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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: bluenoserhoosier on Saturday 10 October 15 03:54 BST (UK)
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Hi all,
I am relatively new to rootschat.
I am researching my great-grandmother, Edith Annie Veitch, who was born in the Morpeth Union Workhouse in 1875 to an Elizabeth Veitch (father name not given on birth certificate).
I am wondering whether any records were maintained at the workhouse itself that might help me learn more about Edith's birth and mother.
I have come across the 1881 census information for the workhouse but was specifically wondering if the institution itself maintained any records.
Many thanks
Bob F
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Peter Higginbotham's website is a good place to start to find out more about workhouses (in general and for a particular place).
This link should take you to the Morpeth page. It says that very few local records survive, and unfortunately these seem to be later than the period you are interested in. You could contact the depository (Northumberland Collections Service at Woodhorn - follow the links) for more information about what does survive.
http://www.workhouses.org.uk/Morpeth/
I note that an Edith Annie daughter of Mary (sic) Veitch was baptised in Morpeth 21 September 1875, no father mentioned. Something of a co-incidence that there were two illegitimate babies called Edith Annie Veitch born in Morpeth in 1875. As you have a birth certificate, I presume there is an error in the baptism transcript I viewed.
You could ask Woodhorn whether any records of bastardy bonds/maintenance orders survive for the period, in case an order was made against the alleged father.
Have you investigated the Arkless and Purdy members of the 1881 census entry (Gateshead), where Edith Annie is a boarder in the Arkless household? Is there a connection?
Do you have mother and/or daughter in later census years? Does Elizabeth marry? if so, the marriage certificate should give her father's name (unless she was also illegitimate).
Is your Edith Annie the one who marries in Gateshead in 1893? Does the marriage certificate have any clues e.g. did she give a name for her father? are the witnesses related to her?
Good luck
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Forgot to add that www.familysearch.org has an Elizabeth Veitch, Single, 25, father James Veitch marrying a Henry Storey, Single, 25, father George Storey in Morpeth 14 October 1876.
This couple is in Middleton in the 1891 census. Henry consistently gives his birthplace as Elsdon, NBL. Elizabeth's birthplace is given as Scotland, in 1891 & 1901.
I haven't found a link, so I just mention them, to keep in mind, as you continue to look for ways to find out more about Edith Annie's mother.
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Hi Bob,
How are you?
Remember we have been in contact before elsewhere re Edith being taken in by part of my Purdy Family.
Trish :)
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Thankyou SelDen for the reply....yes my Edith Annie Veitch is the same as the person married in Gateshead in 1893 to John Thompson. On the marriage certificate, she lists her father as Henry Veitch (deceased). His occupation was listed as 'game keeper'. Interestingly, there was a Henry Veitch listed in the 1881 census for Morpeth Union Workhouse as an inmate at the institution. He was aged 80 at the time. I am not confident this information is accurate as it would have been supplied by my G-Grandmother.
The oral history of the family passed down is that Edith was born to very young unwed mother who gave her up at birth. Edith was taken in by a family of Purdys in Morpeth. To your Arkless reference, the connection is through the Purdy line. As I recall, Margaret's sister Annabelle married an Arkless.
Hi Trish....great to reconnect..yes she was taken in by Margaret Purdy and raised as her own...the curiousity for me in that is that Margaret by that time, was a widow on her own with 4 or 5 children to raise...so why take in another? Not sure if I'lll ever get to the bottom of it but am hoping to learn more.
Thank you all
Bob
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Hi Bob and Trich
Have you delved further to see if Margaret Purdy has a family connection to Edith?
Was Margaret Purdy previously Robson and did she marry John Purdy in 1854 (St Nicholas, Newcastle upon Tyne ) ? If so, do either of you know if she was single when she married or have the marriage entry/cert?
There is an unmarried Margaret Robson who is a niece in the household of John Hunter, inn keeper, in Morpeth in 1851, but born Newcastle. This household also has an Arkless niece so I had wondered if this was the future Margaret Purdy? This would mean the Margaret Veitch marrying a Robson in Newcastle in 1850 can't be her.
Another line of enquiry is to seek to eliminate the Elizabeth Veitch who married Henry Storey in 1876, given that she is in the right place at the right time.
Btw, did you see that Edith is visiting Margaret in Dunstan in 1891? indexed as Veith and Rudy respectively which is understandable looking at the image.
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My most plausible connection between Margaret (Robson) Purdy and Edith Annie Veitch may in fact be the Morpeth Union Workhouse.
In the 1841 census for Morpeth I had previously come across the following:
Bridge St Ann Robson Age 35
Margaret Robson Age 17
While the age doesnt match to what has been previously suggested (Margaret being born abt 1830),
this could be the connection as to why Margaret Robson took in Edith Annie Veitch. By the address of Bridge Street and the large number of people listed, I am opnly left to speculate that Margaret's mother, Ann, was a resident of the workhouse when Edith Annie Veitch was born there......its a long shot but underscores how little success I have had in making connections.
I do suspect there must have been some sort of family connection between Margaret and Edith Annie for her to take her in, given her own situation.
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One other add....
I do have Margaret Robson as the daughter of Robert Robson and Margaret Bell...I suspect this is correct as their other daughter, Annabella Robson, married Thomas Arkless....which Margaret and my Edith appear on later census records
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I find it very interesting that Edith Annie said her father was Henry Veitch, Gamekeeper. It was not uncommon for illegitimate children to adapt the details of a stepfather (or sometimes a grandfather etc).
The Elizabeth Veitch who married in Morpeth in 1876, as per my earlier post, married Henry Storey, who was a gamekeeper at the time of the 1891 census. Not concrete evidence, but v interesting.
I did consider whether Edith might have been placed with Margaret Purdy as a nurse child by the poor law authorities, particularly as Edith is described as a boarder in 1881. However, Edith would have been the responsibility of Morpeth, not Gateshead, where Margaret was living by then.
You can confirm the name of Margaret's father by getting her marriage cert, unless perhaps Trich already has this as part of her Purdy research. I would keep digging for a relationship connection, quite possibly along the female line.
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That is a very interesting point about Elizabeth Veitch and Henry Storey.....I totally agree that it is likely my G-grandmother modified names....when she ultimately left her husband (John Thompson) in Gateshead and moved to Canada, she eventually remarried....on that marriage certificate, she listed her maiden name as Purdy.
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I had already investigated the Purdy and Robson Families and could see no connection to the Veitch's.
I will be off-line for a couple of days but will go all over it again and post here if I find anything by Tues.
Trish :)
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Hi Trish,
I have submitted a research request to the Northumberland Archives in hopes they can review the bastardy bonds/maintenance/appeals against bastardy orders relating to Edith Annie Veitch...I'll let you know what I hear once I get their completed research
Bob
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Excellent idea Bob :)
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Hi Trish and SelDen,
I wanted to update you on my efforts on the parents of Edith Annie Veitch and the Purdy connection.
SelDen, I was able to secure a copy of the marriage certificate of Henry Storey to Elizabeth Veitch and to my surprise, Margaret Purdy was listed as a witness to the wedding. I think this cannot be coincidence. I am therefore inclined to believe that the Elizabeth Veitch who married Henry Storey is the same Elizabeth Veitch who was listed as Edith Annie Veitch's mother on her birth certificate. I am also in support of your suggestion that on Edith's marriage certificate of 1893, the registrant (or Edith) entered the father's name incorrectly....it should have been Henry Storey.
The mystery deepens however as in the 1881 census, Henry and Elizabeth are listed, their daughter Edith is not (as presumably she was taken in by Margaret Purdy by this time) however, there is a son, Edward, listed as having been born in 1874...the year prior to my great-grandmother.
While I am no closer to understanding what the family connection between these people and Margaret Purdy was....I feel I have a clearer picture of who Edith's parents were....I wanted to thank you both for the suggestions and comments. Its been very helpful. My research continues! Bob
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Hi Bob
Sorry it has taken me so long to notice your last post.
Great news re the marriage certificate and what a stroke of luck that Margaret Purdy was one of the witnesses. Who was the other witness?
I don't think we can assume that Henry Storey was Edith's father, although he may have been. The fact that Edith seems to be with Margaret Purdy suggests otherwise, but then there is the older brother Edward...hmmmm!
I feel sure that there is a family connection with Margaret Purdy of some kind, notwithstanding that Trish has previously looked for one. Do either you or Trish have Margaret Purdy's marriage certificate? I suppose it is also possible the connection is with Henry Storey rather than Elizabeth Veitch.
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Sorry Bob that I havent replied but for some reason I did not get notice of your posting on 7 Jan.
Let me look over this again and get back to you.
Trish :)
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There seems to be quite a contrast between Edward & Edith Annie.
A possible birth registration for Edward - poss the most likely Veitch or Storey candidate on www.freebmd.org.uk ?
Henry Edward Veitch Sep quarter 1873 Alnwick
He then appears as Edward Storey in 1881, with Henry & Elizabeth Storey & may be the Edward Henry Storey who marries Margaret Jane and turns up in Northumberland as Storey in later censuses. Can't see him as Edward Veitch but may have missed him.
By contrast Edith Annie does not seem to turn up in the records as Storey at all, and has not been found living with Henry & Elizabeth (I suppose she could have done so between census years). This of course is not proof, but at this stage I would keep my mind open to the possibility that perhaps even if Edward was the child of Henry, Edith Annie may not have been.
I noted earlier that Elizabeth Veitch's place of birth was Scotland in 1891 & 1901. In 1881, however, it is given as Berwick, Northumberland. In 1911 it is further south than that.
The birth of an Elizabeth Veitch is registered in Berwick in 1847 - can't see a later one in Northumberland in the right time period. Perhaps she knocked a few years off, perhaps she really was born in Scotland (you can check Scotland's People - baptisms for RC & Church of Scotland only as Scottish civil registration did not start until 1855) or perhaps she was registered under another name.
You could also see if anyone is researching Edward, as they may know something about the origins of both children.
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Familysearch has the 1854 Marriage of John PURDY and Margaret ROBSON.
Fathers THOMAS Purdy and ROBERT Robson
I dont have the Cert SelDen as I am not descended from John but from his Brother James born 1828 too Thomasms Purdy and Jane Reid.
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Thanks Trish.
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Hi SelDen,
You have done a lot of work on this and I agree with everything you say.
Cheers,
Trish :)
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Thank you for your responses and the suggestions.
I have made fairly good progress on Elisabeth Veitch - having found , ordered and received her birth certificate, her marriage to Henry Storey, as well as her death certificate.
Elisabeth was born March 28, 1851 , Beaumont Hill, Paston, Kirknewton Parish, Northumberland co, the daughter of James Vaitch and Mary Vaitch formerly Ewart. Interestingly on the 1851 census for same, I found the family but Elizabeth was listed as Mary....the family was listed as LEITCH. Mary is listed as 1 month of age on the census. My suspicion is that when the census was taken, the newborn had not yet been named as there was one month between her birth on Mar 28 and the registration of her birth on Apr 28...
I also have found the family in each census up to and including the 1911 census. The death of Mary Vaitch (Elizabeth's mother) aligns to the 1861 census which shows James as widower - Mary died in 1858)
Elizabeth was married to Henry Storey on Oct 14, 1876 - both were listed as age 25. Henry's occupation was listed as Mason. Both from Morpeth. Henry's father was listed as George. Elizabeth's father as James. Oddly though, ELizabeth's father, James is listed as a Farm Labourer (deceased).
Witnesses to the marriage were Margaret Purdy and MaryAnn Botter (sp?)
I also have the death certificates for both of Elizabeth's parents - Mary Vaitch died aged 51 years on June 27, 1858 - she is listed as wife of James Vaitch, farm labourer. James Vaitch listed as present at the death, in Roseden.
Elizabeth's father, James, died July 9, 1880, Barnes Cottages, Westoe. Aged 77 years, occupation listed as husbandman. James Veitch, his son, is listed as in attendance at the death.
Elizabeth Storey's death occurred Oct 12, 1917 at 12 Dacre Square, Morpeth UD. She was listed as 63 years of age and the 'wife of Henry Storey a Gamekeeper'. Present at the death was Henrietta McLevy, daughter.
So while I am quite confident I have Elizabeth identified, I am still trying to understand why Margaret Purdy took Edith Annie Veitch in.
I have discovered that Henry Storey's uncle, Robert Storey, married an Isabella Robson. It appears though that she does not have an immediate/close connection to Margeret Purdy (who was born Margaret Robson).
Lastly, I do have the marriage certificate for John Purdy and Margaret Robson. Witnesses as her father, Robert Robson and her sister, Annabella Arkless.
Sorry to send such a long note but wanted to share this in hopes it might spark an idea or suggestion.I truly appreciate all the thoughts/ideas.
Kind regards
Bob
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You have come a long way Bob but the same question is unanswered ::)
Sorry cant be more help.
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Hi Bob
I can't see the index entry for Elizabeth's birth in the March or June quarter of 1851 on www.freebmd.org.uk - did you get the reference elsewhere?
I can see a birth reg for a Mary Jane Veitch Sep Q 1851 in Glendale reg district (which covers Kirknewton) but no other girls that year in Northumberland?
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I can't see the index entry for Elizabeth's birth in the March or June quarter of 1851 on www.freebmd.org.uk
Elisabeth was born March 28, 1851 , Beaumont Hill, Paston, Kirknewton Parish, Northumberland co, the daughter of James Vaitch and Mary Vaitch formerly Ewart.
Elisabeth Vaitch, 2nd q 1851, Glendale 25, 307 :)
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Duh!
Thanks Jen, sorry Bob.
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Correct JenB...that is the entry. SelDen, the last name is spelled Vaitch on the birth record. I have found a number of variants on census, birth, death records for Veitch - for example Vaitch, Veatch, Vaitches, Veith, Leith etc etc
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Which makes piecing this puzzle together all the more interesting/challenging!
:)