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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: willowwilliam on Friday 03 August 18 07:25 BST (UK)
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Hi,
My GG Grandfather is listed on his wedding certificate as a Marble Cutter Journeyman. Now from reading about Journeyman it appears this has nothing to do with travel but my question is that he was from Lancashire England and travelled to Glasgow Scotland which is where he got married. Does anyone have some clues as to why he would go to Glasgow? Was there a particular good marble cutting trade in Glasgow ? Any help would be appreciated thankyou
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When was this?
Glasgow City Chambers, built during the 1880's, allegedly has more marble than the Vatican ;D
So that could be a reason for the move.
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A “journeyman” was a trade or craftsman that worked for others. My ggggrandfather was a journeyman miller. He moved around from mill to mill but, in his case, not very often.
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A “journeyman” was a trade or craftsman that worked for others. My ggggrandfather was a journeyman miller. He moved around from mill to mill but, in his case, not very often.
Not unless the meaning has changed.
A journeyman was a tradesman who had finished their apprenticeship, but had not yet been accepted by their Guild or trade association as a Master.
An apprentice would finish his time with a Master and be released. He would then start his journey, gathering experiences from various Masters to broaden and deepen his knowledge of his chosen trade. After some time (up to about 5 years), the journeyman would approach his guild with his current Master and apply for full membership. There would be some test and lots of references and finally the journeyman would be created a Master.
The new Master would set up shop for himself or start working with other Masters in company together. Within a short while he would be expected to take on an apprentice of his own. And the cycle would continue.
This practice was still going on, in this form, in the 70s. Modern apprenticeships rely on tech colleges to supply the journeyman phase of training now. At the end of the training, there is but one exam and the person becomes a Master. In fact I don't think that they are called Masters any more - fully skilled or some such. "Look me up on Check-A-Trade!"
The system works certainly, but it has lost something.
Regards
Chas
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The meaning of journeyman has changed over the centuries however it's original meaning was journée man meaning day man, a man paid for a day's work rather than a wage. This applied to men with a trade or skill. It became corrupted to journeyman meaning someone with training in the job he was doing. He doesn't necessarily have to have undergone an apprenticeship.
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Hi,
My GG Grandfather is listed on his wedding certificate as a Marble Cutter Journeyman. Now from reading about Journeyman it appears this has nothing to do with travel but my question is that he was from Lancashire England and travelled to Glasgow Scotland which is where he got married. Does anyone have some clues as to why he would go to Glasgow? Was there a particular good marble cutting trade in Glasgow ? Any help would be appreciated thankyou
On researching extended family of my ancestors I noticed some moved to Glasgow from Leicestershire and they too were stone masons/journeymen....so being nosey
At the time I was really interested why and did some research to find they moved with the same company, however with any employer they would want to employ the best and where the craftsmen were needed
Some of the resources I looked at:
Mitchell Library, Glasgow
https://www.genguide.co.uk/source/stonemason-records-occupations/126/
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The typical 4 storey Glasgow sandstone tenements replaced existing brick 2 storey houses or built on green sites, they were shot-up all over the city from the 1880's up until the Great War. Glasgow was changed completely in a relatively short time & the builders/masons had to come from somewhere. ;D
Skoosh.