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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: TJP28Blue on Wednesday 15 July 15 18:06 BST (UK)
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Hello,
I am very new to RootsChat but I hope the experts out there can help me. I have searched all the sites I know for the birth references for William Bryder, born close to 1898 in the village of Tillington in West Sussex to William and Alice Kate Bryder. He is mentioned in the 1901 census and he fought and was killed in WW1. I would be grateful if anyone can tell me what I might try to find his birth reference.
Many thanks and regards,
TJP
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Hi
Welcome to rootschat
Could this be his birth registration
March qtr 1889
William Henry Bryder
Midhurst 2b 395
Midhurst RD covers Tillington
Sorry ignore that I am 10 years out ::)
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Welcome TJP from me too :)
I saw the 1889 one too but it seems much too early.
Oddly the likely marriage of the parents is as CARVER not BRYDER:
Marriage, Mar qtr 1897
John William J CARVER (matches paternal given names in 1901 census)
Alice Kate DANIELS
Midhurst reg district, vol 2b p587
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I saw the 1889 one too but it seems much too early.
I have deleted it, I was having a rush of blood to the head ;D
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Following on from the marriage, there's a birth of William Bryder CARVER, Dec qtr 1897 Midhurst.
(We all have days like that, Rosie ;D)
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Subsequent children born in Midhurst reg district:
Charles Bryder CARVER, Jun qtr 1899
Mary Bryder CARVER, Mar qtr 1901
Minnie Bryder CARVER, Sep qtr 1902
Percy Elliff B CARVER, Mar qtr 1905
Nelly Kathleen B CARVER, born & died Mar qtr 1907
Robert Bryder CARVER, Dec qtr 1908
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John William Joseph CARVER was baptised on 18 July 1869 at St Peter, Croydon, son of John Carpenter CARVER and Mary (nee BAKER, married Reigate 16 Apr 1859).
Something may have happened to the parents because, by 1871, 1 yr old John was in Tillington with William and Charlotte T BRYDER as their nephew. He can also be seen with them in 1891.
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Something may have happened to the parents
Oh dear.
John Carpenter CARVER was convicted of the murder of his wife Mary at Guildford Assizes on 8 August 1870, and sentenced to death.
There is more information available, but you may or may not want to know - just say if you want this explored further.
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Going back to William & Charlotte Bryder who may have brought up JWJ Carver - it looks as though Charlotte was nee Carver, sister of John Carpenter Carver. William & Charlotte married in Midhurst district in early 1860.
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The Luton Times and Advertiser - Saturday 01 October 1870 states that John Carpenter Carver was reprieved, and released.
The Sheffield Daily Telegraph - Thursday 01 September 1870 states he was given a free pardon.
Stan
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Bradford Daily Telegraph - Thursday 01 September 1870
Carver, the man who was recently found guilty of having murdered his wife at Croydon, has received a free pardon. His statement was that the stab which caused his wife's death was the result of an accident, and the circumstances of the case appeared to favour that view. The jury did not think so, but evidently the Judge who tried the case did.
Stan
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That's good news, Stan.
The widowed John Carver (upholsterer, b abt 1834 Lodsworth Sussex) can be found in Brighton in 1871 and appears to have formed a new family with a Mary Ann thereafter, settling in Stone, Dartford. He may have died in Dartford registration district in Mar qtr 1907, aged 73.
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Hello,
Thank you so much for all your replies. They have answered all my original queries and open some new lines of enquiry. No wonder I couldn't find William Bryder. I just don't know how you managed to find him amongst the Bryder Carvers!! It must have been shear inspiration. avm228 I would very much like to know more of the 'accident', but I don't think I will pass it on to the current family who still live in the area. Many thanks once again to everyone - you are truly experts in your field.
Kind regards,
TJP
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According to Manchester Evening News - Friday 27 May 1870 Carver and his wife were quarreling she 'flew' at him and fell on a knife he was holding in his hand, which entered her body an inch from the heart, and death must have been instantaneous.
Stan
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What a huge coincidence! Looking at newspaper reports, the couple lived at 35 South End, Croydon. My great x2 uncle, Eleazer Hayward lived at number 37 South End in 1861 and was still there in 1871, so would have known them!
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What a huge coincidence! Looking at newspaper reports, the couple lived at 35 South End, Croydon. My great x2 uncle, Eleazer Hayward lived at number 37 South End in 1861 and was still there in 1871, so would have known them!
How extraordinary! Have you seen a Mary Ann Morgan in the vicinity? She gave evidence at the trial, referred to as living next door to the accused.
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Two houses between them and my greatx2 uncle!
1871
RG10; Piece: 840; Folio: 116; Page: 49 South End Croydon
William Morgan 35 Carpenter/joiner
Mary Ann Morgan 34 General shopkeeper
William Morgan 11
George K Morgan 9
Albert E Morgan 7
Annie Morgan Morgan 5
Elizabeth Morgan 4
Mary A Morgan 1
Maria A Payne 18
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What a huge coincidence! Looking at newspaper reports, the couple lived at 35 South End, Croydon. My great x2 uncle, Eleazer Hayward lived at number 37 South End in 1861 and was still there in 1871, so would have known them!
That is amazing ;D
It just shows how valuable newspapers are to family history, even if it is about the neighbours.
Rosie