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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: JJdownunder on Monday 06 November 17 14:50 GMT (UK)
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I am trying to locate Mary Wallis between the years 1919 (when she married Spencer George Wallis in Western Australia) and 1954 ( when she died in Coolgardie Western Australia ) ....Spencer died in 1924 in Norwood South Australia just 5 years after they were wed but I have not been able to find out what happened to Mary after this nor exactly when they went to South Australia or when she returned to Western Australia we just know she lived in Coolgardie for a number years ... hoping someone can help :)
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It may be helpful to give more information about the backgrounds of both Mary and George.
Parents names and their whereabouts
Birthplaces
Siblings
Occupations
All such details often help with a search.
Sue
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Is this the right Spencer?
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01l0k/
....Spencer George Wallis & Mary Elizabeth Fuller came to Australia between 1912 & 1916 with their two daughters (Ruth & Marg) who were born in England. The two sons Stanley & Arthur were born in Western Australia. After Mary's death, Spencer remarried and the four children from his first marriage were placed in an orphanage.
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Is this the right Spencer?
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01l0k/
....Spencer George Wallis & Mary Elizabeth Fuller came to Australia between 1912 & 1916 with their two daughters (Ruth & Marg) who were born in England. The two sons Stanley & Arthur were born in Western Australia. After Mary's death, Spencer remarried and the four children from his first marriage were placed in an orphanage.
Yes and I have left a msg on that board but have had no reply, the Mary I am searching for is from his second marriage her name was Mary Knight (née Scott) they married in Western Australia in 1919 the same year his first wife died, she also had a daughter but left her with her late husbands parents and they brought her up.. he then died in 1924 in Adelaide and this is where we don’t know what happened to Mary except we know she lived in Coolgardie WA for a number of years prior to her death in 1954 she is buried in Coolgardie... I am currently in contact with someone on Ancestry who descends from Spencer but they were not aware of the second marriage
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It may be helpful to give more information about the backgrounds of both Mary and George.
Parents names and their whereabouts
Birthplaces
Siblings
Occupations
All such details often help with a search.
Sue
Where were her parents?
What were their names?
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Some info from electoral rolls - two men with similar names:
1916, 1917 at Wood St Osborne, WA
George Spencer WALLIS, attendant, Mary Elizabeth WALLIS, hd
1922
Spencer George WALLIS, fireman and Mary WALLIS, hd at 40 Wood St, Fremantle (It may now be the suburb White Gum Valley)
1922 George Spencer WALLIS, fireman listed at 58 Railway ST, Cottesloe - no-one else of that surname listed at this address
Unfortunately I don't have access to South Australia rolls.
There are a number of men listed in Victoria and WA with the second forename Spencer. The next entry I can see which uses Spencer as a first name -
1937 at Applecross
Spencer WALLIS
1943 at Fraser St, Applecross
Spencer WALLIS, gardener.
I see Mary WALLIS, pensioner, in Coolgardie in 1949, 1954 There are other listings in WA but it's not an uncommon name so I won't put them up.
Judith
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Thankyou Judith the fireman is the one his occupation on marriage certificate is fireman.... coincidently Mary arrived in Australia in 1913 to join her husband and his family onboard the same ship (Belgic) as another Spencer Wallis ( he was older than the one she married and we believe he is the one who died 1949 and is buried in Mundaring but we have not been able to connect the two.... thankyou for your input Sue but as she left her parents back in the uk I don’t think this information will be helpful in finding the information in the timeline I am seeking and I don’t want to complicate matters or have people doubling up on info I already have :)
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Oh dear this just seems to complicate matters further as I have just noticed both are listed as firemen ???
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Re the 1922 electoral roll entries - it's possible that it's the same man listed twice. Because bureaucracy relied on human entries for records it's not uncommon to find that people moved and were recorded in two places at the same time because the first record hadn't been removed. This one is a bit odd though as it would seem that the 1916 and 1919 entries are for the man you are looking for but with forenames reversed and with his first wife at the same address as he is later with your Mary but listed as Spencer George.
Quite a coincidence to have 2 men on the same ship with the same not-very-common names.
Judith
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NOTE: in 1919 George Spencer Wallis's occupation is listed as "Attendant" at the Hospital for the Insane in Claremont.
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Wallis – on March 15, 1919, at the Perth Public Hospital, after a long and painful illness Mary Elizabeth, dearly beloved wife of George Spencer Wallis of Tyne Holme, Wood Street, Osborne. Aged 33 (38?) years.
Wallis – the Friends of Mr George Spencer Wallis, attendant at the Hospital for the Insane, Claremont, and of Tyne Holme, Wood Street, Osborne, are respectfully invited to follow the remains of his late dearly beloved wife, Mary Elizabeth, to the place of interment, the Wesleyan Cemetery, Karrakatta.……
Metropolitan Hospitals and Kindred Institutions Industrial Union of Workers.
Wallis. – The members of the above Union are respectfully requested to follow the remains of the late Mrs Mary Elizabeth Wallis, beloved wife of Mr George Spencer Wallis, to the place of interment, the Karrakatta Cemetery………………..
(The West Australian. 17 March 1919).
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And I see a Spencer WALLIS, 28, farm labourer, leaving London, ticketed to Fremantle, on the Gothic, Dec 20, 1912.
:-\ Judith
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The West Australian Directory.
1915-1916. Wallis. Spencer G. Devon Rd, Claremont.
1917. Wallis. Geo. P. Wood St, Osborne.
1918. Wallis, Geo S. Wood St, Osborne.
1919. Not listed.
1920. Not listed.
1921 & 1922. Wallis, Geo, S. Wood St, Swanborne.
1923-1926. Not listed.
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I can see I’m not going to get away with not explaining the whole situation, believe me it’s complicated so hope not to add to the confusion .... Mary Wallis whom I am trying to locate started life as Mary Scott bn 1887 Yeadon Yorkshire she married Thomas William Knight bn 1883 Allerton Bywater Yorkshire married Yeadon Yorkshire 1908 they had two girls but only one survived... the whole Knight Family arrived in Fremantle WA between 1909 and 1913 with Mary and her daughter being the last to arrive in July 1913 (Thomas having arrived the year before) but onboard the same ship as Mary and her daughter was a Spencer Wallis who I will refer to as the elder.....earlier in the same year Spencer Wallis the younger arrived separately ( this is whom Mary later married) Mary’s husband Thomas Knight died in 1916 as a result of an accident and Spencer the youngers Wife also called Mary (Elizabeth) died in 1919 then later the same year Spencer the younger and Mary Knight (née Scott) marry. Mary leaves her daughter to be brought up by the Knight family and Spencer’s 4 children to his first wife are put into an orphanage, 3 of them are later sent into foster care interstate the youngest remained in Perth am guessing he got adopted. Spencer Dies in Adelaide 5 years later and the eldest child Ruth Elizabeth was with him apparently. Then all we know was Mary lived for a time in Coolgardie WA and died there in 1954...We haven’t been able to connect the two Spencer’s but believe they are connected somehow. The elder Spencer died in Mundaring 1949 and I believe he never married but there is also a connection with Mundaring with Mary and Thomas’ only daughter Lily in later years. and to add to the confusion it also appears Spencer George would reverse his Christian names as the cemetery listing in Adelaide it is under George
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Thankyou John yes I have a lot of snippets of info I have gleaned from trove on both the Wallis and Knight families wonderful resource that is
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Yes thankyou Judith that is Spencer the younger whom Mary later married...Spencer the elder was on board the Belgic with Mary and her daughter Lily
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1919
From that marriage certificate, who did the bride and the groom name as their fathers (and groom's mother too) ... and who were the witnesses? That information may well help you to sort out any connection between Spencer the elder and Spencer the younger.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=369921.0
http://www.jaunay.com/bdm.html
Wise words from another well respected RChatter re WA BDM documentation : http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=781914.msg6365472#msg6365472
WA marriage INDEX 1919
WALLIS Spencer G Male
KNIGHT Mary Female
Perth District
Ref No. 1054
JM
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Nothing to help there and a census search has not turned up anything, one came from Pembury Kent the other South Lopham Norfolk
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Does anyone know what shipping records might be available to check between Fremantle and Adelaide for the years 1919-1924 we’d like to know if Mary accompanied Spencer to SA or if we can track the 3 children that were sent interstate
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JJ.
"...or if we can track the 3 children that were sent interstate".
Does the 3 children you are looking for interstate include the child Ruth?
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Yes Ruth Elizabeth bn 1908
Marjorie Grace bn 1912
Stanley George bn 1916 were the 3 sent interstate.... Ruth apparently was with her father when he died in 1924 in SA, she also married there but the other 2 married in Victoria.....but I don’t know if she travelled over with him or came later....my main objective is to find Mary Wallis, to assertain whether she went to SA with Spencer George and when he actually went to SA
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Just a thought…
If you know where George Spencer Wallis was buried in 1924 (South Australia) you can contact the cemetery and see if they have a record of who the grantee of his grave was at the time.
If it was his wife, Mary Wallis, this could suggest she may have been there at the time, conversely if it was his daughter Ruth, or somebody else, this could suggest Mary Wallis may not have been there.
When Ruth Elizabeth Wallis married in 1926 (South Australia) there is a record of her foster parents.
Have you followed up that avenue at all as there may be some record somewhere mentioning Ruth's parents.
From the engagement notice, although unclear, it could be construed that Mary Wallis was not at the
wedding of Ruth in 1926.
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A Mary WALLIS, (Anglican faith) was buried in Plot B3.77 of Coolgardie Cemetery on 6th November 1954. No further information available. A DC may provide further useful data.
Edit:
Reread original enquiry and noted you were aware of death location. Hoping my input advances your search.
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I know who Ruth’s parents were it is the second wife I am trying to locate, I’m trying to find out her whereabouts between 1919 ( when they married) and 1954 ( when she died in Coolgardie) and whether or not there were any more children ....After Spencer’s first wife died the 4 children from that marriage were put into an orphanage then 3 were sent interstate to foster care Spencer then remarries but turns up dead 5 yrs later in SA but we don’t know what happened to Mary. We don’t know when, how or why Spencer went to SA nor do we know whether Mary accompanied him All we know is Mary lived for a number of years in Coolgardie before her death in 1954. I have been in contact with Ruth’s granddaughter on Ancestry and she was unaware of the second marriage.