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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Yorkshire (West Riding) Lookup Requests => Yorkshire (West Riding) => England => Yorkshire (West Riding) Completed Requests => Topic started by: hauxworth on Sunday 05 February 17 18:28 GMT (UK)
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There's two John & Ellen Hauxworth families, from Ilkley/Austby, that I've reached a dead end on.
The first is finding info. on the father of the 4 yrs young John Hauxworth.
Here: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MQPL-K4L (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MQPL-K4L)
I believe this to be John Hauxworth and Ellen (nee Barraclough) but not 100% sure.
(I think father John died in 1837 & that's why he's not @home in the '41 census above?)
1) I'm looking for any birth, parent & family records for young John's father, John (b. 1800 I think). Any help pls.?
The second is the same young John Hauxworth & his wife Ellen (nee Tinker) m. 1858 in Leipzig?!
By 1861 they're both back home in Yorkshire, with Dresden born daughter Anna, and living next to Ellen's folks in Northowram.
Here: [ broken link removed ]
2) How and why did John & Ellen get to Saxony to get married?
See this record: [ broken link removed ]
Any help with the parents/family/birth of John Hauxworth Sr., and also his son John's travels to Dresden/Leipzig is muchly appreciated. Thanks!
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I haven't given the Saxony question any thought, but I can get you a bit further with Austby. (Not a place I often see mentioned here: some relatives of mine by marriage lived there in the 20th century, and I grew up in Ilkley.)
The Ilkley parish registers (at Ancestry) have a burial which looks like it matches:
3 Jul 1837 - John Hauxworth of Austby aged 45 years, and in the last column, instead of the vicar's name, is "Papist".
There are a number of other Hauxworth/Hawksworth burials too, but I only looked at the image for this one, which struck me as probably being of some interest:
11 May 1883 - Ellen Hauxworth of West Terrace, Ilkley aged 76 years - "A Papist: Without the Service of the National Church"
There was a Roman Catholic congregation at Myddleton Lodge, just a few fields away from Austby, so that might be worth looking into, though RC records and research are mostly outside my experience. Anyway, I hope this bit helps.
Arthur
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I've been giving a bit more thought to the Hauxworths in Austby, and have found a number of references to them in "Ilkley: Ancient and Modern" by Robert Collyer and J. Horsfall Turner (Otley, 1885), which was (is?) regarded as the standard history of the town. You can find this online at https://archive.org/details/ilkleyancientmo00collgoog
It's probably worth doing your own searches, but when I looked for Austby, the results included these references to the Hauxworth family (page numbers as printed in the book):
p.171 - a memorial in the parish church
p.218 - a pedigree (acknowledged to be partial, and it stops before the dates you've mentioned)
You can also read about Middleton Lodge on p.273 (Middleton and Myddleton are variant spellings). And while browsing, I came across quite a few Hauxworth references in the section on churchwardens' accounts and other parish papers on pp.180-194.
Happy hunting!
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Thanks Arthur.
Yeah I think too that the death years you mention for John and Ellen (nee Barraclough) are correct. Didn't know that they were Papists tho' (as the lineages in Collyer's Ilkley are!). I'd assumed for some reason that my Hauxworths weren't RC. Not sure why?!
Thanks for that day/month detail - not available from familysearch.
I've read through Collyer too. Awesome! And yes, the pedigree stops short! I think my Hauxworths were too 'poor & insignificant' to be included in the book. Poor in as much as I can't see them (as mentioned in Collyer) buying a church pew.
Interesting to note the two Hauxworth/Hawksworth farming familys in Austby in 1841.
Here: [ broken link removed ]
Also, the next John & Ellen (nee Tinker) I'd assumed to be too poor to purchase travel tickets to Saxony/Dresden.
Your discovery of John Hauxworth & Ellen Barraclough being RC is food for thought.
Cheers!
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Still no clear idea about why they married in Germany, although a lot of German immigrants came to Yorkshire to work in the textile trade, so it may be that there was some two-way traffic. I can't properly make out John's occupation in 1861, but it seems to involve machinery, so maybe he was over in Germany buying or learning about power looms or similar for a company back home.
I haven't been able to find any other index with details of the marriage, but with the information from FamilySearch it should be possible to order a certificate, which hopefully might contain a few clues. There's information about certificates for overseas marriages among the FAQs at https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/most_customers_want_to_know.asp#Overseas
You say that John and Ellen senior were poor, but I'm not so sure. The 1841 census shows Ellen as the farmer at Low Austby, and I think the 4 or 5 people listed immediately after her household would have been farm workers living somewhere on the property and employed by her. She certainly appeared to be more than a labourer herself. Having said that, I haven't found any record of a will for either of them.
Do you have any other census returns that might help? I've just found Ellen senior with daughter Phebe in Ilkley in 1881, but I couldn't find them in 1851.
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Interesting about them not being 'so poor'. There's certainly this from 1871 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/KDZ5-429 with her being retired and looking after two kids?!
Also Ellen's father, William Barraclough, was a wool merchant. I wonder if it was a sheep farm?
John junior's 1861 occupation would have been a Machine Overlooker. I thought [from lotsa reading up] that had meant overlooking the kids to work hard and be on time but.... as you imply, overlooking the machinery itself I hadn't considered.
Why would Ellen Tinker, a Wool Carder's daughter, go with the younger John Hauxworth to Germany? Just musing! The oddest I'd surmised was this Law Times Report from 1870: [ broken link removed ]
& oddly enough, on the marriage cert. [ broken link removed ] Urbigan is mentioned as Ellen Tinker's incorrect birthplace! Also their daughter Anna Marie [my ggrandma] was born in Uebigan?!
And yeah, Ellen and Phoebe are quite trackable right thru to Phoebe's institutionalization in 1911. As you bring up, there was always the question in my mind of how Ellen and Phoebe got by....
1851: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/SP9V-FP4
1861: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MWM4-SHR
1871: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/KDZ5-429
1881: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/Q27R-85CF
But, nothing on 'not so poor' father John Hauxworth's origins prior to 1800 can I find.
Also interesting the observation you make on Ellen's 1841 household laborers..
So, now they're rich and catholic. Hah!! Maybe Ellen Barraclough's family had the do-re-mi? Ach!
Thanks for stretching my mind on this!
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There's quite a lot to respond to here...
William Barraclough:
A wool merchant would have been quite wealthy in those days, since it was the basis of much of the booming economy in Yorkshire. There was, incidentally, a firm of weavers in Otley and Bradford called Duncan, Barraclough and Co, but as Barraclough is quite a common name in Yorkshire, there won't necessarily be a connection.
The Ilkley economy:
"Pre-Victorian Ilkley 1672-1811" by May F Pickles (Mid-Wharfedale Local History Research Group, 2002; ISBN 0 9533693 1-5) says, "Most farms were relatively small... The pattern of farming was primarily based upon stock rearing and feeding with more farmers keeping cattle than sheep." (p.13)
Later she notes the beginning of a textile industry, though it never developed into anything very significant: the parish registers of 1725 refer to Nicholas Cunliffe (** see below), a worsted weaver, and then "In 1786, William Middleton of Stockeld Park leased land known as Kilner Croft to Thomas Hauxworth of Ilkley, a gentleman [and two others] for the purpose of erecting a stone-built mill..." (p.16)
Urbigan:
What caught my eye in the Times law report was the reference to Mr S.C. Lister. This will be Samuel Cunliffe Lister, a massive and controversial figure in the Yorkshire textile industry. There are plenty of references to him online, but this one seems relevant, and mentions the Warburton case:
https://bradfordunconsideredtrifles.wordpress.com/manningham-mill-people/
The case has also been mentioned before on RootsChat:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=276216.0
The Warburton partnership was intended to devise a silk-combing machine, and it appears Warburton baled out before it succeeded. But it may well be that John Hauxworth the younger was in Urbigan in connection with that enterprise. Ideally you'd need to look into whether there were any other Yorkshire companies doing business there at that time.
Anyway, I would recommend that you try to get hold of the actual marriage certificate for John Hauxworth and Ellen Tinker, rather than rely on the version at FamilySearch, since that appears to have confused the residences and places of birth, and it may contain other clues.
As to why the marriage took place there, I'm wondering if it was some kind of elopement because of real or imagined parental disapproval. For example, they could have been of different social class or different religion, or associated with rival companies.
Samuel Cunliffe Lister:
I can't really go into him in detail here, but very briefly, he came from the Cunliffe family of Addingham (2 miles upstream of Ilkley, and more or less within spitting distance across the river from Nessfield and Austby), and one family member took the name Lister on marriage.
(** see above) Collyer's book has a Cunliffe pedigree (p.203) which, as well as several Addingham conections, includes a Nicholas Cunliffe 1703-1771. I've skimmed through the Ilkley PRs and can confirm that he seems to be the one mentioned above, but the earliest worsted weaver reference that I noticed was at the burial of a daughter in Sep 1726. He also had a son Henry who married Martha Hawksworth in 1770, but she died the following year. (See also text on p.202 and note at foot of Hawksworth pedigree on p.218.) There's also a mention of the Lister family on p.216.
The Cunliffe Lister family had several mills in and around Bradford, and also developed Low Mill in Addingham. (Warburton was also involved there, apparently.) There are a number of references to the family and their influence on Addingham in "Addingham - A History" by Kate Mason (Addingham Civic Society, 1996).
In view of all this, it seems possible that the Austby Hauxworths might have been distantly related to Samuel Cunliffe Lister. Even if not, I do wonder if at least some of the Hauxworths worked for Lister in some capacity. More research needed, I think, but I'll leave that to you!
Arthur
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Arthur. Awesome. Thanks bunches!
I guess the 'parental disapproval' line is odd when they returned to Yorkshire and moved in next door.
Here: [ broken link removed ]
Anyways, thanks indeed for all your help. You've twisted my head!
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I guess the 'parental disapproval' line is odd when they returned to Yorkshire and moved in next door.
Here: [ broken link removed ]
It might have been the Hauxworths who disapproved, rather than the Tinkers - particularly if the Hauxworths were of higher class. But even if it was the Tinkers who had been against it, when presented with a fait accompli they might have changed their minds rather than cut off their daughter. A little granddaughter might have helped too.
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I guess the 'parental disapproval' line is odd when they returned to Yorkshire and moved in next door.
Here: [ broken link removed ]
It might have been the Hauxworths who disapproved....
You mean like as in a not-so-poor Papist widow, named Ellen Hauxworth (nee Barraclough), for example?!
Also, would this 'Non-Conformist' record https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FWG4-CZN (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FWG4-CZN) imply that Ellen was not RC when born? Ergo, if RC present in the fambly, then it came from the Hauxworth line??
Also interesting to note that none of my Hauworths show in the BMD non-conformist records here http://www.bmdregisters.co.uk/ (http://www.bmdregisters.co.uk/). What does that imply?
And, in an unabashed display of almost total ignorance, what exactly is a conformist?
Tx.
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I'm very sorry - I seem to have missed this reply, or at least forgotten to write my own response.
You mean like as in a not-so-poor Papist widow, named Ellen Hauxworth (nee Barraclough), for example?!
My memory of this thread is a little patchy and I may be confusing the generations, but there could well be some issue relating to religion.
Also, would this 'Non-Conformist' record https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FWG4-CZN (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FWG4-CZN) imply that Ellen was not RC when born? Ergo, if RC present in the fambly, then it came from the Hauxworth line??
These records relate to Dr Williams' Library, which for family history purposes is important because a lot of protestant non-conformist births were registered there, from right across the country. The original records (a registration form and the entry in the register) can be seen at Ancestry, and as well as the information given at FamilySearch, record that Sarah Barraclough (the mother) was daughter of John Hitchen.
Anyway, if Ellen Barraclough had started life as a protestant non-conformist, there may well have been significant family ructions if she'd ended up RC. (This may be where I'm confused about who's who.)
Also interesting to note that none of my Hauworths show in the BMD non-conformist records here http://www.bmdregisters.co.uk/ (http://www.bmdregisters.co.uk/). What does that imply?
Probably that any relevant registers aren't included in that collection. The ones at BMD Registers are mainly (all?) protestant ones, so I'm not very surprised if you haven't found RC ones there.
And, in an unabashed display of almost total ignorance, what exactly is a conformist?
Tx.
Ha! In this context, it would mean a member of the Church of England, though it's never used like that. Those who belonged to other denominations were often called 'dissenters', though these days 'non-conformist' would be more usual. Whatever term was used, it was often prefixed with 'protestant', to differentiate them from RCs.