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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Perthshire => Topic started by: Curlea on Tuesday 25 April 17 00:57 BST (UK)

Title: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Curlea on Tuesday 25 April 17 00:57 BST (UK)
I'll start by saying that I'm a newbie, so apologies straight up if I'm not doing this correctly.

My GGG James Gow emigrated to Launceston in 1855 from Scotland, d 1890 aged 66 (hence dob approx 1824). Married Elizabeth Blamey in Edinburgh 17/6/1851 (she from Cornwell). He was a plasterer in Australia and I have found a James Gow in the 1851 census in the same Parish he was married in, as a mason, 27 years old born in Creif.  Searching the SP database there is also another James Gow 27 Living in Edinburgh from Creif who was a soldier - hence my uncertainty with his parents.

I think that he is the son of Angus and Janet Alexander DOB Feb 1824 (in the parish of Alyth) as Angus Gow (born in Blair Atholl i think) was also a Mason. Help with this would also be appreciated.
My reason is that a Jean Alexander is listed in the 1841 census with a James Gow (15) as a Mason's ap, so I am thinking that he is living with his grandmother and thus the reason that I think his parents were Angus and Janet.

Any help with this would be most appreciated.
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: maddys52 on Tuesday 25 April 17 04:06 BST (UK)
Hello Curlea and welcome to rootschat!

Is this the death of your James GOW? died 1890 in Tasmania.
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article39556164

and
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article150353567
says native of Perthshire

Do you have a death certificate, or a marriage certificate which might have the names of James parents?

Added: I'm not sure what information would be included on the death certificate, but the marriage certificate should show fathers' names and occupations.

Added again: Oh sorry, just realised you said they were married in Scotland in 1851, so before compulsory registration there  :-[.
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: maddys52 on Tuesday 25 April 17 04:26 BST (UK)
I also notice on his arrival in 1855 he gave his age as 27, so born around 1828. Ages are often very fluid!
(looking on the Tasmanian names Index https://linctas.ent.sirsidynix.net.au)

Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Curlea on Tuesday 25 April 17 08:04 BST (UK)
Thank you Maddys52 for your prompt reply!

I do have the extract from the parish register of St Cuthberts and it notes James as a plasterer and Elizabeth as being from Cornwell (Blazey) and her father was the late James Blamey - a copper miner. Nothing about James parents.

Yes the news article is about James. I also noted the difference in the age from the immigration record, but ultimately thought that the death notice was more accurate. I don't have the actual certificate.
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: ev on Tuesday 25 April 17 08:26 BST (UK)
Hi all .

Found this , although it does not have further information -
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/results?count=20&query=%2Bgivenname%3Ajames~%20%2Bsurname%3Agow~&collection_id=2125029



ev
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Curlea on Tuesday 25 April 17 08:31 BST (UK)
Thanks Ev I'll add this to my collection.

I've pretty much established him from this end (Australia). Im really having the most trouble/certainty at the Scottish end.  Or should I say the Scottish beginning!
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Millmoor on Tuesday 25 April 17 08:47 BST (UK)
Hi

The James Gow you have identified as a soldier in Edinburgh in the 1851 census age 27 b Crieff would appear to be married to Cathrine and with a 10 month old daughter, Isabella. It looks like Cathrine, Isabella and two further children are recorded as living in Crieff in the 1861 census.

You may find it useful to look at Freecen where the 1851 census for Midlothian has been transcribed. There is a record showing for a James Gow age 25 b Comrie, Perthshire and a plasterer - address 23 West Richmond Street.

William

Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Curlea on Tuesday 25 April 17 08:59 BST (UK)
Thanks William, I think we have a match!
That's his address on his marriage record.

:)

Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Curlea on Thursday 27 April 17 07:58 BST (UK)
Hmmmm, now I'm in trouble. ???

The only birth I can find in Comrie is for a John Gow. 6/11/1825



Does anyone have any suggestion or magic links which might help me here?
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Liviani on Saturday 29 April 17 23:25 BST (UK)
There is a James Gow born Crieff on 10th Feb 1822 in Crieff to James Gow and Ann McGregor?

Crieff and Comrie are VERY close to each other which could explain the discrepancy?
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Liviani on Saturday 29 April 17 23:29 BST (UK)
Also note that the ages in the 1841 census aren't accurate for anyone 15 or over as they tended to round them.

Other people living with James Gow in the 1841 census;


Name   Age
Jean Alexander   70
James Alexander   35
James Gow   15
Cherry Gow   14  (see below re Cherry)
David Laing   25


 
Quote from: Curlea on Tuesday 25 April 17 00:57 BST (UK)


I think that he is the son of Angus and Janet Alexander DOB Feb 1824 (in the parish of Alyth) as Angus Gow (born in Blair Atholl i think) was also a Mason. Help with this would also be appreciated.
My reason is that a Jean Alexander is listed in the 1841 census with a James Gow (15) as a Mason's ap, so I am thinking that he is living with his grandmother and thus the reason that I think his parents were Angus and Janet.



Found the following on SP

GOW
CHRISTIAN
ANGUS GOW/JANET ALEXANDER
0
23/11/1826
328/
60 36
Alyth

This could be the 'Cherry' listed in the 1841 census and potentially James' sister.

Also

GOW
JAMES
ANGUS GOW/JANET ALEXANDER
0
02/02/1824
328/
60 25
Alyth

It looks like he was born in Alyth and not Crieff or Comrie?

I think given the fact Angus and Janet had a girl called Christian (this is a common alternative to 'Christina' she is listed as a girl on SP births) and later appears at the same address named 'Cherry Gow' as James in 1841 that James born in Alyth in 1824 is the correct one.

Given that Christian/Cherry was born in November she would've turned 15 in November 1841. Census would've been taken in March or April so she would've been 14 on the date it was taken. I think this is the one you're looking for.
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Curlea on Sunday 30 April 17 06:01 BST (UK)
Thanks Liviani,

It is certainly a little cryptic. I originally thought that I had the correct James Gow, starting with the 1851 census which had him as a mason (thinking it was similar to a plasterer) and thus my subsequent research led me to Angus and Janet as his parents.

However, William pointed out another James Gow in the 1851 Edinburgh census who was in fact a plasterer (his occupation in Australia). This James Gow was also living in the same street which is listed on his marriage certificate. He was born in Comrie. So as I do not know the area, I'm not sure if I can still claim that they are his parents... The birth cert I have for James Gow born 2/2/25: Parent Angus from Little Bamff - again not sure where this is.

The 1841 James Gow living with Jean Alexander was a mason's apprentice and this is also raising a red flag, so again I am unsure.

I really appreciate your assistance with this!
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Skoosh on Sunday 30 April 17 06:56 BST (UK)
There must be a family tree for Neil Gow the Atholl fiddler?

Skoosh.
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: isobelw on Sunday 30 April 17 09:06 BST (UK)
According to the 1841 census transcription on freecen the 14 year old female was Christy ( not Cherry) which would certainly be a diminutive of Christian.
Isobel
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: isobelw on Sunday 30 April 17 10:57 BST (UK)
Crieff and Comrie are quite far apart. I think it is more likely that James belongs to one of the Gow families having children in Comrie in the 1820's and that his birth/baptism just hasn't been recorded. There is an 1841 census entry in Comrie for a John ( age 55) and Cecilia (age 50) who have a 14 year old son called James ( NB surname transcribed as Gorn on Ancestry).
Isobel
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Millmoor on Sunday 30 April 17 11:48 BST (UK)
I agree with Isobel. Do you know the names of all of James's children as there might be a naming pattern worth exploring? As suggested earlier I think it would be worth obtaining his  Tasmanian death cert. as this is the most likely source of finding parents names.

William
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Liviani on Sunday 30 April 17 17:17 BST (UK)
Quote from: isobelw on Sunday 30 April 17 10:57 BST (UK)
Crieff and Comrie are quite far apart. I think it is more likely that James belongs to one of the Gow families having children in Comrie in the 1820's and that his birth/baptism just hasn't been recorded. There is an 1841 census entry in Comrie for a John ( age 55) and Cecilia (age 50) who have a 14 year old son called James ( NB surname transcribed as Gorn on Ancestry).
Isobel

I'd have to agree with Isobel here. This does make sense.

I think the 1841 census with John, Cececilia and James is worth exploring.

The following marriage record is showing on SP. They married in Comrie and are still there (or returned to there) by the 1841 census.

GOW
JOHN
CICILIA CAMRON/    (Probably Cameron)
17/06/1810
341/
20 462
Comrie

The John Gow in 1841 was living in Drummond Street, Comrie and his occupation was Tailor.

EDIT:

I've found the same family in Comrie in the 1851 Census on FreeCen (Comrie isn't available on FreeCen for 1841 at present).

It shows a daughter Cecilia which IF these are the same people you're after that there possibly was some form of naming pattern used for this family.

Piece: SCT1851/341 Place: Comrie -Perth Enumeration District: 1
Civil Parish: Comrie Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: Comrie
Folio: 0 Page: 8 Schedule: 36
Address: East Comrie

        
Surname       First name(s)       Rel       Status       Sex       Age       Occupation       Where Born       Remarks   
        GOW       John       Head       M       M       70       Master Tailor        Perth - Comrie           
        GOW       Cecilia       Wife       M       F       64               Perth - Crieff           
        GOW       Cecilia       Dau       U       F       24       Formerly Serv At Home        Perth - Comrie           
        MCARTHUR       Jane       Grndau       U       F       2               Perth - Comrie           
    
       

On searching SP for births to John and Cecilia (with various spellings) in Comrie between 1810 (date of their marriage) and 1830 I only get 3 births pop up.

GOW
JANET
JOHN GOW/CILIA CAMRON
0
14/11/1811
341/
20 322
Comrie

GOW
CATHRINE
JOHN GOW/CICILIA CAMRON
0
07/06/1814
341/
20 332
Comrie

GOW
ALEXANDER
JOHN GOW/CECILIA CAMERON
0
03/01/1829
341/
30 31
Comrie


Notice the huge gap in years between 1814 and 1829 and the lack of Ceceilia's birth record also. This indicates that they didn't register any births between the birth of Catherine in 1814 and the birth of Alexander in 1829. Given that James appears as son in the 1841 census and the lack of birth record available for James (and his sister) that this could be them?
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Curlea on Tuesday 02 May 17 13:59 BST (UK)
Oh thank you everyone, this is great!

James's first son was John and he also had a daughter Cecilia.

This is something I will definitely follow up on. I really appreciate all the trouble you have gone to.

  :)
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: Liviani on Tuesday 02 May 17 15:04 BST (UK)
Quote from: Curlea on Tuesday 02 May 17 13:59 BST (UK)
Oh thank you everyone, this is great!

James's first son was John and he also had a daughter Cecilia.

This is something I will definitely follow up on. I really appreciate all the trouble you have gone to.

  :)

Brilliant! This indicates a form of naming pattern in the family then. Cecilia isn't an overly common name so it's looking promising!

Glad to have helped!  ;D

Jill
Title: Re: Do I have the correct James Gow?
Post by: warikl on Wednesday 01 November 17 11:50 GMT (UK)
Hi Curlea

I only came across this thread today.  James Gow was my GG Grandfather, and I do have a fair amount of information regarding him and his family in Launceston. I of course would like to share this with you if possible. Perhaps you could send me a private message?

Regards

Warik