RootsChat.Com
General => The Common Room => Topic started by: chatterer on Thursday 17 August 17 22:39 BST (UK)
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Not normally a fan of Lulu but loved, loved, loved this episode. Maybe because her ancestors are from my home town and many families were affected by this religious divide.
Hope I've posted this in the right place.
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I also really enjoyed this episode. Lulu's family shares a lot in common with my Glaswegian ancestors.
My great-grandmother was born illegitimate and was adopted. She was raised by a family until one day her mother came back for her. This was very distressing for her, not only because she lost the family she grew up with, but her biological mother was not very good to her.
The circumstances behind all this has been lost to time, or so I thought until I watched this programme. That register at the Mitchell Library which recorded the adoption of Lulu's mother, were those kinds of records kept in the 1890s/1910s?
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Ticked a lot of the wrong boxes - focussed on 1 person, too recent, finding out things that were already known (the Boston/Hamburg red herring), crying - but I also enjoyed it.
Oh, unlike other years, WDYTYA threads appear to need to be in The Common Room. This'll get moved at some point, I expect
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I'm not usually a fan of Lulu, to over dramatic, but I thought she came over quite well in this.
I did think her cousin could have told her about the grandfather being sent off to America and working his way back to UK though.
The one thing this programme did was make my husband interested, yippee!
His roots are N. Ireland, catholic mother, prod father and he remembers running down the road to watch the Orange marches at aged 6/7. Not being allowed to cross the Falls Rd. So although not Scottish roots similarities and has now said well perhaps we could look in to his family.
So thank you BBC we might have a convert!
Caroline
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I enjoyed it. Lots of familiar sights for a start. I did get a little distracted by the researcher being called Norrie as I started wondering if we were related.
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I too enjoyed it. Becoming more interested by the surname Cairns - the first sighting of my fathers family from Ireland c 1845 - a Michael Cairns in Glasgow :o
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The very one I really wanted to see, I missed it, forgot about it >:(
Was there any mention of the surname Boyle?
I knew someone with that surname who claimed to have been a cousin (I think), it was over 20 yrs ago but would have loved to have found out ::)
Annie
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Hi Annie
No mention of the surname Boyle but the show only focused on that of her Grandparents Hugh Cairns and Elizabeth Darling Kennedy and of Lulu's mothers early life in Glasgow.
EDIT: And that of her Gt Grandmother Helen R Kennedy a leading member of the Glasgow's Ladies' Orange Lodge
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Thanks Claire,
Just googled Lulu...she's changed her name ::)
Reading between the lines there wasn't much story line so I didn't miss much ???
Annie
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They didn't look at many people Annie but it was quite a story. I think it really illustrated well that genealogy is about more than just getting their names and showed different ways you could potentially find out about our ancestors lives.
Although I did laugh when they said "between the wars marches could be a flash point for fights", was thinking just between the wars?
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The very one I really wanted to see, I missed it, forgot about it >:(
It's repeated on Wednesday at 23:45 (25 mins later in Northern Ireland).
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They didn't look at many people Annie but it was quite a story. I think it really illustrated well that genealogy is about more than just getting their names and showed different ways you could potentially find out about our ancestors lives.
Although I did laugh when they said "between the wars marches could be a flash point for fights", was thinking just between the wars?
I agree. Not a massive fan, so I was expecting to be a bit bored, but not so, I found it really interesting. Anna
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EDIT: And that of her Gt Grandmother Helen R Kennedy a leading member of the Glasgow's Ladies' Orange Lodge
It was Helen Orr Kennedy, rather than R
https://billiongraves.com/grave/Helen-Orr-Kennedy/19774998
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StevieSteve - I shall report your findings to the leading genealogy site that provided me her name :)
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I started off interested as I thought they were going to discover somebody who had been a mystery/gone missing .... but then it seems the aunts/uncles/cousins knew the story all along anyway!
So that spoilt it for me as then it became pointless/boring.
It was nice to find the grandmother was buried with the great-grandmother - and nice for her to see the stone. But it seemed to me the family knew the story.....
I think they probably just did her story because "It's got Scotland in it .... we've not done much Scotland, or Orange stuff before have we...." so just became a tick-box diversity criteria choice.
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REALLY enjoyed this one ... comes down to; don't mess with Lulu LOL.
Seeing shock on her face when she should about all the prison time must be our faces when we find such things ...
Glad she had a positive end to her search.
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Thanks Claire,
Just googled Lulu...she's changed her name ::)
Reading between the lines there wasn't much story line so I didn't miss much ???
Annie
Must admit Annie I was not keen on this one ::)
Rosie
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I wonder what the relationship between Lulu's grandmother (Elizabeth) and great-grandmother (Helen) was - Helen came across as quite formidable, certainly very strong in her convictions with her involvement in the Orange Order. What must she have thought of her daughter's relationship with Hugh Cairns (considering the issue of the two religions) and the life that Elizabeth had to endure with Hugh's criminal history and time spent in jail?
After watching so many other participants of this programme crying over the lives of sometimes very distant ancestors, it was understandable that Lulu got so emotional over what had happened to her own mother. What a pity her mother never learned what Lulu found out in her lifetime.
I have to say, though, that one aspect of the programme did make me angry - when filmed talking to camera in the taxi/car on two occasions, Lulu was not wearing a seatbelt!
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Good afternoon,
I thought this was goi g to be good but no it got very boring. Going over stuff that it appears the family knew anyway. The only bit that really got my attention was the connection to the Orange Order with GGrandmother being top dog.
That got me thinking, was she the one who paid up all the fines for her SiL on the QT. Wouldn't want the stigma of that going about. Bad enough that he was catholic without being a bad un as well.
But all in all not very good compared with earlier ones.
John915
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I really enjoyed Lulu's family story.
The "mixed" relationship of Hugh and Helen would have been truly shocking to both Catholic and Protestant families , friends & neighbours in 1920s Glasgow. With his poor work record, scar and offending/ prison time, Hugh was hardly an ideal catch.
I felt Lulu was genuinely moved and appalled by some of the information she gleaned. When she broke down in the Mitchell Library after reading out comments about her mother in the register of "fostered" children , I felt for her.
Wonder where Helen had disappeared to? Suppose that will never be known :-\ :'(
Looby :)
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My they dragged out that story ! could have condensed it into 20 minutes , everything just seemed to go slow, not one i would watch again :)
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I enjoyed this episode a lot. I particularly liked the Register of foster care.
What I found hard to believe was her grandfathers work history.
He seemed to get re employed by same firm over and over again, despite his prison history.
I could understand the Protestant versus Poor Catholic, its no wonder both families were against such a marriage. Surprised at the Women having their own Orange Lodge
When Lulus grandmother disappeared, I think she was in a Psychiatric Hospital.
She may have had a breakdown. The grandmother was caught in a very tough situation.
Large family of young children and a husband that was in & out of prison and work.
JFCH
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I liked it.
I thought that although the family knew something of the story they didn't know the reasons and the revelations were heart breaking. The family probably wouldn't have accessed the Foster Care Register and read those remarks - it was the particular terminology that brought the tears.
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it was just an OK one for me... didnt stretch out far enough.. 2 gens not sufficient ... cos I am greedy.
xin
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I thought this was quite a good one.... it pointed up how often half-known "facts" build up in a family history. I also found the Orange Marches thing interesting in general, as in Lancashire an ancestor of mine was probably one who marched, and another one may well have been on the other side!
This series does seem to have been better than the preceding one.
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I've just watched it on catch up and also really enjoyed it.
I liked the going into detail about Hugh and Helen's life together. Like some other people, I also wondered if Helen had a breakdown, perhaps severe Post Natal Depression or was ill following complications from childbirth. It would certainly explain why only the baby had been taken away from her siblings.
It was quite amazing that, when she came out of Central Station, nobody shouted out "Awright, Lulu, hen! Gonnae gie's a song?" And she ditched the tinted reading glasses after realising there was no sun to block out in Glasgow.
Sarah
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I confess that when she said something like "It makes me so angry", I wanted the historian to say, "Does it make you want to shout?"
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I confess that when she said something like "It makes me so angry", I wanted the historian to say, "Does it make you want to shout?"
;D ;D ;D
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Anent the Springburn locomotive works, the fact that tradesmen were largely Protestant was due to apprentices being taken in "by the hand!" i.e, their fathers/brothers were tradesmen there before them. This was general in the railway workshops until recent times.
Skoosh.
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It's repeated on Wednesday at 23:45 (25 mins later in Northern Ireland).
Thanks KG, Looking forward to it!
The "mixed" relationship of Hugh and Helen would have been truly shocking to both Catholic and Protestant families , friends & neighbours in 1920s Glasgow. With his poor work record, scar and offending/ prison time, Hugh was hardly an ideal catch.
Oh yes Looby......A crime worse than murder that would have been so I guess it's a true saying, 'Love conquers all' ;D
Annie
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In north Lancashire people used to say "She/he turned, you know" when one partner in a mixed Protestant/Roman Catholic marriage changed to the other's Church. Usually it would be the Catholic partner's Church which would perform the marriage ceremony, the Protestant partner having had to sign a document promising not to marry again in a Protestant church or have another civil ceremony. He/she would also have to promise to bring up any children as Catholic. To avoid this people would get married in a registry office, but of course this would not be recognised by the RC Church.
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Glasgow expression. "He/she jumped the dyke!" ;D
Skoosh.
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Glasgow expression. "He/she jumped the dyke!" ;D
Skoosh.
Possibly from the Dutch?
In English we say "jumped out of the frying-pan into the fire".
The Dutch equivalent is "to jump over the dyke into the sea"! ;D
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He/she would also have to promise to bring up any children as Catholic. To avoid this people would get married in a registry office, but of course this would not be recognised by the RC Church.
My husband had to do this when we got married, only 5 years ago! (mixed marriage lol)
I enjoyed this episode actually even though I'm not a fan of lulu normally. I'll even forgive her tears as it was actually about her mother - not a distant ancestor who she had never heard of until 3 hours ago.
Lisa