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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Kent => Topic started by: rach2413 on Monday 16 November 15 10:34 GMT (UK)

Title: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: rach2413 on Monday 16 November 15 10:34 GMT (UK)
The birthplace is attested on her husband's probate hearing. She married Arthur William HILL in New Zealand in 1902 but there are possible electoral roll listings from 1896 in N.Z. (living alone - no parents) The only birth I have found is 1874 registered in Elham, Kent (index only). I don't know the distance from Shorncliffe. Also, Shorncliffe seems to be a military camp, rather than a township. I may have to get her marriage certificate to find her parents. She was Roman Catholic & her husband must have converted, as they both had R.C. burials. They appear to have not had children ( if Florence pre-deceased her husband, his brother George would inherit). I can't find a HENRY family arrival in New Zealand to match. Any help would be much appreciated!!  Thank you!
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: miriamkinga on Monday 16 November 15 10:45 GMT (UK)
There's a Florence Henry on the 1881 census in Lambeth, London: -

William Henry, 29, corn miller b Kent
Carrie Henry, 30 b Maidstone
Florence, 9 b Maidstone
Louisa 7 b Maidstone

Ref: RG11/583/58/15
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Milliepede on Monday 16 November 15 10:47 GMT (UK)
Yes just about to post that one.  Afraid I don't know where Shorncliffe is either  :-\

Parents are still in England in 1901/1911 - if we have the right family.

William & Caroline have 2 children by 1911 and a grandson age 16 **

** his mother appears to be Louisa sister to Florence
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 16 November 15 11:06 GMT (UK)
In case you haven't found it in the meantime Shorncliffe Camp was near Cheriton, Folkestone, approximately 7 miles from Elham.
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 16 November 15 13:11 GMT (UK)
Florence Edith Henry ( father William  miller) , aged 23 , married 18 Aug 1894 Newington , Surrey,
James Daniel Liberty.

1901 census

Florence E  Liberty b 1871 Maidstone
James Liberty b 1869
Edith L Liberty b 1898 Wandsworth

7 Handforth Road , Lambeth

Looks like this one can be ruled out.
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 16 November 15 17:39 GMT (UK)
This family , travelling to New Zealand in 1878 , looks interesting :

Valentine Henry 37
Maria 35
Jane 9
Edith
Florence 3
James inf.

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FSY1-76F

Valentine Henry had been a soldier , a Sergeant 18th Regt Royal Irish , who served for some time in NZ. ( Service record on FindMyPast ). His trade on the passenger list and service record is shoemaker/bootmaker. He may well have been in Shorncliff but I haven't found anything to confirm.
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 16 November 15 18:53 GMT (UK)
1871 census

Valentine Henry 1839 Ireland Corporal 18th
Maria Henry wife b Ireland
Sarah Jane dau 3 b New Zealand
Edith Mary 1 b New Zealand

address Mount Wise Barracks & Quarters , Stoke Damerel, Devon.

Edith Mary Henry  1868-69 Auckland  p 661 GRO Army Chaplains Birth Indices
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 16 November 15 21:25 GMT (UK)
Not the right time but Valentine Henry was stationed at Shorncliffe in 1861

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7R2-TZ8
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 16 November 15 21:48 GMT (UK)
This document details the locations of regiments in 1875. It says the 2nd Battalion 18th Foot was stationed in Shorncliffe , having returned from Sydney in 1870 :

http://www.cgsc.edu/CARL/nafziger/875DAA.pdf

Whilst it's not possible to say how reliable this list is , it's a clue to the family's whereabouts. A similar list for 1874 puts the regiment at Fort Rowner ( Hampshire).
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: rach2413 on Tuesday 17 November 15 10:58 GMT (UK)
Thank you ALL for your contributions. At present, I am discounting the Maidstone born family, but I've saved the info. in case !  Thank you CB53 firstly for defining where Shorncliffe & Elham are! Comments : I can't find the girl's births in New Zealand. I have tried to find a death for Valentine Micheal HENRY as i'm guessing he died as an infant but no joy so far. I found a possible R.C. baptism for him in Lancashire (mainly in Latin!) & birth 8 July 1862. I don't know about the Father's name but the Mother is Maria. I haven't found the parent's deaths or resting place either - they are not in the greater Wellington area. However he may have gained a fencible land grant, so I will look in the Auckland area tomorrow & do some more searching. I will check for the girl's births in Australia since the Shorncliffe record says they had returned from Sydney. Tomorrow I will look for James'birth. It's not all as clear as YET!! but thanks for the interest & help esp. CB53 !! I am definitely going to have to get that marriage certificate for Florence in due course. Again thank you all for leads thus far ! rach
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Tuesday 17 November 15 11:13 GMT (UK)
Valentine Henry died in Wanganui in 1887. You can read about it here :

http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=WC18870502.2.19&srpos=27&e=-------10--21----2valentine+henry--

Other articles on the same website refer to his having served previously in NZ and his appointment as local drill instructor in the Militia after settling there.

You mention not finding the girls' births in New Zealand. They would most likely have been recorded by the Army Chaplain and not as births of New Zealand nationals - I gave you the birth for Edith Mary in one of my earlier posts. With all the moving about some may not have been registered at all , of course.

All very interesting . I think you will need that marriage certificate to confirm , or the Elham birth certificate for Florence  but that would be more difficult for you. Good luck and do let us know what you discover .

Christine
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Tuesday 17 November 15 11:41 GMT (UK)
I found a possible R.C. baptism for him in Lancashire (mainly in Latin!) & birth 8 July 1862. I don't know about the Father's name but the Mother is Maria.

I think you must be referring to the baptism of Michael Henry 8 Jul 1862 in Liverpool , parents Patritu Henry and Maria Mullen. Patritu is Patrick. I don't think this is Valentine Michael - he was born in Portsmouth , right at the other end of the country.
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Tuesday 17 November 15 11:53 GMT (UK)
I think Valentine Michael may have gone to New Zealand before the rest  of the family :

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FSYV-1TT

This Valentine is the right age and gives birthplace Hants , ie Hampshire - his birthplace on census being Portsmouth , Hampshire.

Also from the Victoria Police Gazette 1888 :

Valentine Michael Henry , late of Wanganui , was telegraph operator but went to sea , wanted at home where his mother is dangerously ill. 23 Mar 1888

Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Christine53 on Tuesday 17 November 15 13:02 GMT (UK)
I've found Valentine Henry junior in the Liverpool Asylum for the Infirm and Destitute in Liverpool, NSW, Australia :

Valentine Henry 33 RC , single , miner admitted 22.12.96. discharged 18.5.97., Notes : no friends, no means;
family mentioned : sister Edith Hill , Wellington; sister Florence Henry Wellington; parents Valentine Henry, soldier, and mother Maria Kelly.

Note there is a word under the heading 'how discharged' which may say Disc(for discharged) , but it could be Died - not sure .
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: Top-of-the-hill on Tuesday 17 November 15 22:51 GMT (UK)
    Shorncliffe camp was probably in the Elham registration district - Folkestone certainly was.
Title: Re: Parents of Florence HENRY born Shorncliffe England @ 1875
Post by: rach2413 on Wednesday 18 November 15 10:49 GMT (UK)
Thanks heaps CB53 - from the Police gazette clue, I found her (Maria's death) on 3 April 1888 - no clue whether son heard in time. As you suggested, once i had the Wanganui lead, I found quite a bit more about Valentine. I wouldn't have known that Hants was Hampshire either! Thank you!

 Thank you too, Top of the Hill - your guess has proved correct !

I've got plenty more to go on with - thanks again !!