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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Australia Lookups completed => Topic started by: boswood/bowman on Wednesday 13 July 05 06:46 BST (UK)
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Hello,
I am trying to find some information on the marriage of Alice Bowman and Murray Albert Boswood in New Zealand probably around 1875 - 1885. Murray Albert was born in Tasmania. I would like to find out what happened when they went to Australia and if there were any children.
Thanks - Joy
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Joy,
Did they get married in NZ and then come to Australia? Do you know if they were in NSW or another state?
Prue
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I looked on the AVRI which covers NSW Vic WA and Tas to about 1900 & couldn't find any children to your couple. There are a number of Boswoods - mainly in Tasmania, but none with the parents you mentioned
Trish
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Hello Prue,
They were married in N.Z and then apparently went to Australia. I think Redfern area in NSW. Alice Bowman was supposed to have died either in child birth or not many years after. This would be between 1906 - 1909.
Thanks for the information.
Joy
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Hello Trish,
I think the birth was later than 1900.
Around 1906 - 1909 in NSW. Redfern district.
See my email to Prue
Thanks - Joy
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Hi Joy
Murray A Boswood married in 1912 at Newtown (Sydney) to Leavinia Armstrong Reg # 6806
Also...
Alice Boswood had a son Frederick A at Sydney in 1908...no father named Reg # 301
So perhaps Alice & Murray divorced?
There is no death for Alice or Murray up to 1945 that I could see in NSW
Maureen
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Hi Joy
Further to my last post
there was an Alice C "Bowman" died in 1915 at Wollahra (Sydney) the Dau/of a Thomas J & Elizabeth Reg# 2543 plus a number of Alice Bowmans who married this era
Maureen
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Maureen,
Me again. Do you where Alice Bowman's parents were from.
Thanks - Joy
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Hi Joy
I have been doing a little rummaging around to see if I could pinpoint anything on the family for you.
Firstly...That death of Alice I sent you...I can't tell you if that is yours or not as it is just a registered death of a Bowman...it could be a child for all I would know, but I thought you may know if it was yours or not.
However...
It appears to me that the family arrived here (NSW) circa 1893. The reason I give for this is, that I found a death of a Pearl Boswood 1893, to an Arthur & Eliza J Boswood at Burwood (Suburb of Sydney) [4422] Source: NSW Federation Series 1889-1918.
There is no marriage for Arthur & Eliza in NSW...remember he was born Tas 1878, so it must have taken place elsewhere.
Arthur & Eliza only had one other child in NSW which was at Burwood 1894 named Wallace H.E. Boswood Son/of Arthur & Eliza J. Reg Year 1894 Reg # 9016 (birth info only goes up to 1918 due to privacy laws)
Fanny died 1904 at Newtown [10394] & an Alfred M 1911 son/of Thomas & Grieta at Wagga Wagga (Country town) [7812]...that is all the Boswood deaths in NSW for that period.
Next...
Source: NSW Between The Wars Index; 1919-1945 (Deaths & Marriages only)
Deaths
BOSWOOD, Priscilla K, 67 yrs old at Coast Hospital.
Place of registration: Redfern
Registration Year: 1919
Reg # 5794
1933 - BOSWOOD, Alfred G
Father: John
Mother: Fanny
Place of Reg: Granville (Suburb of Sydney
Reg. Year: 1933
Reg # 1028
This just helps confirm that the whole family came to NSW. The death certificates should reveal all the names of their children & asks the question where born & how long in Australia NSW etc.
I can't recall if you mentioned what the 'C' of Alice C stood for...that is if Alice did have a second name.
I found an Alice Constance Bowman born to William C & mother: BROWN, Jane Martin at Tasmania 31 Dec 1874 Reg Year: 1875 Reg # 678.
THE BIG FINISH...
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Hi Joy
THE BIG FINISH...
Sorry but something happened again, it got posted before I even had time to preview it!
But here goes before it disappears again.
I found another reference for that birth of Frederick. It was also registered under BOWMAN surname...all exactly the same except for the different surnames.
Birth Certificates usually site names of previous children born.
Cheers Maureen
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I've just found a whole bunch of BOSWOODs on the Tasmanian Family Link database at the Tas Archives! Parents Alfred BOSWOOD and Priscilla BRAIN. There is an Arthur christened 1878.
If you would like the full ref please PM me - otherwise check out the link yourself at: http://resources.archives.tas.gov.au/Pioneers/taslink3.asp?ID=22855
Cheers!
Prue
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Thanks Maureen,
This is great, being actually able to find out anything.
I have made a mistake re: my original date of marriage of Murray A. Boswood and Alice Bowman. I now think it would more likely to be anywhere between 1900 and 1907. Still supposed to be in NZ.
Your last email confirmed what we though was correct. Frederick A Boswood was born to Alice Bowman (do not know middle initial or if there even was one) on his original birth certificate. He was born in 1908. He needed to get a birth certificate at some time probably when he was around 30- 40 years old. He had his name changed to Boswood as he knew his father to be Murray A. Boswood. Frederick A. had a falling out with his father and apparently left home in his early teen years. This would make the year anything from 1921 onwards. He was told his mother was Alice Bowman and that she had died but his father never told him where the grave site was. She apparently was the housekeeper but we do not know if they actually married. He could never remember his mother. This may have been the reason he left home so early.
While he was living at home his father remarried. There"Bunny"
After Frederick took to the roads he lost contact with them.
He did have contact much later with them and I believe they were in WA at that stage.
I do not know whether Alice Bowman actually died or whether she just disappeared from Frederick's life.
Frederick never really spoke very much about his family and said things were better left alone, which makes me think something must have happened between the family.
I would like to know what happened to his sister/brothers ?
Regards - Joy
Frederick finished up in Victoria. He was in the RAAF in the 2nd WW.
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Hello Maureen,
Seems I am having trouble now. Just had another look at my last email to you.
Half way down email it seems to have disappeared. It should read:
Frederick definetely had step sisters. One had a nickname of "Bunny".
Joy
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Hi Joy
Regards your Frederick Boswood.
If you haven't already done it, you can pull up his war records on 'WW2 Nominal Roll'. His next of kin is given as his father Murray Boswood. His date of birth 1908 & he enlisted in 1941 - so he was 33 yrs old then. He was in the Royal Australian Air Force...may have been in Army...they sometimes left one to go to the other, but I never checked this...leave it to you.
Plus Wickham is in Newcastle not Taree as I said...I was thinking of Wingham.
As for your Cornell's. I only have access up to 1888 for Victoria. Our library has all the Victorian BDM's that go further, but you should be able to access these for yourself, if you live close to a library, if it has a family history section.
If not ,you can scan BDM's on the Victorian BDM's online, but there is a charge for this...$10 to scan I think, then if you buy one, it is more.
I happened to go to the library today as I needed to see my friend Nanette who is the book buyer there. While there I had about 10 mins to check out any names for you.
The earliest Marshall Cornell that I could find, being born, was to a Thomas Cornell & Rebecca Alcock at Oakleigh, Victoria in 1890 (35144) - Rebecca Alcock married Thomas Cornell at Tarneit Vic in 1886 (3689V) - they also had a son Charles b1887 Oakleigh Vic (22357) & another son Edward b 1888 O'Leigh (sic., this must be Oakleigh also) Vic ...I never took the Reg # for him.
There was also a thomas Cornell b 1859 to a John & Sarah (Hichman) at Vic (18435)
An Edward cornell died 60yrs old son of Chas cornell & Eliza Bird at Hawthorn 1896 (2137)
I sense at least that Thomas & Rebecca will be connected to you in some way.
It's best to work backwards from certificates where you can - as it is necessary to prove it. You were a bit lucky getting me on the Boswood line as I was just passing through. I am pretty experienced with NSW BDM & know how to get the best from it. That one was probably a little difficult for some to solve...I used folio numbers instead of names.
That's it hope it is of some help.
Maureen
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Hi Joy
The following are from the victorian indexes and maybe connected to your Frederick.
Deaths
Boswood Alice
Died aged 20 Hotham E
Parents: Murray Boswood & Hazel Alice UNKNOWN
Year: 1911 reg no. 1714
Death
Boswood Louisa
Died: aged Nil Age code: Month Hotham E
Parents: Henry Boswood & Hazel Alice UNKNOWN
Year: 1911 reg no. 1723
Birth
Boswood Mina
born: Hothan E
Parents: Murray & Alice HAZEL
Year 1911 reg no. 4172
My theory is that Mina & Louisa refer to the same child and Alice is the mother and died after giving birth. The Parents referenced against Alice could be incorrect as the indexes have lots of inaccuracies.
The birth certificate for Mina could be the key as Frederick would be listed as would the marriage place and date.
Cheers
Genni
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Hi Genni
Obviously some details I have sent to Joy do not show up on the Board, so I don't know if you are aware of what I found re Alice Heagney, Bowman, Boswood, or not.
Your find it interesting, in that it gives details for a Murray Boswood & Alice (Hazel?), having children in Victoria as late as 1911 - by the way, that suggests to me that the first two, Alice & Louisa, were twins...perhaps they died at birth. The reason for this theory is because the Reg#'s run consecutively i.e. 1713 & 1714.
It's possible the twins were born at the beginning of the year & that Mina was born at the end, i.e. Reg # is 4174
If Alice was still in Victoria by 1911 then it's possible that she did die there...so I would look for an Alice Bowman or Heagney death as well as Boswood, - with parents names Thomas & Margaret/Margarite, (Heagney) & her birth place NSW...as it may turn out that the one who died 1915 in NSW was just a coincidence.
Although all things need to be proved, I believe that Alice was Alice C J Heagney born Berrima NSW in 1876
Frederick would have been born under Bowman surname with maiden name of mother Heagney - & later Boswood would have been added.
Maureen
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Hi Maureen
No the deaths are not consectutive, One is 1714 and the other is 1723. Alice is aged 29 years and Louisa is between a day and a month old, no age is given only a age code of a month.
The birth registration for Mina is only early in the year as were over 30,000 birth registrations in 1911.
I note that Lavina (Leavina) BOSWOOD (she was born in Ballarat) died in Victoria in 1933. Her father was Patrick FLOOD and she had been married to John JOHNSON in 1896 and then William ARMSTRONG in 1909.
Her sons John Joseph JOHNSON & James Joseph JOHNSON served in the WW1. She also had a daughter Ethel JOHNSON.
Cheers
Genni
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I am also researching Bowman and just wondered whether the following rings any bells with you.
Teresa Bowman b. abt 1858 Ireland (possibly Tipperary or Dublin)
married (age16/ spinster/servant) 2nd Sept 1874 Invercargill NZ (Catholic Church) to William Hargreaves - also from Ireland
5 children all born NZ, then 1884 6th child born Glebe NSW Aus.
sheddyg
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Hi Genni
Thanks for that...but I only took Reg# from your post, so you either inadvertently put in 1713 instead of 1723...or I read it incorrectly! Not to worry it's fixed now...
Re: Frederick Boswood b. 1908 Syd., NSW
I was able to find his birth under three surnames HEAGNEY, BOWMAN, BOSWOOD - which I gave to Joy last week
I formed the view that an Alice C J Heagney who married Montague A Bowman in 1901 Syd., NSW, was his mother.
Also, I found an Alice C J Heagney born, as I said, at Berrima in 1876 - to Thomas & Margaret.
I don't know what happened to Montague as I did not go further into it - left some things for Joy to discover for herself!
Perhaps he went to Victoria & died there? - more clues to unfold? However, I would like to see the surname of this 'Alice Hazel? or Hazel vice versa' in Victoria...was she one and the same as Alice Heagney, Bowman, Boswood??Was it the same Murray Boswood?...stay tuned
The last issue is with Murray Albert Boswood himself, as there was one born to the correct parents in 1887 but he was Murray
Victor Boswood. Another son? born with initial 'M'. lots of siblings of course.
The only positive thing that I can absolutely vouch for, is Frederick's three surnames on his registration..The rest may need certificates to sort it all out.
Cheers Maureen
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I'll throw another one into the mix.
There is a William Joseph Heagney born to an Alice Heagney in Victoria in 1907 in Carlton. Hotham East and Carlton are roughly the same area.
I will say that the Boswood name is not very common so I think that the Murray Victor and Murray Albert are one in the same.
Cheers
Genni
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Hi Genni
Hmmm! Interesting
Could be her.
Alice had two children to BOWMAN
1902 Arthur J & 1904 Montague H - both boys born Newtown., Syd NSW. - then of course in 1908 Frederick to Boswood.
I found the birth of Montague A BOWMAN also - he born 1877 NSW to John & Elizabeth.
This is probably the John BOWMAN who married Elizabeth Bailey in 1858 NSW - they had lots of children.
Joy said that Alice had been a housekeeper (I hope that meant she kept the house :D!) The question is where was Montague - poor fellow (with a name like that I couldn't call him a guy!)
Maureen
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Greetings from Orange, NSW. My g/father's youngest sister was Alice Catherine(sometimes Katherine)Jane Heagney who married Montague Albert William Bowman. I've only just joined Rootschat,so I'm interested to see that you or some other researcher has found her "association" with Murray Albert Boswood! I found Montague to be an interesting character(NSW State Records photo Darlinghurst Gaol), left Alice and married Dorothy Simpson with whom he had a daughter, Carmen 1918.Captain 53rd Btn, POW. He died by his own hand 1943 and is buried at Rookwood. I think the DOD of Alice Bowman 1915 could be correct, except parents are listed as Thomas and Elizabeth, whereas her mother was Margaret Ann Ryan born Carlow Ireland, Thomas coming from Lorrha, Tipperary. Won't type any more as I see your last entry was 2005 and you mightn't see this. Margaret
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Hi there,
Welcome to RChat M Jackson
MC has not been online at RChat since 2010.
I will contact Sarah, one of our Moderators.
If you post twice more, any RChatter will be able to send you a Personal Message.
Just reply twice more, even if you just type "Hi"for each post.
It helps to 'knock out' spammers.
Cheers, JM (born and raised on the Lachlan, and of course, familiar with Orange. My very first set of traffic lights were along Summer St)
Cheers, JM
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Hi Margaret and Welcome to RootsChat :)
It looked like MC's email were not working because she had changed email address. I think I have found a new email address for her and have contacted her to tell of your new reply.
Hope to see MC soon (fingers crossed)
Regards
Sarah
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Thanks for your advice, JM.
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Thanks for replying, Sarah.
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I am very sorry MJackson but the other email has bounced back my message this morning, done a little more searching but have not been able to find anything else for MC :'(
MJackson it might be worth you posting a new fresh posting on your research into this family and hopefully MC may come across your new postings and get back intouch :)
Wishing you all the Best with your Research.
Regards
Sarah :)
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Hello from Australia.I've just joined Rootschat, so hope you'll see this one day? I can see why you are having difficulty solving this problem! Alice was my grandfather's youngest sister,Alice Katherine Jane, born Berrima NSW 1876.Her father was a policeman,Thomas Heagney married to Margaret Ryan 1858 in Carlow. Ireland,emigrated same year to Sydney. Thomas died 1894 and Margaret 1890.Alice married Montague Albert Bowman in Sydney 1901,had 2 sons Arthur John 1902, Montague Harold 1904.Montague. She was a housekeeper for Murray Boswood when she had Frederick by him in 1908. Her husband seems to have been very unstable(can see his photo in Darlinghurst Gaol on NSW State Records webpage for a misdemeanour when he was 18-too long a story to tell here!).Years ago another researcher told me she'd found that when Frederick Heagney Bowman(how he was registered)got his birth cert to join the RAAF for WW2 he changed his name to his faher 's Boswood. Frederick died 1980 in Echuca, Victoria. As for Alice, I suspect the 1915 death cert is hers even though her mother is listed as Elizabeth instead of Margaret.The informant probably didn't know her well enough, but at least got her father Thomas correct. Police Gazettes for1911,1912 have warrants for Montague as he wasn't paying any maintenance and I also read that he went as a cook on a ship to U.S. He remarried Dorothy Gertrude Simpson and had a daughter,Carmen after he came back from WW1. Died by his own hand 1943 in Burwood, Sydney and buried with headstone, Rookwood Cemetery,Sydney. Are you related to the Bowmans or Boswoods ?Margaret
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Hi MJackson, thanks so much for posting about Alice Heagney. That story fills in the missing links for my research. I'm not sure about the details on Montague though. I have Alice marrying Montague Arthur Bowman born 1876 to John and Elizabeth and you mention Albert William Montague Bowman who I think is a different person possibly born in 1884 to Helen. Maybe the two mens stories have merged.
I have Montague Arthur marrying Alice, going to jail and working out on a boat but that is where the trail ends for me.
Regards
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Have heard from another researcher,Montague Bowman didn't marry Dorothy Simpson,join army and commit suicide. It was his nephew with a similar name, so still don't know what became of Montague.Maybe o/seas?
Also discovered that the Alice C Bowman who died 1915 in Woolahra was 70 and C was for Clara. My Alic would only have been about 39 in 1915 and also middle names were Katherine Jane.
Messages posted on behalf of MJackson who was clicking on the "report to moderator" button instead of the reply button, you will find this just below the last reply ;)
Sarah
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I believe that you will find the Alice Clara Bowman - wife of James here:
http://austcemindex.com/?given_names=Alice&family_name=Bowman
The chap who married Dorothy was Albert Montague, as opposed to Montague Albert. His death notice:
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article17837863
Death:
36646/1964 Harold Montague Bowman parents Montague and Alice HAMILTON
Birth registration for Alice:
8394/1876 Alice C J Heagney parents Thomas and Margarite BERRIMA
Marriage: 6585/1901 Montague A Bowman to Alice C J Heagney GLEBE
Note in both case it is C and not K.
Jamjar
Jamjar
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Thanks for your reply, Jamjar. I realise Alice's middle name was with a C, but I have 2 grandmothers registered at birth as Catherine and one died as Kathleen and both sometimes called Kate or Kit, so have seen it written both ways for Alice. I have Catherine as a middle name after them! The point I was trying to make to researchers who put Alice's death as 1915 is that she had a completely different middle name ,Clara, and also was almost twice her age.
BTW, this week I found my Alice's son by Murray Albert Boswood, Frederick Albert Boswood born 1908 Newtown,Sydney,, buried 14.11.1980 in an RAAF grave in Patho Victoria, through Gravestone Photographs.He's the only one in the grave, but his wife and 4 children's names are there. The Gravestones Project had that his parents were Murray Albert and Alice Boswood, so I thought I'd found Alice after all these years, but Charles Sale who runs the Project contacted the transcriber,Susan Doyle who has just emailed me to say she got the parents' names from the cemetery record. I don't think Murray ever married Alice as he's buried in Karrakatta Cemetery,WA ,with wife Katheline (yes, that's how it was spelt!) I've found, in NSW BDM, an Alice Bowman married to an Alfred Bond in Sydney 1917 and as I have a visiting card from my g/mother's collection with "John and Mary Bond, Maryville,Goulburn,"on it, think this might be a lead. However, in 1923 there's an Alice Bond getting a Decree Absolut against Alfred Bond, granted September 1924(from TROVE). Then there's an Alice Bond marrying a Stanley Williams in 1929, so the hunt continues! Are you related to this Heagney line? My grandfather Francis Joseph Heagney(1871 Berrima-1919 Perth WA) was Alice's brother.
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Hi there,
You mention that you don't think that Murray ever married Alice as he is buried in Karrakatta Cemetery WA with wife Katheline. You also mention that Frederick Albert BOSWOOD was born 1908, Newtown NSW and that The Gravestones Project has his parents as Murray Albert and Alice BOSWOOD.
In NSW BDM, the civil birth registration was informant driven of course, and included details of when/where the parents of the baby were married, and mum's nee name. From that information you can then research for that marriage. Of course, it may well be that Murray was not named on Frederick's birth registration. In that era, the usual reason would be because the mother was unmarried, (so not married to any person a 'spinster' or a 'divorcee' or 'widow'). Perhaps the NSW BDM online index is pointing to Alice BOSWOOD being her nee name, or perhaps her known by name. Her status should be noted on the bdm registration.
Frederick A,
no father's name displayed
mother as Alice BOSWOOD and as Alice BOWMAN and as Alice HEAGNEY
registered Sydney # 301/1908 (indexed three times)
ADD
Vic BDM has
Alice BOSWOOD, aged 29 died 1911, at Hoth E #1714
Father as Murray BOSWOOD,
Mother as Alice Hazel UNKNOWN.
JM