to himself although he did confide in me as we used to travel to the market in Newtown Row on a Saturday morning. I also didn't really confide in anyone until 2000s when I was surprised my older half brother Alan Snape didn't know about the manslaughter case.
The story has told to me by my father was that John Allard his father was a horrible violent man and had been a leader of a gang when young and was later very involved with a race course and betting gang in Birmingham. (My father was a bookies runner when young and could do the TicTac on the course). John Allard used to collect the money from the races (this may have been protection money or bookmakers takings I'm not sure)
On the day of the attack he had noticed two travellers (that were known to him) were watching him. Apparently he threatened them and warned them off early in the day. Later when he was taking the betting money to be dropped off (I can't remember quite where but I remember my father saying it was a lot of money), he noticed them again, he shouted a warning and swore at them. They continued to follow so he faced up to them and a fight developed, he always carried an umberella with a sharp point for protection when he travelled alone and this is what he used to defend himself with, stabbing Cutler the traveller in the eye. The other traveller ran off and the money was never mentioned. My father said several police offers were on the Gangs payroll. The witnesses spoke up for my grandfather and he was later charged with manslaughter not murder.
Shortly after coming out of Prison John Allard threw a man out of an upstairs window- this was reportedly the other traveller but my father wasn't so sure it was him, possibly someone else. He was probably establishing his position again in the gang. He seems to travel to different racecourses quite a lot and his part in the Epson Fight as a member of the 'Brummagem Boys' is recorded.
My father disliked his father so much he ran away several times, one time he went with a circus and another travelled with Romany gypsies and I believe this is when he met Silena whom he had at least one child possibly two with - Lena Susie and Jackie (a boy). Lena once told me Jackie wasn't my fathers son but I thought he looked very like my father.
My father was Henry John Allard although I saw printed cards with Jack Allard, John Henry Allard and Harry Allard on. There were also different professions on the various cards: painter, shop keeper (haberdasher) and market trader. I think its best not to read to much into my family's professions!
He told me the family came from France originally and that they had fled from there with nothing in the 18th century. Joseph and Lydia are definitely part of my family, I traced back to Joseph some years ago (Born 1816 Packwood). If I remember right he died of drink while living in Kings Norton.
I have tried to trace Joseph's parents but have found nothing relating to Packwood, another researcher says he may be nothing to do with Packwood, Joseph also listed Knowle somewhere else. I also found several different dates of birth for him.
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Good Morning,
I researched the Allard family sometime ago, your father was correct Jack Allard was indeed an extremely violent and dangerous man. I'll try to keep this short, it begins with Jack marrying Mary "Ann" O'Hara April 1893, within months of marriage Jack violently assaulted a policemen. He had many sentences before 1912 and used numerous aliases.
1st March 1912 he was charged with murder, there are many newspaper articles worldwide about the case. Charles Cutler was a Commercial Traveller and bookies runner, late 1911 Allard had beaten the man, on the day in question they had rowed, Cutler went home to his widowed mother and said he had been threatened. He spent the evening at his home with his girlfriend, when walking her home Allard came out of the shadows and attacked him, Cutler was in a coma died the next day. Cutler had been beaten then stabbed with the umbrella. Passers by restrained Allard who showed no remorse, he was arrested laughing and threatened the PC's that he would shoot them.
The trial Allard used witnesses to convince the jury , the charge was then reduced to manslaughter,
after the trial his previous convictions were revealed - perhaps had they known there were 11 for violent assault , things would have been very different and Allard would have indeed faced the death sentence.
It is strange that when Allard was released from jail he did not return to Mary but gave his address as 19 Essex Street the home of his son William who also had an interesting past!
There is little known about John Allard pre marriage, my belief he was born to a single woman Mary Allard at Belper workhouse 1870, 1891 he joined the army but his new career was short lived he failed to report for training.
When Henry was 37 his occupation lorry driver /mechanic, he lived with Selina and two children John b 1924, Lina b 1928.
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Thanks for details of your research, I have seen several newspaper articles myself and details of many of his crimes often in places where there were race courses under numerous alias. My father told me he had a different name in every town. Some newspaper articles call Cutler a traveller and others a commercial traveller and my father was quite definite there were two travellers. The pointed umbrella fits in with what my father told me many years ago and the newspapers reports were written when all of his violent records were known, indeed if the jury had been aware of his history things would probably have gone a different way. My father never called his father Jack only John but said his name was Henry John and he was named after him- Jack -another alias probably. My father was known as Harry.
My father son was only known to me and immediate family as Jackie but this could be nickname - Lena called him Jackie.
I wouldn't read too much into addresses given or occupations, since I have recently looked into family history and old records again and found more old printed cards with slightly different names, addresses and professions. I also found the grave certificate for my grand parents grave.
Briefly I traced the family back to Joseph Allard born 1815 married to Lydia Wragg their son Henry Allard was born 1842.
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Much depends on what you read and what records are available. Some crimes were committed at or near racecourses but there was larceny, housebreaking, violent assault outside his home ,in a public house. He used aliases O'hara, Wilson,Halland, christian names John or Jack, when his son was arrested at the races he was working for Jack Allard Sr bookmaker.
There are court records and newspaper accounts prior to the manslaughter charge the court records obviously are in my view accurate.
Charles Cutler was the son of Hannah born Warwickshire her husband died between 1901-1911 you can trace him easily on the census records, 1911 his occupation was indeed a Commercial Traveller, he was 1 of 8 children , 3 were living 1911.
There is no mention of Charles Cutler being of Romany decent I think his father came from Worcestershire. The first news report said Commercial Traveller and that matches perfectly with the census.
The addresses again match perfectly, if you look at the death certificate on Mr Snapes family tree,
the informant was his son of 19 Essex Street, that is a match to the address when John Allard was released from jail.
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Yes I did not mean all crimes were near race courses just many of the ones I have found on various sites, I have also found some in Birmingham and you obviously found the aliases I found or knew of. I definitely know both he and my father worked the race courses because I met a bookmaker my father knew in the late 1950s.
Going back years ago there was quite a difference between Romanys and travellers- my father travelled with the Romanys and lived with one Silena, he never called them travellers. I understood traveller to mean he was a tough guy who travelled around the country but I was only a young girl when my father confided in me about his early life and violent father and am only remembering what I was told. We never spoke of his father again really and I didn't tell anyone until Barbara Allard contacted me around 2010 and she researched it. I then mentioned it to other family members. Mr Snape is Alan Snape my half brother and obviously I discussed the family history at length with him.
*I have a year of birth for my grandfather of 1872/73 mother Mary Oram.
Are you a family member?
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No I am not related , I was asked to research the family several years ago.
It would make sense that both sons indeed followed their father as bookmakers - I know from the court information that William was arrested on suspicion of "Welshing" using the name of Jack Allard Jr.
Romany Travellers, Fairground Travellers, with an occupation traveller that would imply that the person was a travelling salesman now known as a sales rep.
Mary Oram may be his mother, I did rule her out as John Allard gave his date of birth late 1868 - 1871, I settled on him being born 1870 at Belper, that was confirmed in a book I later read.
I checked my file re Charles Cutler and can confirm he was not Romany his father Hiram Israel Cutler died 1906 was a publican, brewer and provision merchant. Charles may have been involved in the bookmaking business but I think we must be mindful he had already had previous problems with John Allard, I have read the press reports again and all state he was walking from his family home when attacked.