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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: JayEffBee on Friday 28 August 15 17:26 BST (UK)
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Can anyone help in my search for a citation for the following MM recipient:
Fred Smith, Private, 9th Bat Essex Regiment service no 40699 or 40697. Can`t find it in London Gazette 18 July 1917 which is where something should be. Have seen Gazette 25 April 1918 when Bar added. Fred was killed in 1918.
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From (limited) experience you may struggle. MMs were often awarded in the field and, perhaps in consequence, all you'll get in the Gazette is a date of award and no detail. Might be worth looking at the War Diary for the unit with which he was serving at the time. Have you asked the Essex Regt Museum? http://www.chelmsford.gov.uk/essexregimentmuseum
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Hi
The London Gazette can be a few weeks late. Also look on military boards here on RC, and the Long Long Trail website, where there are often great experts who are willing to help, in my experience.
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Thanks for replies. Regiment do not have any citation and are of course interested. Can not find the Gazette entry.Will try Long Trail.
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Hi, as far as I am aware citations were not published for the award of the Military Medal, your best bet would be to see if there is any mention of it in the unit war diary, there are some diary's on Ancestry but I'm not sure which.
As already mentioned, all you may get in the Gazette is something along the lines of:-
"His majesty is pleased to award the Military Medal to the following men......................"
and that would be followed by the names of all the recipients for that time frame.
Regards
Frank.
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Local papers often had MM write ups.Howard Williamson has done a lot of MM research for a forthcoming book.
Ady
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Local papers often had MM write ups.Howard Williamson has done a lot of MM research for a forthcoming book.
Ady
Hi Ady, not wishing to hijack the thread :-[ but is that book by Howard Williamson "For Bravery in the Field"?
Regards
Frank.
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No it's not....Howard's book on MM isn't due until Dec 16.
He is regular contributor on British Medal Forum.
Ady
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Apologies Ady, I got mixed up :-[ I look forward to the release of it in 2016.
Frank.
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Frank,
He was Gazetted on 18th July 1917
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/30188/supplement/7285/data.pdf
According to Mr Williamson's book on Great War Medals this was for actions around Arras in the Allied Spring Offensive April to early June 1917. Looking at the War Diary for that period there are numerous actions with no mention of him in person. The dates that stand out are 9th - 11th April and 30th April.
Your best bet would be to read through the War Diary for that period he may get a mention but without the citation you'll struggle to find anything.
Reading the War Diary for 5th April 1918, they were in the Trenches at "Henencourt" near Albert when they were attacked following a heavy bombardment of various calibres and gas shells. The action went all day with the Germans eventually being driven back.
The Gazette for 25th April 1918 covers actions in March up to the start of the German offensive. Again looking at the War Diary there are only 2 actions mentioned, both were raids on the trenches by the Germans 12th and 17th March in the "Fleurbaix Sector" to the west of"Armentières". It's possible he could have been given his Bar to the MM then?
Hope this helps.
David
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Thanks for the help on this. Will follow up and see what I can find.
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Hello David
Can you tell me which volume and edition of Williamson`s book I need to look at and also where do I find the War Diaries?
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Hi Frank,
It's Volume 1 if you can still get a copy although, it won't tell much more than what I put in the response. It doesn't give any citations just the corresponding dates to the Gazette entries.
He is publishing another book later with some more information which I'm hoping to get a copy of.
I have the same problem as you in that, My G Grandfather won the MM but there's no citation and nobody in the family knows why!
As for the War Diaries, they're on Ancestry if you have access? If not send me a PM and I'll look them up again for you.
Regards
David
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Sorry to but in David... but my relative Thomas Capes died on April 9th 1917 in the spring Offensive in Arras...would love to find the diary entry if you can point me in the right direction.
Thanks.
Carol
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Hi Carol,
Do you have access to Ancestry? or The National Archives?
Was he in the 20th (Tyneside Scottish) Bttn, Northumberland Fusiliers?
If so, drop me a PM and I'll have a quick look for you.
David
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Yes he was...I photographed his grave this year in Bailleul Road East cemetery in July...I do have access to Ancestry but not sure how to find the diaries.,,,Thanks for your response.
Carol
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Hi Carol,
There's nothing on there yet, You need to go to the "Search" page and "Unit Histories" and find the "War Diaries" section.
There is however, a very good book by John sheen on the Tyneside Scottish, 20th - 23rd Battalions if you can get a copy?
David
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Oh....great...thanks for that David...really helpful.
Carol
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I’ve just started doing my family tree on my mams side (Hardy)I’ve got info but unfortunately no individual pictures on -
Robert Cole Henderson
He worked for Cowpen coal company before joining the military in December 1914 - the Tyneside Scottish (Northumberland Fusiliers) he was posted to 21st Battalion and commenced training at Alnwick in 1915.
He gained rank of company sergeant major he was also awarded D.C.M - for his bravery at the battle of Arras on 9th April 1917 .
He died 17/10/18
He received medal / watch from the king and a picture is somewhere !!??
Would be grateful if anyone could help me .
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Amy - He died in 23rd Btn and left a Widow Hannah and 4 Children
What evidence do you have that he was awarded something by the King and that a Photo of him exists?
Have you looked for a Photo and Obituary in the Blythe Local Newspaper in late 1918?
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I’ve read it in newspapers ect
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He received medal / watch from the king and a picture is somewhere !!??
As I told you in reply #12 on this thread https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=880688.msg7531315#msg7531315 the gold watch was awarded by the Blyth ‘Merit and homecoming committee’.
There was no mention of the king in that particular newspaper article.
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It mentions the king in a few articles I’ve read
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I don't know if you have seen his citation for the DCM (image courtesy of Ancestry)
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There are now two threads running on the same subject of Robert Cole Henderson.
The other is here https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=880688.msg7531315#msg7531315
(Allan, see reply #10 on that thread - similar information to that in your post)
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Hi JenB -- duplicated posts have me pulling my hair out (not that I have much these days ;D)