RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: Woodabyna on Wednesday 08 November 17 05:59 GMT (UK)
-
Hi, I normally don't research my history outside of Australia but I am having trouble placing a 4th ggmother and her daughter, my 3rd ggmother.
Eliza Conners - married William Baker in 1844 in Bathurst, Australia
on her death cert in 1876 (aged 68) has that her father was William Conners of Dublin - stone cutter and mother Margaret. Also she had been in the colony for 44 years so arrived about 1832. Born abt 1808.
Her daughter Mary Anne Conners and sister Jane, I assume, were born out of wedlock and possibly under another name as I can not find births or immigration records for them or their mother Eliza.
Mary Anne is listed as both Conners and Baker alternatively throughout her life supporting the fact that she was a step child.
Any pointers on researching family history in Dublin or Ireland in general would be most helpful.
Many thanks
Hayley
-
"..Mary Anne Conners and sister Jane"
How are their origins recorded on their marriage certificates, death certificates......birth certificates of their children. What certificates do you have. If you know their origins, you would know where mother Mary Ann CONNERS was when they were born.
Can you list all the information on the death certificate, 1876, please.
-
Eliza Bakers (Conners) death certificate - 2 previous children are not listed as assumed husband took issue of marriage to be only his own. However on his death cert it lists 1 male, 4 females living and 1 male, 1 female deceased (which died after Eliza) which adds weight to previous children before wedlock or different father.
-
You could look at www.irishgenealogy.ie which has church records in Dublin :)
-
thanks I will suss it out. :)
-
Eliza Conners - married William Baker in 1844 in Bathurst, Australia
on her death cert in 1876 (aged 68) has that her father was William Conners of Dublin - stone cutter and mother Margaret. Also she had been in the colony for 44 years so arrived about 1832. Born abt 1808.
FTR I note that the document shows her father's name as John CONNORS for anyone searching
-
Bathurst Free Press and Mining Journal 28 Jul 1855 p3
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/result?
This newspaper article has a list of donors for the construction of St Michaels, Bathurst.
Mr BAKER, Pepper Creek
Mrs BAKER
Agnes and S BAKER
Eliza BAKER
Masters J and W BAKER
This sounds like your family. From the death certificate, 1876, there are two daughters born before the 1844 marriage...Betsey and Agnes. This Betsey is probably Eliza (above) and called Betsey to distinguish her from mother Eliza.
If you are researching the origins of Eliza CONNERS you need details about her life in Australia before her 1844 marriage, then look for information in Ireland.
Do you have marriage and death details for Betsey and Agnes.........how are their origins recorded on their marriage and death records..........when and where were they born?
Can you please respond to my questions in reply#1.........birth year and birth places for Mary Anne CONNERS and sister Jane.
What certificates do you have for BDM events in this family?.
-
Here is the 1844 marriage. Please note that family search has inadvertently placed a number of NSW marriages from that era into "Tasmania". This marriage is for Bathurst, NSW.
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTC8-PN1 There will be scant info on the actual parish register, but it may (depending on if she was a minor) note the name of the person consenting to her marriage (perhaps her father?) At family search Eliza's surname is noted as CONNORS.
NSW BDM has indexed this marriage twice, one should be a transmitted record. At NSW BDM Eliza's surname is noted as CONNORS. I note that the Early Church Code of LG is for St Michaels (Roman Catholic) at Bathurst-Kelso. Vol 94 is definitely Roman Catholic.
1844 NSW BDM
BAKER William and CONNORS Eliza vol 94, line 285 and vol 94, line 258
JM
-
I should also note that civil registrations for bdm in NSW commence from March 1856. Earlier listings at NSW BDM online are part of their holdings for Early Church Records, which, simply put, are not complete. :)
JM
-
Thank you all for your responses. It is a tricky one to explain so I will do my best.
I come into the line with Ester Rowe/Smith
Smith being an impossible name took us many years to find her parents as we could find no birth record for her. However we finally found her listed in the family of James and Mary Anne Smith of Kings Plains (Blayney) NSW.
On many of Mary Annes childrens births she is either listed as Mary Anne Conne/or/s or Baker, born Windsor or Campbells (Campbells Creek near Rockley is where the Baker family lived).
Some of Mary Annes children had her sisters names (Jane, Agnes).
I can not find a birth listing for Mary Ann Baker/Conne/or/s
On her death certificate it lists father William Baker and Mother Elizabeth Connors.
The only certificate I have is for Eliza and Williams marriage as listed above. The second listing on NSW BDM is a mistake as it for another couple. 285/258
Her daughter Jane has only mother as Eliza on the NSW BDM listing at time of death (she married Francis Press and her half sister married another brother).
My guessing is that Eliza came out as a Bounty immigrant and had 2 children out of wedlock and then met William Baker most likely while working at Summer Hill (owned by a Irishman) at Peppers Creek (Rockley). Had a further 2 children out of wedlock with William before they were married.
So I will try the Ireland records and see if I can locate a Eliza or Elizabeth Conne/or/s with parents John and Margaret.
Thanks again for the input, gotta love a challenge for skeletons in the cupboard.
Hayley
-
opps still didn't answer your first questions;
Birth for Mary Anne is about 1834 and for Jane about 1839 but I think earlier for her., given she married in 1853.
-
Can you please identify (NSW BDM) the marriage of James SMITH and your Mary Anne.
Also births of their children.
-
I think i have them all listed on my Ancestry tree which I have opened publicly
Im not sure if this link will work but will try
https://www.ancestry.com.au/family-tree/person/tree/100788773/person/330005042004/facts
-
Hayley, you say you are "guessing that Eliza came out as a Bounty immigrant"
Bounty immigrants are well documented so, if your guess is correct, you should be able to substantiate that. Bounty documents sometimes give parents' names, as well as other information about the migrant.
Dawn M
-
Thanks Dawn, I have sussed it out but nothing definite, a few possibles.
-
....
The only certificate I have is for Eliza and Williams marriage as listed above. The second listing on NSW BDM is a mistake as it for another couple. 285/258 ....
Hi there,
Re the two marriage entries at NSW BDM for William BAKER and Eliza CONNORS in 1844. Are you saying that there were TWO chaps named William BAKER in NSW in 1844 who married lasses BOTH who were named Eliza CONNORS, both ceremonies were Roman Catholic?
:) From the NSW BDM marriage record how do you know which couple were ‘yours’?
:) How have you determined the NSW BDM second listing is a mistake?
:) How have you confirmed that one entry is simply NOT a transmitted copy of the other, thereby conforming to the usual practice of that era in NSW as per NSW Governor requirements dating back to 1810?
https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/archives/collections-and-research/guides-and-indexes/births-deaths-and-marriages-registers-1787-1856
JM
-
A lady at our local library showed me how to look up early records on the micofilm, from the V numbers, for free and the second number was for a totally different couple with different names. I had assumed, either wrongly or not, that it was just a dyslectic typo with 285 and 258 and hence the double up.
I will check it out again when I am back in town with spare time.
-
Hi,
If it turns out that the online index for NSW BDM has (yet another) flawed entry, please do send them an email alert. They can take months to update the online index, but they do eventually get around to it.
JM