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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Devon => England => Devon Lookup Requests => Topic started by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 13:18 BST (UK)

Title: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 13:18 BST (UK)
Good afternoon

I am trying to find any information (Birth etc) on a Owen Braund born between 1869 and 1871 and most likely in Tavistock, Devon

On his marriage certificate 4 April 1894 in Plymouth he is aged 23 and a seaman and his father is listed as William Braund and a soldier

He is a brickwall, so any information would be appreciated

regards
Sammie

PS Have found him only on the 1901 and 1911 census's and cannot find his birth on FreeBMD :(
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: Milliepede on Saturday 21 May 16 15:26 BST (UK)
What exact birthplace does he have on the census you have found?

If his father was a soldier he may have been born abroad  :-\
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 15:32 BST (UK)
1901 and 1911 show two different places Tavistock on one and Plymouth on the other

Cannot find his father on any census's but do not even know his birth year yet

Sorry cannot be much more help than that :(
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: Milliepede on Saturday 21 May 16 15:33 BST (UK)
No luck with births so maybe we could find his father William - there is this marriage in Tavistock Sep 1856 which may or may not be him.

Braund William
Down Richard
Reddicliff Sarah Ann
Wilkins Elizabeth

Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: DOB7 on Saturday 21 May 16 15:34 BST (UK)
He was baptised at Tavistock 16 Dec 1869 son of Selena BRAUND, residing in the Union House (workhouse). In 1871 he appears to be shown as Owen BRAN aged 3 born Plymouth.
In 1891,  shown in Plymouth is an Owen HONNER, 21 living with Sarah HONNOR 80, described as her son which seems unlikely. A couple of dwellings away is a John HORNER and his wife Selina, born Lifton - may just be coincidence.
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 15:41 BST (UK)
I found the Owen Bran on 1871 in Plymouth too and thought it could be, living with John Stanbury and his wife and as a "nurse child"

Which got me thinking that they may have known the family and maybe his father William was pretty young when he fathered Owen and the family shipped Owen out so to speak ?

Many thanks on the Selena information, thats great stuff :)

Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 15:43 BST (UK)
DOB7 would you happen to have something on the baptism you can attach for me so I can have a look. Feeling quite excited now :D
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: DOB7 on Saturday 21 May 16 15:48 BST (UK)
I think Selina was only about 14/15 when she had Owen. No father's name is given on the baptism. Unusually for a workhouse birth there doesn't appear to be a birth registration for him.
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: Milliepede on Saturday 21 May 16 15:49 BST (UK)
Sarah Horner is, I think, married to John in 1881 a fish dealer.

Possibly the John Horner married to Selina was their son so Owen was technically a grandson - maybe!
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 15:52 BST (UK)
Owen Braund does become a fish dealer himself in 1901 and 1911 and is listed as a seaman on marriage cert :D :D :D happy happy

Thank you ladies xx
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: DOB7 on Saturday 21 May 16 16:19 BST (UK)
Here's some more. I noted that on Owen's marriage cert, one of the witnesses is Sarah Kate MENHENITT. She is the wife of Thomas MENHENETT - they married in 1881. William John DEACON (your Owen's wife's father) was a witness at the wedding. Thomas' father is also a Thomas.
In 1853 a Selina MENHENICOTT was baptised at Plymouth, dau of Thomas & Jane.
In 1858 a William Thomas MENHINNICK, son of Thomas & Jane was baptised. So it is possible that Thomas 1858 and Selina 1853 are brother and sister. Sarah HORNER (HONNER) would be the mother of John HORNER - Selina's husband.
In 1901, Owen & wife are living at William John DEACON's house, and a boarder is a Frederick MENHENNITT.
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 19:30 BST (UK)
The mystery continues with Owen's mother Selina Braund :)

1861

She is listed here with her parents William and Mary Ann

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/8767/DEVRG9_1460_1464-0944?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fsearch%2fdb.aspx%3fdbid%3d8767%26path%3d&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnBrowsing#?imageId=DEVRG9_1460_1464-0985

But in 1851 in the same house with her parents William and Mary Ann they are not Braund but Toll and I have found the marriage of William Toll and Mary Ann Blithe in Lifton in 1834

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/8860/DEVHO107_1884_1884-0446?pid=6796733&backurl=http://search.ancestry.co.uk//cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc%3DAep357%26_phstart%3DsuccessSource%26usePUBJs%3Dtrue%26gss%3Dangs-g%26new%3D1%26rank%3D1%26msT%3D1%26gsfn%3Dselina%26gsfn_x%3D0%26gsln%3Dtoll%26gsln_x%3D0%26msypn__ftp%3DLifton,%2520Devon,%2520England%26msypn%3D83137%26msypn_PInfo%3D8-%257C0%257C0%257C3257%257C3251%257C0%257C0%257C0%257C5261%257C83137%257C0%257C%26MSAV%3D1%26msbdy%3D1845%26cp%3D0%26catbucket%3Drstp%26uidh%3Dpq3%26pcat%3DROOT_CATEGORY%26h%3D6796733%26recoff%3D5%25206%26db%3Duki1851%26indiv%3D1%26ml_rpos%3D1&treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=Aep357&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true

How can that be so, why change surname
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: Mabel Bagshawe on Saturday 21 May 16 19:45 BST (UK)
To help those for whom the links won;t work

1861  Lifton, Tavistock (all b Lifton except where stated)

William Braund    53 - b Broadwood
Mary Ann Braund    47
Elizabeth Jenkin    24 - daughter, married
Selina Braund    15
Noah Braund    11
Florance Braund    9
Susan Braund    4
Joseph Braund    11/12

RG 9, 1464, 52, 12

1851 - Lifton

William Toll    45 - b Broadwoodwidger
Mary Ann Toll    39
Harriet Toll    16
Betsey Toll    14
William H Toll    10
John James Toll    8
Selina Toll    5
Noah Toll    3

HO107, 1884, 256, 29

also 1841

William Toll 30
Mary toll    25
Elizabeth Toll   5
William Toll   2

HO107, 232, 9, 13

Not sure yet why the change


Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 19:51 BST (UK)
And on 1871

William (father) is still Braund
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 19:52 BST (UK)
Driving me nuts again, but this is why we love doing this  ;)
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: Kay99 on Saturday 21 May 16 19:58 BST (UK)
This One Name Study may be of interest http://one-name.org/name_profile/toll/   Edit -Includes Toll/Braund of Broadwoodwidger & Lifton

Kay
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 19:59 BST (UK)
Guess I best look for the birth of William Toll/Braund between 1805 and 1810 in Broadwoodwidger to nail him down
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: Kay99 on Saturday 21 May 16 20:10 BST (UK)
I think you have access to Anc - If you go back on this family tree  it would appear the use of both names might have originated from a John Braund marrying a Grace Toll in 1753??
http://person.ancestry.co.uk/tree/29238192/person/12450816925/facts

Kay
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 20:17 BST (UK)
Cheers Kay

Still odd how they interchanged between the surname's but looks now like they are Braund's all along :D
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: DOB7 on Saturday 21 May 16 20:42 BST (UK)
They baptised the children as TOLL though - very odd.
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 20:52 BST (UK)
First time I have witnessed this sort of thing happen
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: sammie on Saturday 21 May 16 21:03 BST (UK)
DOB would you be able to give me christening info for the kids of William and Mary Ann please x
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: DOB7 on Saturday 21 May 16 23:23 BST (UK)
You can look up the indexes for these via FindMyPast or obtain the same from the Devon FHS. http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/indexes.htm
Title: Re: Owen Braund Tavistock
Post by: raa on Wednesday 03 August 16 23:21 BST (UK)
im currently doing research for owens grandaughter feel free to pm me if you would like a chat