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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cheshire => Topic started by: RobinRedBreast on Wednesday 27 July 16 11:51 BST (UK)
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Hello there,
William Henshaw was one of my 4x Great Grandfather's. He Married Elizabeth Griffiths in 1835, at Stockport Parish Church. His Father was a Henry Henshaw. William was a Blacksmith.
Sometime in 1836, he set up "The Stockport Lurry Works", with his brother Thomas, who was a Wheelwright. The company was very well known in England at the time, and also even abroad.
Anyway, William was a member of something called the Oddfellowes Society. Stockport Heritage Museum, have a Pocket Watch that was presented to William in 1838, by that Society. I found out yesterday, after visiting my Mum's Cousin, that there is quite a lot of writing on the back of the Watch, from a photograph she had taken. It says:
"Presented by the King William IV Lodge, no. 736, of the IOFMU, to William Henshaw, Prov G M, for his gratuitous and worthy services, September 22nd, 1838".
I have found out that this lodge was established at Bramhall, in 1833, and was part of the society's Handforth District. Also William would have been Provincial Grand Master (Presiding Officer) of the district.
But can anyone please tell me what the "IOFMU" on the back of the Watch stands for? :)
Thank you very much. ;)
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From Google it is likely to be:
"Independent Order of Oddfellows, Manchester Unity",
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_Order_of_Odd_Fellows
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_Order_of_Oddfellows_Manchester_Unity
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From Google it is likely to be:
"Independent Order of Oddfellows, Manchester Unity",
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_Order_of_Odd_Fellows
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_Order_of_Oddfellows_Manchester_Unity
Thank you. :) ;)
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Independent Order of Odd Fellows, Manchester Unity confirmed.
William was the brother off my great great grandfather Thomas Henshaw, and together they founded and ran the Stockport Lurry Company.
Thomas Henshaw, and his son, my great grandfather Henry Henshaw are buried in St Thomas's Church, off Wellington Road South (the A6) in Stockport.
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I've been trying to rack my brains to remember where I found out that Lodge no.736 of the Oddfellows Society was formed in 1833 at Bramhall. I think it came from the Stockport Heritage Library, but not too sure. :)
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I think William's Pocket Watch is in the possession of Stockport Public Library. I have an image of it, revealing it to be a beautiful watch, with the coat of arms of the Odd Fellows Institute on the face. It is the old kind of watch that came with its own key to wind it up. There was an image posted on the internet, from where I was able to download it. The link was HTTP://WWW.GMMG.ORG.UK/OUR-CONNECTED-HISTORY/ITEM/POCKET-WATCH/ but it no longer opens up.
However I copied the information that came with it. It seems it was manufactured by Nathaniel Dumville. I tried to post an image of it here but it refused to allow the .jpeg image I created. If there is anyway I can contact you I can send you my original image.
"Nathaniel Dumville
circa 1838
Silver pocket watch and key presented to local blacksmith, William Henshaw, for his service to the Oddfellows Society in 1838.
The watch is a beautiful example of local craftmanship created by watchmaker Nathaniel Dumville. The Dumville’s were a family of watch and clockmakers. Nathaniel Dumville was based on Lower Hillgate in Stockport. Near the site of his shop there is a small alley way called Dumville Brow.
The recipient, William Henshaw, came from Cheadle Hulme, Stockport. William came from a family of blacksmiths and wheelwrights. Around 1836, William and his brother Thomas founded The Stockport Lurry Works on Wellington Road South, Heaton Norris, Stockport.
The Oddfellows Society have been a friendship club for over 200 years. They provide advice, benefits and support for those in need."
I have traced down the descendants of William Henshaw and Elizabeth Griffiths, through his son James Henshaw and his wife Sarah Potter, and his daughter Nelly Henshaw and her husband Herbert Newsome, and his daughter Maria Henshaw and Samuel Pennington. It seems he had about eight children, one of whom George Owen Henshaw we mentioned before, who was in the army and died at sea off South Africa.
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Thanks Colin,
I just re-discovered the link to the Watch here, via the Wayback Machine:
https://web.archive.org/web/20140417021005/http://www.gmmg.org.uk/our-connected-history/item/pocket-watch/
https://web.archive.org/web/20140417110236/http://www.gmmg.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Pocket-Watch-web.jpg
:) ;)
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Many thanks for the links. I've saved them for future reference.
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Have you managed to tie down exactly where the Stockport Lurry Works was located? I appreciate you say Wellington Road South, Heaton Norris but there lies the problem.
Wellington Roads North and South (built in 1824/1826) meet where they crosso the River Mersey - the old boundary between Lancashire and Cheshire. Heaton Norris (Lancashire) is north of the river whereas Stockport (Cheshire) is south of the river so the Lurry Works must have been located on WRN, HN or WRS, S and can’t be WRS, HN.
I suspect that the watch will now probably be located at Staircase House in the Market Place.
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University of Leicester Special Collections On-line - History Gazeteer & Directory of Cheshire 1850
Wheelwrights - image 312 - Thomas Henshaw, 58 Wellington Road North.
http://specialcollections.le.ac.uk/digital/collection/p16445coll4/id/304287/rec/2
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Hello there,
The Lurry Works were located on Wellington Road North, Heaton Norris.
In the 1841 census, Thomas Henshaw and his brother William appear to be living next door or very close to each other at Wellington Road North.
This 1841 census comes from Ancestry.
At the top of the image page it states "Borough of Stockport. Township of Heaton Norris." -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/8978/images/LANHO107_581_582-0598?pId=6240605
The enumerator's schedule from image p.1 of that census states that it was in the county of "Lancaster (Lancashire)." -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/8978/images/LANHO107_581_582-0588?pId=6240605
William and Thomas are also listed at Wellington Road North on p.149 of Pigot & Slater's Directory from 1841. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/3145/images/0000cayz?pId=37868194
My 3x great grandmother Maria was baptised (surname written down as "Henshall" on the register) on the 25th of May 1845, at Tiviot Dale, Wesleyan Chapel. It gives her birth date on the baptism as the 27th of March 1845, and her abode as "Wellington Road North." -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/3758/images/41501_605905_0657-00022?pId=318111
It gives her surname as Henshaw on the GRO index, and later census and other records. -
HENSHAW, MARIA Mother's Maiden Surname: GRIFFITHS GRO Reference: 1845 J Quarter in STOCKPORT Volume 19 Page 257
Fast forward to the next census in 1851, and William and Thomas Henshaw were still living at Wellington Road North.
William Henshaw was living at number 56. His brother Thomas was living at number 58. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/8860/images/CHSHO107_2155_2155-0440?pId=12697989
The "Description of Enumeration District" from image p.1 of that census states:
"All that part of the Heaton Norris Ward in the township of Heaton Norris in the borough of Stockport which is comprised in the following boundary....."
Under "County and Parliamentary Division" it again says "Lancaster (Lancashire)." -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/8860/images/CHSHO107_2155_2155-0405?pId=12697989
William died in 1854. I think he died at the home of his brother Thomas, because the burial register gives his abode as 58, Wellington Road North. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/2963/images/40364_633870_2778-00078?pId=1637612
His wife Elizabeth (nee Griffiths) was buried on the 27th of September 1859, and it does give her abode at burial on the register as 56, Wellington Road North. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/2963/images/40364_633870_2771-00043?pId=1090987
His son James Henshaw (1839 - 1895) had taken over the business. At sometime before the 1871 census, the Lurry Works had moved to 68, Wellington Road North. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/7619/images/LANRG10_3656_3658-0052?pId=9722117
James Henshaw died at 68, Wellington Road North, on the 23rd of December 1895.
The Lurry Works kept the name of "James Henshaw" even after James died. I have two photocopied advertisements which bear his name, one from 1899 and one from 1905, both from newspapers. Both state it was established in 1836.
There is a photograph here from the Stockport Image Archive titled Premises of James Henshaw, Wellington Road North. -
http://old.stockport.gov.uk/sia/?accessionno=30074&picResultsNo=15#picInfo
There is also this description from a newspaper:
"James Henshaw, builder of tradesman's vehicles, etc, of the Stockport Lurry, Cart, and Van Works, Wellington Road North, has been established since 1836, and he is noted for his first class work...." -
Manchester Courier & Lancashire General Advertiser, Friday 3rd of September 1909.
William Charles Henshaw (1865 - 1940), son of James, took over the business of his father.
In the 1911 census, he was at 68, Wellington Road North. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/2352/images/rg14_21409_0063_03?pId=5177732
He was still at this address when the 1939 Register was taken. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/61596/images/tna_r39_3948_3948c_026?pId=24010654
So the Stockport Lurry Works were certainly on Wellington Road North, and not Wellington Road South.
Unfortunately this information here about it being on Wellington Road South, is wrong. -
http://www.cheadlehulme.net/village/chhenshaw.html
But the following is what I get a little confused about:
When did this area become part of the county of Cheshire, and not part of the county of Lancashire?
If anyone can view these links on Ancestry, the 1911 Census for 68, Wellington Road North, gives the address at the top (in Ancestry's data description at least) as Stockport, Cheshire .Or have I got this wrong did it not at all?
Thank you. :) ;)
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University of Leicester Special Collections On-line - History Gazeteer & Directory of Cheshire 1850
Wheelwrights - image 312 - Thomas Henshaw, 58 Wellington Road North.
http://specialcollections.le.ac.uk/digital/collection/p16445coll4/id/304287/rec/2
Thank you. :)
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William Henshaw lived at 56, Wellington Road North, while his brother Thomas (my great great grandfather) lived next door at 58, Wellington Road North. The Stockport Lurry Works was located next door to a timber yard on Wellington Road North between Church Road and Wyatt Street, just north of a pub, the Railway Hotel that is still standing.
William is buried in Christchurch Cemetery, where I found his grave, and that of his daughter Maria. Also found was the grave of James Henshaw and his wife Sarah.
Best wishes,
Colin.
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Kay Brown's identification of the Stockport Lurry Company on Wellington Road South is definitely wrong.
http://www.cheadlehulme.net/village/chhenshaw.html
Colin.
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When did this become part of the county of Cheshire? - a simple question to ask - I once worked this out but I’ve forgotten the exact answer!
I think the simple answer is that it never has. The historic boundary between Lancashire and Cheshire is the River Mersey, upstream as far as the River Tame and then along that river (there is some didpute as to where the Mersey starts but that’s for another time).
As the area north of the river began to urbanise, the area became part of the Heatons Norris Council and later subsumed into Stockport Borough Council. Stockport always referred to itself as being in Cheshire but after taking over the Heatons area, part of it was within Lancashire. It continued to remain “within” Cheshire until it became a Metropolitan Borough, as part of Greater Manchester, between 1974 and 1986.
As I said, I’ve forgotten the exact dates; I must work it out again! The other thing which causes confusion is St Thomas’ church. There is the one you refer to here and a much earlier one (much altered) on the A6 in Heaton Chapel.
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That's more or less the situation - there's a detailed Wikipedia article here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaton_Norris - which outlines the chronology; I'm assuming its right!
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Yes, I confirm that. Heaton Norris was transferred to Stockport in 1835. Traditionally, the boundary between Lancashire and Cheshire was the River Mersey, which was a boundary extending back into Saxon times, between the kingdoms of Northumbria and Mercia, (though it did fluctuate) and possibly between pre-Roman conquest Celtic kingdoms. The source of the Mersey is the confluence between the River Tame and the River Goyt, underneath the M60.
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When did this become part of the county of Cheshire? - a simple question to ask - I once worked this out but I’ve forgotten the exact answer!
Stockport always referred to itself as being in Cheshire but after taking over the Heatons area, part of it was within Lancashire.
Yes this part does confuse me (not coming from the area myself), when on Ancestry you see some people who have put people in family trees birth places down as "Heaton Norris, Lancashire," and others have it as "Heaton Norris, Cheshire." Thank you. :) ;)
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His son James Henshaw (1839 - 1895) had taken over the business. At sometime before the 1871 census, the Lurry Works had moved to 68, Wellington Road North. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/7619/images/LANRG10_3656_3658-0052?pId=9722117
OR:
Were they always at the same address, but the street numbers just got re-arranged after the 1861 Census, and before this 1871 Census?
I can't seem to find a 56, or a 58 Wellington Road North in the original images for this 1871 census on Ancestry.
Incidentally, in this 1871 Census a few doors down from James was Robert Harlow, the famous Brass Founder and his wife Emma, at 44 Wellington Road North. The numbers on this original image on Ancestry go from 44 Wellington Road North, at the top of the page, then 46, and straight to number 64. -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/7619/images/LANRG10_3656_3658-0051?pId=9722086
Emma (nee Kinch 1830 - 1889), was the second wife of Robert Harlow. She was a niece of William Henshaw, born in 1830 from William's older sister Mary (1800 - 1850), and her husband John Kinch. She married Robert Harlow on the 1st of December 1864 at Ashton Under-Lyne.
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The source of the Mersey is the confluence between the River Tame and the River Goyt, underneath the M60.
That’s what they’d like you to think but where’s the evidence? If you look at earlier maps - pre circa. 1880 - the Mersey is formed by the confluence of the Goyt and the Etherow.
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When did this become part of the county of Cheshire? - a simple question to ask - I once worked this out but I’ve forgotten the exact answer!
Stockport always referred to itself as being in Cheshire but after taking over the Heatons area, part of it was within Lancashire.
Yes this part does confuse me (not coming from the area myself), when on Ancestry you see some people who have put people in family trees birth places down as "Heaton Norris, Lancashire," and others have it as "Heaton Norris, Cheshire." Thank you. :) ;)
Post 1835, it should be Heaton Norris, Stockport; although there are still people in some parts of Stockport that think they still live in Cheshire
I remember once describing a house in Heaton Moor as “being of little archirectural merit” to which the owner responded that his house had “once been featured in Cheshire Life”. I refrained from telling him that it had never actually been in Cheshire!
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When did this become part of the county of Cheshire? - a simple question to ask - I once worked this out but I’ve forgotten the exact answer!
Stockport always referred to itself as being in Cheshire but after taking over the Heatons area, part of it was within Lancashire.
Yes this part does confuse me (not coming from the area myself), when on Ancestry you see some people who have put people in family trees birth places down as "Heaton Norris, Lancashire," and others have it as "Heaton Norris, Cheshire." Thank you. :) ;)
Post 1835, it should be Heaton Norris, Stockport; although there are still people in some parts of Stockport that think they still live in Cheshire
I remember once describing a house in Heaton Moor as “being of little archirectural merit” to which the owner responded that his house had “once been featured in Cheshire Life”. I refrained from telling him that it had never actually been in Cheshire!
Haha! The plot thickens!
Thank you. :) ;)