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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Aberdeenshire => Topic started by: Emma-Jane on Thursday 17 December 15 10:50 GMT (UK)
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Good morning
I am trying to decipher the place of birth given in the attached record. I have done a search for anything around Aberdeen (the families of Prosser and Jaffray lived around the Tarves, Hatton of Fintray area) but can find nothing close. The second part looks like Craigie...
Would anyone be kind enough to have a look and tell me if it makes sense to you? Apologies for my ignorance, this is a new area of my family I am beginning to search and have not had much experience with my Scottish ancestors, as yet.
My thanks
Emma-Jane
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My OH who is an old Aberdonian - recognises the names of Tarves, Hatton of Fintray and he says there is a "Craigie" "somewhere" out of Aberdeen. The bit before which looks definitely like "Cassieend" to me, he thinks might be an old version of "Causeway End".. and there was/is? a long street of that name in Aberdeen itself - just off George St. (he used to live in Charles St. - which is close)... Is this any help? Or just more confusion? Good luck.
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I suspect it'll be a form of 'Causeyend' or 'Causewayend'.
SNAP maggbill, crossed in the ether...
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Hi Josey,
yes - Snap, it is!! I always run these Aberdeen questions past my OH - he has a great memory - but mind you, the last time he was in Aberdeen was in 1973!! Things might just have changed a bit since then lol!!
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But actually, as road names change & places disappear - it is the old memories that are more useful in this respect. I've looked on the old maps on the nls website, can find a Craigie also a Causeyend both N/NW of Aberdeen. .
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Hello both and thank you!
I was totally at a loss with what that first word might say... now that I have some idea I can scout around and see where it might be.
I shall have a look at the Craigie you mention on the NLS website you mentioned, josey.
My thanks!
Emma-Jane
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From the Spalding Club's "Place-names of Aberdeenshire":
Causewayend, Belhelvie, Fintray, New Machar, Old Machar. Also Calsie Croft, Causewayhill, Causewayshade etc. In practically all cases where causeway (pron. cassie) occurs, the place is upon the the line of one of the old roads at a point where a moss was crossed by a "causeway". For instance, where the old Banff road crossed the moss of Perwinnes at Scotstown Moor; or again, on the Old Deer to Crimond road, where there were the muckle and little causeways of Kininmonth.
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I see from the IGI that' the extract is from the parish of Tarves.
There are various of places called Craigie all over Scotland, and I agree that it looks like Cassieend and could be Causewayend. This, again, is a name that occurs in various parts of Scotland. There are Causewayends in the parishes of Belhelvie, New Machar, Old Machar, Coupar Angus and Muiravonside besides the street of that name in Aberdeen, and there are almost certainly others. Then there are places called Causeyend in Huntly, Fettercairn and Kilmadock
Normally, if the parents of a child whose baptism is being recorded lives anywhere outside the parish, the record will say, '.... in the parish of xxx'. Therefore unless you have very good reason to think otherwise, you are looking for a place called Causewayend of Craigie in the parish of Tarves. It isn't likely to be a street in the city of Aberdeen, which is several parishes away.
In the 1881 census there is a farm in Tarves called Craigies, about a mile south-west of the village, and two houses at East Craigie and one at Craigie Shethin. These last three are north-east of Tarves village, between the ground of Pitmedden House and the River Ythan.
In 1841 there were several household at Craigies, and half a dozen around Craigie.
Purely on the basis that the Craigie ones seem to be more scattered than those at Craigies, all of which seem to be close together, it seems likely to me that Causeyend was among the places named Craigie rather than at the place called Craigies.
I wonder whether any of the Pitmedden Estate records have survived? If so, I think that's your best bet for finding out more about Causeyend of Craigie. It looks as if the University of Aberdeen Special Libraries and Archives has some archives relating to Pitmedden. See https://www.abdn.ac.uk/library/about/special/
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A good place to check is ScotlandsPlaces in the transcribed OS Name Books, seems to be not as well known as it ought to be. There's a Craigie in Tarves: whilst you can search easily, the direct link is www.scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/digital-volumes/ordnance-survey-name-books/aberdeenshire-os-name-books-1865-1871/aberdeenshire-volume-85/71
There is/was a place called Cassiend in/near Old Machar - where the Cassie family lived, here it's obvious that Cassiend is a contraction of Cassie's End. Check out:
https://archive.org/stream/genealogiesofabe00smituoft/genealogiesofabe00smituoft_djvu.txt
I'm not suggesting this is your place, but perhaps if you go looking for Cassie people near Craigie, you might find they lived at Cassieend. The origin of this place seems at least as likely as a contraction of Causewayend.
Also, Cassie stones are the small round pebbles that made up the floors of byres and stables. Causey stones is an alternative - and of course leads to causeway.
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If you go to the National Library of Scotland maps website and look at Roy's Military map from the mid 18th century, Craigie is shown as an area south of Tarves. It has several runrig "fields" and a scatter of buildings.
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Well there are two Craigie's and depending on the map a Carigies in the SW (Forfarian) and Carigie in the NE.
http://maps.nls.uk/view/74400987
http://maps.nls.uk/view/74400157
Roy's map is a bit thin for this parish but then it was mapped a 100 years earlier.
Don
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If you go to the National Library of Scotland maps website and look at Roy's Military map from the mid 18th century, Craigie is shown as an area south of Tarves. It has several runrig "fields" and a scatter of buildings.
The one south of Tarves is labelled 'Craiges' and I think the ornament on that map (the sub-parallel lines) is intended to indicate a hill, rather than strip or runrig cultivation. This is the farm marked as Craigies on the Ordnance Survey maps.
North of Tarves is 'Craigie', which corresponds to the farm still labelled Craigie on the Ordnance Survey maps.
Incidentally I was typing rubbish when I mentioned Pitmedden. The house and estate in question is of course Haddo, not Pitmedden. There are estate records, including tacks and rentals at Haddo in the National Records of Scotland under reference GD33. See http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/search.aspx
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IGI does not seem to have this record, but Scotland's People does. 28th May 1772 at Tarves. Interestingly "Roy Highlands 1747 - 52" has Craigie, not Craigies south of Tarves.
Regards
Malky
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Hi and thank you all so much!
Some of the maps are fantastically helpful in getting an overview of the areas and their boundaries.
I think I might have to take a trip up to Aberdeen to get any further.
I know so little about this part of my family but you have all given me much more of an insight. Thank you again!
Emma-Jane
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I think I might have to take a trip up to Aberdeen to get any further.
Stop in Edinburgh on the way and check the Haddo estate papers there first.
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Hello Emma-Jane,
Aberdeenshire covers quite a large area with places named Craigie/Craigies in more than one parish. You mention the families lived in the Tarves/Hatton of Fintray areas. Was the 'attached record' in your original post found on ScotlandsPeople and, if so, which parish in Aberdeenshire is this record from?
Regards, Dod.
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Hello again Emma-Jane,
Ahhh, I see 'Forfarian' has already answered my question in Reply 7. Think I need new glasses!
Regards, Dod.
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baptised "... May 28th (YEAR?) witness George Argo ..."
I can see a "George Argo, Cairdseat" in the Aberdeen Journal, 19 Dec 1832 and a "George Argo, Tarves" in the 3 Nov 1847 edition.
There's a Cairdseat farmhouse near Ellon.
What was the baptismal year?
As an aside - in a 1946 newspaper article, headed "Family Tree Detectives " it explained how they began with the clue "Causeway end 16 Nov 1719 at Hether Canchrie" and eventually found the birth details under "Cassie-end, Nether Banchory". (Only reference to "Cassie-end " I can spot).
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The year was 1772 and the parish was Tarves.
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Can I ask Forfarian about the Haddo estate records?
Do I have to go to Edinburgh to see any estate records or are there any online?
I am particularly interested in any building plans for Cauldhame and Cauldhame Farm in the parish of Tarves.
Kooky
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If you access the link given by Forfarian in reply #11; put Haddo or Cauldhame in the main search field then put RHP [Register House Plan] in the reference field, you will get numbers & descriptions for all the plans/maps.
The maps/plans are not online but until a few years ago used to be able to be easily viewed at West Register House; things have changed. They can be digitised on request [10 days notice before visit required] & this digitisation viewed at General Register House, Princes Street.
From http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/welcome.aspx
Important information on access to maps and plans (updated September 2012):
Plan access requests should be directed to the Historical Search Room. You will normally be given access to the digital image of a plan in the Historical Search Room, rather than to the original record. For each request submitted only 6 individual plans or 1 bound set of plans (plan book) can be requested at once. Where a plan has not already been imaged, we will aim to make an image available in the Historical Search Room within ten working days of the request being accepted. In certain cases it may also be possible to view a plan remotely on the ScotlandsPlaces website. If we are unable to make a plan available in this way owing to its condition, or for technical, ownership or copyright reasons, it may be possible to inspect the original plan at the Plans facility at Thomas Thomson House, on a Wednesday morning or afternoon, by appointment with the Historical Search Room.
Thomas Thompson House is in Sighthill.
http://www.nas.gov.uk/about/map2.asp
Depending on the deposit conditions and condition of the document, if you view an original map at Thomas Thompson House, you MAY be able to photograph it or if this is not possible you can ask to trace it.
Josey
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Gosh! Thanks Josey :)
Will do as you suggest.
Kooky