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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: cazza59 on Monday 27 July 15 12:00 BST (UK)
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I think I've gotten out of order and missed posting 193. ???
This is a postcard, but it's been cut presumably to fit in album slots.
Caz
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I wonder if it is the House in a London Mews were Dr Johnson the Lexographer once lived? Just off Fleet Street.
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I wonder if it is the House in a London Mews were Dr Johnson the Lexographer once lived? Just off Fleet Street.
No, not big enough https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr_Johnson%27s_House
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It reminds me of Welsh chapels (similar to, but not http://www.oldukphotos.com/graphics/Wales%20Photos/Glamorgan,%20Pontycymmer,%20Tabernacle%20Chapel.jpg )
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Has the look of a custom House near warehouses.
Jennifer
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It reminds me of Welsh chapels (similar to, but not http://www.oldukphotos.com/graphics/Wales%20Photos/Glamorgan,%20Pontycymmer,%20Tabernacle%20Chapel.jpg )
I saw that one as well, Spidermonkey and got excited! ;D The original appears to have two entrances.
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Has the look of a custom House near warehouses.
Jennifer
It does look like some government building.
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This Wesleyan Chapel is also similar http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Bolton-le-Moors/Little-Bolton/wesleyan/index.html
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That is really similar too Kay.
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This Wesleyan Chapel is also similar http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Bolton-le-Moors/Little-Bolton/wesleyan/index.html
Oh thought you had it then until I looked at the doors, but you are right, very similar style!
Caz
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There's no numbers or signs on the doors, so perhaps part of a complex rather than a separate building on its own? Unless that is a sign next to the door on the right.
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I wonder if the set up was like this https://geolocation.ws/v/E/2180142/wesleyan-chapel-kirkby-stephen/en
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Just googling images of Wesleyan chapels does throw up a lot of similar buildings - same style of windows etc. If it was one it is probably smart apartments now. ;D
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Similarity here also.
http://www.myprimitivemethodists.org.uk/page/william_brogg_leighton
Scroll down
Regards
Malky
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An observation....
It looks like 4 of the upper windows are open from the top down? And the building next door also appears to have an open window but the upper part seems to be tilted inwards?
PB
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I've improved the contrast a bit to see the detail a bit easier.
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Interesting building. Does anyone know why there are two 'front' doors?
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Saints and sinners.
Big queue on one door every Sunday.
I'm jesting, of course.
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Interesting building. Does anyone know why there are two 'front' doors?
One for men and one for women
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Interesting building. Does anyone know why there are two 'front' doors?
One for men and one for women
Oh really? :o
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This is the case in the USA chapels I understand, but I can't see a good link at the moment re UK ???
Edit - Apologies the sites all relate to USA chapels ::)
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If it was one it is probably smart apartments now. ;D
No, I'm going for either antiques centre, or night club!
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The Isle of Man explanation for two doors - "The early layouts were inclined towards a two-aisle design, one on each side of the building, the entrance in the gable end by a centre door, the high-backed rear pews acting as a screen, or by two entrance doors leading into the respective aisles by direct access" http://www.isle-of-man.com/manxnotebook/methdism/chapels/arch.htm
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The building to the left is of a very similar design, so I think the two together might be chapel and Sunday school. Can't say which is which, though possibly I'd expect to see a larger noticeboard outside a chapel than is evident here. On the other hand, the buildings seem to be joined by a paved area, so perhaps there's a larger noticeboard where that meets the public road/pavement.
Arthur
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Interesting building. Does anyone know why there are two 'front' doors?
One for men and one for women
[/quote]
Not unusual for a synagogue, which is what this looks like to me
:) Barbara
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It's a bit late now, but tomorrow morning if no one has found this, I'll do some close ups, particularly of the circular window to see if it's stained glass which would indicate that this is a church of sorts.
Caz
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If it was one it is probably smart apartments now. ;D
No, I'm going for either antiques centre, or night club!
Antiques centre gets my vote! ;D ;D
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Good evening,
There are a number of architectural differences between the two buildings. I don't think they are connected in any way.
I think the small circular "window" may be a clock but can't be sure.
I thought at first Masonic but would expect to see some symbols on the front to confirm it.
John915
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Hello everyone. :D
I've tried looking for Methodist, Baptist, Wesleyan chapels /churches to no avail yet even thought Work house as it looks a sad place and because of the 2 doors men women but nothing again yet. The one search I have been having some success with is Quaker meeting houses / schools found several close looking but none with the second building near by.
Some had the distinctive brick work around the top of the roof [is there a name for that?]as well as the round window above.
I though our windows were rather elaborate to so maybe this is an important building where ever it is.
Also just to say I am still looking for some of our elusive hunts so you never know ;D.
Margaret
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Thought this might be the front if the picture was of the back(!),but windows have different aspect ratio,I think.
Regards
Roger
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I remain convinced its a synagogue, with the circular window typically showing a Star of David or a six/eight petal motif.
As for the antique centre, nightclub etc (this isn't our building btw, but...)
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/LAN/Cheetham/NorthManchesterSynagogue.shtml
:) Barbara
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I'm with you on that one Barbara, the closest matches I've found so far have been synagogues :D
What a shocking mess they've made of the synagogue you posted!
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Interesting to read the suggestions about the reasons for the two doorways. Thanks for those. :)
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I think it's a Synagogue too...but do you think I can find it?...not on your life :(
I've seen some that are quite similar but no luck so far ???
Joy
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A couple of close ups, but I don't think they help much.
Caz
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No. 2
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No. 3
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It's amazing how much damage shows up in the scan that is not visible to the naked eye.
Caz
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What a shocking mess they've made of the synagogue you posted!
Just awful but I bet no one bats an eyelid unless they had/have an association with the synagogue. I suppose we should be grateful they didn't tear it down.
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Interesting to read the suggestions about the reasons for the two doorways. Thanks for those. :)
I learnt that from watching WDYTYA, Zoe Wannamaker episode from memory. ;D ;D ::) ::)
Looking forward to seeing Billy Connolly's episode on Sunday.
Caz
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Anyway, getting back to the mystery building. Has anyone by any chance done a search on demolished or war destroyed buildings/chapels/synagogues?
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I've just gone to post No. 203 and gotten an error message saying I've reached my posting limit? Anyone have that happen before?
Caz
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I've just gone to post No. 203 and gotten an error message saying I've reached my posting limit? Anyone have that happen before?
Caz
I'd get straight on the bat phone to Trystan if I were you. ;)
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Are you limited to so many in a day/week, I seem to recall reading that somewhere before?
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I just spoke to Sarah and there are some unanswered posts on this board, so I can't post until the board catches up, which is fair enough as I have been hogging the board with my WAIs. So we will have to be content with locating this building for awhile. :)
We could also go back to No. 12 of course… ;D ;D ;D ;D
Caz
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;D
Did I tell you about my dream where I discovered the mock tudor house was the front view of the house with a tower? I woke up jubilant at the thought that I had sorted everything out........ ::)
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;D ;D ;D ;D I think I would fall off my chair if that was the case!
Yorkslass has been suspiciously quiet lately…I wonder what she is up to… ;D ;D ;D
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;D ;D ;D ;D I think I would fall off my chair if that was the case!
Yorkslass has been suspiciously quiet lately…I wonder what she is up to… ;D ;D ;D
Flicking through Clifton-Brown ebooks along with her Hanbury set ;)
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If this was a synagogue, would one expect there to be a mezuzah by the doors?
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Well I obviously don't think along the same lines as I thought it might be a Town Hall and that 's what I've searching ::)
Carol
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I thought more government building…I think someone said earlier a custom's house maybe.
Would a chapel have a chimney (and please don't say it could be a crem :-X :-X)?
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Would a chapel have a chimney (and please don't say it could be a crem :-X :-X)?
If it had coal-fired heating, yes. And at the time this would have been built, that would probably be the most likely form of heating.
Arthur
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Thanks Arthur…you are a font of knowledge! 8) 8)
It looks to me to be a city building…perhaps it was destroyed during the war..she says grasping at straws! ;D ;D
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posting this to demonstrate chapel with chimney (not as a crem......... ;) )
http://www.stanleyhistoryonline.com/0_0_0_0_697_450_csupload_15717035.jpg?u=174209492
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Thanks Spidermonkey. That removes my one doubt and I will bow to everyone's superior knowledge and join the hunt for chapels.
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Argh! The right number of windows and doors, but not the right style (and up steps ::))
http://www.stgite.org.uk/media/stmarkwhitechapelcurates.html
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You don't see too many chapels with a second story...Unless I'm looking in the wrong place.
Carol
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I don't know whether the second storey thing might be more of a city based one - i.e. a limited amount of space and a larger congregation. Presumably the second storey would be a gallery arrangement, rather than officers for example :-\
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That's a good assumption....you are coming so close...I'm sure you will find it.
Carol
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Lots of nonconformist chapels had two storeys - very many of them had galleries inside :)
Here's a really old Methodist Chapel in Upper Weardale with two storeys
http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/2647681
http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/2647665
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Thanks for that Jen...you learn something everyday...a common search for chapel doesn't show many...so maybe a more precise term is needed...I guess that's why I only have 3 to my credit...and you have a shedload ::) ;D ;D ;D ;D
Carol
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Has anyone tried 5 bay chapels with bulls eye window in gable end.
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Is that with or without Ketchup :P ;D ;D ;D ;D
Carl
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Is that with or without Ketchup :P ;D ;D ;D ;D
Carl
;D
(I may have just emitted a very unladylike snort!)
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;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D...That really made me laugh out loud...I was laughing that much I missed the "o" out of my name.
Carol
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That's given me the giggles as well! ;D ;D ;D
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;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D...That really made me laugh out loud...I was laughing that much I missed the "o" out of my name.
Carol
as in "Oh Carol" ?
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Or should that be....Oh Carl ;D ;D ;D ;D
Carol aka Carl
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Interesting building. Does anyone know why there are two 'front' doors?
Rather than one central aisle quite a lot of nonconformist churches had two aisles, so also had two doors for easier access/exit to/from the two aisles.
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The "broken pediment" is quite unusual too
Steve
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;D Steve, I was just writing, "The split pediment is rare."
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It's certainly an impediment to our finding it! ;D ;D ;D
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Hi Guys,
Was doing a search for another RC query & came across this...................
Not what your looking for but resembles some of the characteristics so wondered if your building may be in the Middlesex area where this is ???
Probably way off but thought it was worth posting :-\
http://www.workhouses.org.uk/Poplar/
Before I enlarged it my 1st thought was "that resembles 1 of the WAI's"
Annie
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Has anyone tried 5 bay chapels with bulls eye window in gable end.
I tried your suggestion (learnt a new term as well "bulls eye window" ;D) and it did bring up several buildings very similar to the mystery building, so thank you for that, your input is very much appreciated. 8) 8)
Caz
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Hi Guys,
Was doing a search for another RC query & came across this...................
Not what your looking for but resembles some of the characteristics so wondered if your building may be in the Middlesex area where this is ???
Probably way off but thought it was worth posting :-\
http://www.workhouses.org.uk/Poplar/
Before I enlarged it my 1st thought was "that resembles 1 of the WAI's"
Annie
It is similar Annie and must say that is a great site that I have book marked for future reference.
Thanks very much for taking the time to post.
We must be getting warmer…..
Caz
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Just look at this old photo from the Historical Society of Tell City, Indiana (settled by Swiss immigrants). Very similar at the upper level.
http://www.hmdb.org/PhotoFullSize.asp?PhotoID=173694
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Certainly is! There appears to be quite few buildings scattered everywhere with this common design. I wonder if they are based on the work of one architect, the architectural style of an era or as a commonplace design for a particular religious faith.
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Spent a couple of hours on this one today. There appears to have been a lot of synagogues lost during the war and no photos to show which ones that I can find. :(
Caz
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Can you get a close-up of the lamp bracket assembly over the central ground floor window? or any detail in the fanlights above the doors?
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Spittalfield. ?
Skoosh.
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No - different altogether apart from the two doors
Steve
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I agree with Steve that it's not Spitalfields ... but add this link as it shows it rather differently, along with other streets that would have been familiar to my folks (and many other sugarbakers ;D ;D )
http://spitalfieldslife.com/2012/04/09/john-allin-artist/
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I love Spitalfields Life but haven't read it for a while. Thanks for reminding me about that sugarbakers. There is always something there which leads to further research, and a little sadness as they are still whtlling away at the character of the area and replacing it with huge glass and steel monstrosities despite the very active community opposing further 'development'.
But I think I am missing something - can you explain which image you are referring to please?
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But I think I am missing something - can you explain which image you are referring to please?
I think perhaps it is the images of the Great Synagogue which is now a mosque (Brick Lane perhaps?)
http://photos.wikimapia.org/p/00/00/94/39/08_big.jpg
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Sorry, Ruskie ... the third picture down is the synagogue that Skoosh was referring to in #79.
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But I think I am missing something - can you explain which image you are referring to please?
I think perhaps it is the images of the Great Synagogue which is now a mosque (Brick Lane perhaps?)
http://photos.wikimapia.org/p/00/00/94/39/08_big.jpg
Thanks sb.
Um, centre window and location of doors is different. Also Caz's building appears to be in a courtyard of sorts whereas this is on a corner. :-\
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Is it me, but there doesn't appear to be many photos of synagogues around… :(
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Must be a syn to take them. I'm agog at that
:-[ :'(
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Try :-
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ftx/
but don't get too hung up on synagogues, 'cause there are these as well
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01fty/
and
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01fu0/
just to mention a couple.
Regards
Malky
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Try :-
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ftx/
but don't get too hung up on synagogues, 'cause there are these as well
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01fty/
and
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01fu0/
just to mention a couple.
Regards
Malky
:o :o :o :o Good grief…there are tons (and some so close to quirky chapel. :P )
The only reason I've been focused on synagogues is because of the two door aspect, but you're right there is no real evidence to suggest it is.
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Must be a syn to take them. I'm agog at that
:-[ :'(
::) ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D ;D
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For what they are worth here are my thoughts. Bit of a ramble I'm afraid!!!
Such little real information to go on here. I would favour a non conformist chapel with school room/meeting room at the side. Many to choose Baptist, all the various Methodist groups, Congs, Presbyterians etc etc. Or how about Masonic?
Perhaps mid 1800s in an industrial or urban setting, all quite drab.
Materials not clear other than either cement dressings, pilasters and window casings (or stone) with either brick or finely dressed stone facings to external walls.
Gable wall not a true classical style pediment, there is no horizontal frieze or entablature.. the short cornice returns are integral with the raking cornice/capping to the gable wall top.
Is there any other detail eg on the lamp brackets or door fanlights to indicate symbols of identification.
There seem to be many variations on the style, 4, 5 or even six bays and semi ciecular headed windows, with one or two doors and pedimented gables, on buildings of the various denominations.
Hope this might bring a little more clarity to the search. :-\ :-\ :-\
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Not entirely happy with this ( and I should be getting to bed) but it has some similarities we can work with. Methodist 2 door 5 upper,3 lower windows and what looks to now be a plate above the rose
http://www.ddcwmethodists.btck.co.uk/CircuitChurches/DenbyDale
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Very close stylistically but too rural I think dg. :-\
I agree wit those who have suggested a city location for Caz's chapel. It does look a bit grim and dusty and grimy. If so it is a distinct possibility that such an unremarkable building no longer exists.
While looking for something else a day or two ago I came across a term which may be an appropriate search term for the buildings at right angle to the chapel, but stupidly I have forgotten it. :-[
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For what they are worth here are my thoughts. Bit of a ramble I'm afraid!!!
Such little real information to go on here. I would favour a non conformist chapel with school room/meeting room at the side. Many to choose Baptist, all the various Methodist groups, Congs, Presbyterians etc etc. Or how about Masonic?
Perhaps mid 1800s in an industrial or urban setting, all quite drab.
Materials not clear other than either cement dressings, pilasters and window casings (or stone) with either brick or finely dressed stone facings to external walls.
Gable wall not a true classical style pediment, there is no horizontal frieze or entablature.. the short cornice returns are integral with the raking cornice/capping to the gable wall top.
Is there any other detail eg on the lamp brackets or door fanlights to indicate symbols of identification.
There seem to be many variations on the style, 4, 5 or even six bays and semi ciecular headed windows, with one or two doors and pedimented gables, on buildings of the various denominations.
Hope this might bring a little more clarity to the search. :-\ :-\ :-\
Wow, that's an impressive analysis! 8) 8) 8) Thanks very much Jeff, I'm sure we can get some search criteria from everything you've described.
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It look's like a lantern on a bracket between the doors. Like the blue lanterns outside of police stations. Most online views of such seem to be of a square section but I often drive by an old police station that has a light of that shape outside.
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Just boosting this one so people know it's not yet located.
Caz
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I agree with others who think that this building is a town centre chapel. Sadly, because of dwindling congregations, many of these chapels have been demolished or sold on to be used for other purposes eg furniture warehouses, coffee shops, cinemas etc. if this is the case with this chapel it may look different now on the ground floor but I suspect the upper floor probably won't have changed much.
Chris
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Just been having another look around. The former Scottish Baptist Church (also noted as a Methodist Chapel) in Angle Street Burnley Lancs is the closest yet , but still no cigar. I wonder if the style is more common to the North west of England? Just another thought.
(Found on Places of Worship in Burnley-Wikipedia)
Now in use as a Mosque.
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The Burnley church was built c1867.
Here's another from the north west of a similar design i.e five bays and two entrance doors -built 1863. St Pauls Methodist Church at Alston. ( Photo from Historic England , Alston Moor, Cumbria)
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My data resets midnight tonight so I will be back able to post pics again!
Caz
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I think that out of all the suggestions,
this resembles a methodist chapel the most.
Definitely not the one we are looking for, but I found this online and just shows how much an old building of this style can be changed or modified.
this was also an old Methodist church
https://hertfordshirechurches.wordpress.com/2016/06/13/prospect-place-wesleyan-chapel-highfield-road-berkhamsted-former/
and another
https://hertfordshirechurches.wordpress.com/2017/09/24/primitive-methodist-church-west-street-ashwell/
shaun
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It has a lot in common with the Hope Congregational Church in Hanley, Staffs -- albeit without the bullseye window.
http://www.thepotteries.org/church/hanley/bethel/hope_congregational.jpg
(picture from the 1950s)
Mike
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I recently joined a local 'now and then' fb group and came across this. I haven't been able to find any other pictures but think this is correct.
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Good afternoon,
Which town are we looking at?
John915
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Yes! Yes! Yes!
You didn't actually say, but a quick search for West Parade Chapel has brought up the FB page, and it's in Wakefield.
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Brilliant!
Another one sorted.
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Back again,
A long time since one of these has come up. Does anyone have the list of unsolved ones. I can only remember 12 and 19, 12 is still in my gallery as I used to have a search now and then.
John915
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Back again,
A long time since one of these has come up. Does anyone have the list of unsolved ones. I can only remember 12 and 19, 12 is still in my gallery as I used to have a search now and then.
Ah yes, number 12. Happy days :-X
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I spent a fruitless afternoon chasing 12 a few weeks ago :(
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Some links to unsolved photos in these threads/posts:
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=820004.0
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=852299.msg7201550#msg7201550
Not sure if there are any more up to date lists - some of them have now been identified.