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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Merionethshire => Topic started by: Commissioner on Friday 18 August 17 16:18 BST (UK)
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I am trying trace more information on Griffith Thomas born 1794 baptised at Llandrillo Corwen
Father Humphrey Mother Jane. He had 3 children Robert born 1826, Mary born 1824 & Elizabeth born 1834 and mother was given as Margaret. I cannot find their marriage in Wales but found a Griffith Thomas & Margaret Evans marrying 1825 at St Botolph Aldgate, London, England. I can only trace Griffith on the census 1871 at Cerrig Llwydion with his son Humphrey & his family and his death in June 1871 and I think Margaret died 1862. I have found a Griffith Thomas in 1861 living with a Mary Thomas b 1793 and grandson John Jones born 1856 I am in the mind to think Mary should read Margaret, any suggestions Thanks
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Hi
Welcome to rootschat
Is this Griffith & Humphrey in 1871 :-\
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:V5PT-RKN
Humphrey & his family in 1861
RG09/4308 f43 p16
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Possibly Humphrey's baptism
Humphrey Thomas
17 September 1826
Llandrillo, Merionethshire
Parents Griffith & Margaret
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He had 3 children Robert born 1826, Mary born 1824 & Elizabeth born 1834 and mother was given as Margaret.
Where were these children baptised
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Thank you Rosie99 the children were all baptised at Llangar parish of gwyddelwern and the address given was Cerrig Y Llwydion Cynwyd
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Thank you Rosie99 the children were all baptised at Llangar parish of gwyddelwern and the address given was Cerrig Y Llwydion Cynwyd
HI, and welcome to Rootschat, Humphrey has mother as Margaret Evans father Griffith Thomas occ Labourer residence Cerrig Llwydion, Cynwyd 1826, so when was Robert's baptism?
Same residence:-
Mary 14th September 1828
Elizabeth 16th March 1834
Keyboard86
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Humphrey son of Griffith was baptised at Llangar 1826. Sorry it should have been Humphrey not Robert.
Is it possible that the person who took the 1841 & 1851 Census for Gwyddelwern Cynwyd Fechan and Cynwyd-Fawr, Corwen, Merionethshire, put down the wrong surname as I found a Griffith Humphreys married to Margaret and a son Humphrey all living a Cerrig Llwydion
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Humphrey son of Griffith was baptised at Llangar 1826. Sorry it should have been Humphrey not Robert.
Is it possible that the person who took the 1841 & 1851 Census for Gwyddelwern Cynwyd Fechan and Cynwyd-Fawr, Corwen, Merionethshire, put down the wrong surname as I found a Griffith Humphreys married to Margaret and a son Humphrey all living a Cerrig Llwydion
OK let's go with that, although the chances of an enumerator getting it wrong on two census returns is highly unlkely, was the 1851 the one with an Evan Thomas Humphreys b 1838?
Keyboard86
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Griffith Humphreys - didn't you say his father was called Humphrey? Might be one of those remnants of the patronymic naming convention used in Wales
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Griffith Humphreys - didn't you say his father was called Humphrey? Might be one of those remnants of the patronymic naming convention used in Wales
OK this is the family Humphreys in 1851 I have found, is this the one you have located?
Griffith 56
Margaret 57
Humphrey 24
Evan Thomas Humphfreys 13
Margaret Price 10 Nephew??
HO107/2509/172/18
Keyboard86
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Keyboard86 yes it is the one with Evan Humphreys b 1838. I have looked for Griffith Thomas on the census before 1871 and have not found him.
Mabel Bagshaw I presumed Griffiths parents were Humphrey and Jane, what brought me to that conclusion was Griffiths son Humphrey had a daughter Margaret who married a Robert Evans and they had a daughter Ada who was my Nian (grandmother)
Rosie99 yes it is him
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Thank you Rosie99 the children were all baptised at Llangar parish of gwyddelwern and the address given was Cerrig Y Llwydion Cynwyd
HI, and welcome to Rootschat, Humphrey has mother as Margaret Evans father Griffith Thomas occ Labourer residence Cerrig Llwydion, Cynwyd 1826, so when was Robert's baptism?
Same residence:-
Mary 14th September 1828
Elizabeth 16th March 1834
Keyboard86
Hi again, so the Humphrey above has mothers given name as Margaret Evans, what happened to Mary 1828 and Elizabeth 1834 and now the baptism of Evan Thomas Humphreys c 1838?
Keyboard86
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Keyboard86 I do not know they seem to have disappeared there is a possibility Mary could be in service or they could have died
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It does look possible that the patronymic form Griffith Humphreys is used in the 1841 and 1851 censuses with Griffith Thomas being used from the 1861 census onward.I don't know if there is a precedent for this.Griffith Humphreys in 1851 and Griffith Thomas in 1861 are both listed as "limer",but the wives appear to be different(?)-Margaret in 1851 is listed as born Gwyddelwern,Merionethshire and Mary in 1861 as Llanfihangel,Denbighshire.It is this that needs resolving to be sure.
There is Evan Thomas Humphreys(b.1838) in 1851 who may incorporate this duality.I think he appears in 1861 as Evan Thomas,also a limer, at RG09/4308/45/19.I believe his sister,Elizabeth is on the same page,having married a RIchard Jones in 1854.The John Jones(grandson)may be theirs.
Regards
Roger
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Hi that marriage of Elizabeth Thomas looks good:-
9th December 1854 Corwen
Richard Jones 23 Father John Jones
Elizabeth Thomas 21 Father Griffith Thomas, one of the witnesses was a Mary Thomas who made her mark
Keyboard86
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Thank you that looks interesting, I have found searching the 1851 census with Griffith Humphreys that the Margaret Price down as Niece was baptised March 17 1841 and the entry reads Margaret illegitimate daughter of David Price and Margaret Thomas so I then looked for a Margaret Thomas being born in Corwen and I have found a Griffiths Thomas with a Margaret Davies and they had 3 children Jane Thomas born 1815, Margaret Thomas born 1817 & Mary born 1820, it makes you think if Griffith was a jack the lad
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Hi again another possible marriage:-
David Griffiths 23 Father Edward Griffiths
Mary Thomas 28 Father Griffith Thomas
Witnesses ? Jones and Margaret Thomas
20th March 1858 Corwen
Keyboard86
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Thank you, you are having more luck than me. It is nice to build up a picture what happened to them all.
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Hi again in 1861 we have:-
David Griffiths 29
Mary 32 b Gwyddelwfrn
Edward 2 b Gwyddelwfrn
David 0 b Gwyddelwfrn
Census ref RG09/4308/44/18
Keyboard86
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Thank you Mary lived till 1908, in the 1891 census she was down as a pauper and in 1901 she had her daughter Mary living with her.
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Hi Commission, I have read with interest your posts of 2017 of Griffith Thomas and his wife. Griffith is the father of Humphrey Thomas who married Elizabeth Lloyd. Humphrey and Elizabeths daughter Margaret Thomas b 1854 Cynwyd married Robert William Evans b 1854-55. It is with their son Robert William Evans b 1875 Cynwyd died 1913 Senghenydd who married Emma Coleman that we are linked.
I have not been able to find the family of Joseph Evans and his wife Ann Williams and only in the early stages of establishing the Thomas, Lloyd and Humphrey families. Cheers Kay Parsey